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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by rainbowbrite on February 19, 2005, at 16:54:34
I feel sort of ridiculous posting here becasue I can't let myself read any other posts. I guess I feel as Dinah, that the board is overwhelming as death is too close to home. But I have a question...I have lost many people and yet I still can not accept the deaths (wow this is hard). Is it ever possible to accept and/or be prepared for a death? I have a constant worry, for good reason that I will lose someone close to me soon. So I am trying to prepare. Any thoughts? does anyone have any thoughts on whether is is it unhealthy or cruel to try to forget people as a coping strategy?
Thank you
rain
Posted by TamaraJ on February 20, 2005, at 13:07:58
In reply to how to cope and accept?, posted by rainbowbrite on February 19, 2005, at 16:54:34
Hi Rain,
Don't feel ridiculous. I think grief and dealing with loss is hard enough and overwhelming enough to talk about at times, let alone to read about another's grief and try to understand what they are going through. You will know when you are ready, if ever, to read other posts. (If that makes any sense). I hope others respond. This is an important topic.
I am not very good at the grief thing. I internalize. But I guess I would have to ask (and I don't expect a written answer to me - I'm just giving you some things to think about) have you looked inside yourself for the reasons why you can't accept the deaths. Sometimes we have a hard time accepting someone's death because we felt powerless to prevent it (no matter what the cause), or we feel we have been cheated (someone was taken from us too soon and it's just not fair), or we have regrets of some kind about the state of the relationship before the person died (maybe we feel we had not sufficiently expressed our love and respect for the person, we felt we had taken the person for granted, or maybe we had said or done something to the person that we regret and wish we had the chance to take back and make amends, etc.).
Everybody is different in how they grieve. I don't really have an answer to your question about whether it is possible to accept death. I have seen a number of people I cared about deeply die in their prime (even earlier), and I know it can be hard to accept. But, I think it is possible to move beyond the pain and grief, in our own time, and move forward and live our lives after a loss. Can we ever be prepared for death? I would have to say - sometimes yes (I think). And when we have that opportunity then we should make sure that we make the most of the time we have with the person and make sure when they leave us that we are not faced with not only grieving their passing but also regretting anything left unsaid and undone to ensure the person knew how much they meant to us and how they touched our lives. Actually, it really is something, when I think about it, that we should be doing with all the important people in our lives, no matter what their state of health is. I don't think we ever forget a person, and I don't think we should or should try (if they meant something to us in life, then their memory should live on in death). And, maybe it is just me, but I think it might be unhealthy to just forget someone - to move on like they never existed (of course, there may well be very strong reasons why forgetting a person may be in our best interest or may be a form of self-preservation, I don't know). It is sort of (IMO) negating a part of our life. It's true that the person's passing leaves a hole in our lives, but erasing memories of that person and forgetting them leaves an even bigger hole I would think (but, again, I guess it would depend on the nature of the relationship). I hope what I have said makes some sense.
I am sorry that you are struggling with this right now. Please know that you are not alone.Take care of yourself Rain. My thoughts are with you.
Tamara
Posted by rainbowbrite on February 20, 2005, at 20:19:23
In reply to Re: how to cope and accept? » rainbowbrite, posted by TamaraJ on February 20, 2005, at 13:07:58
Hi Tamara,
well those questions kind of summed up how I think I feel. And they made me feel! yuck!
I guess I just don't want to have to feel the pain of losing them. when I try to erase than it doesn't hurt as much. I have always worried that I was doing something wrong in doing that, for the reasons you said.
I supose we are meant to feel pain, I often think that I could not surivive if particular people around me died becasue the hurt would take me down with them.
I am having a hard time with this right now and I really wish there was an easy answer. I am a baby when it comes to death and I am afraid of it.
I don't understand at all about death, I don't know what to believe in after someone dies. sorry I am really lost right now. It seems like everyone else that I see copes so well with loss and for me I am paralized by it. I want to prepare and be ready for losing someone, and that is a really depressing thought. Ill stop now
Thanks
rain
Posted by TamaraJ on February 20, 2005, at 20:36:16
In reply to Re: how to cope and accept? » TamaraJ, posted by rainbowbrite on February 20, 2005, at 20:19:23
I am so sorry Rain. I didn't mean for my questions to make you feel bad. Those are things I think about sometimes when faced with impending grief or a loss. My apologies.
You are certainly not alone. Nobody wants to feel the pain that comes with losing someone we love, and no, not everybody copes well with loss. It sounds to me like you don't want really to erase the person, you just want to erase the pain you feel after having lost the person. I think that is a normal part of the grieving process. There are stages of grief that we go through. I can't remember all of them, but I will try to find something for you to read that may reassure you that some of the feelings and thoughts that you think are *not normal* may actually be part of the grieving process. You know, this may be an issue that you may want to get into with your T as well, when you are comfortable, if you haven't already done so.
Don't be ashamed to talk about these things and ask questions. I am sure that these are questions that people have had since the beginning of time.
Take good care of yourself Rain.
Tamara
> Hi Tamara,
>
> well those questions kind of summed up how I think I feel. And they made me feel! yuck!
>
> I guess I just don't want to have to feel the pain of losing them. when I try to erase than it doesn't hurt as much. I have always worried that I was doing something wrong in doing that, for the reasons you said.
>
> I supose we are meant to feel pain, I often think that I could not surivive if particular people around me died becasue the hurt would take me down with them.
>
> I am having a hard time with this right now and I really wish there was an easy answer. I am a baby when it comes to death and I am afraid of it.
>
> I don't understand at all about death, I don't know what to believe in after someone dies. sorry I am really lost right now. It seems like everyone else that I see copes so well with loss and for me I am paralized by it. I want to prepare and be ready for losing someone, and that is a really depressing thought. Ill stop now
>
> Thanks
> rain
Posted by rainbowbrite on February 20, 2005, at 20:53:09
In reply to Re: how to cope and accept? » rainbowbrite, posted by TamaraJ on February 20, 2005, at 20:36:16
Oh Im sorry that came accross wrong, I was not upset that you said that. I just meant that it made me think how I don't normally. Does that make sense? Its good for me. I appretiate what you wrote.
I just feel so confused. And your right I don't want to erase the people, just the pain. I hate death so much! Im sure everyone does. To not fear the loss of someone means in a way that you have to always say nice things and never leave someone angry, thats really hard. Often I say things I don't really mean out of frustration and anger and recently I have been stressing about doing that. I think death is really getting to me. I hope this is a normal reaction. I feel like Im going through something that 5 year olds experience.
Thank you for being there for me
rain :)
Posted by TamaraJ on February 20, 2005, at 22:13:44
In reply to Re: how to cope and accept? » TamaraJ, posted by rainbowbrite on February 20, 2005, at 20:53:09
> I just feel so confused. And your right I don't want to erase the people, just the pain. I hate death so much! Im sure everyone does. To not fear the loss of someone means in a way that you have to always say nice things and never leave someone angry, thats really hard. Often I say things I don't really mean out of frustration and anger and recently I have been stressing about doing that.
-- Maybe it's just me, but I don't think it means that we should (or even can) walk around on eggshells trying to avoid never getting mad at the people we love. We are human after all, and anger and frustration are normal emotions in my mind. People are going to tick us off once in a while, no matter how much we love them, and we will say things that we regret. I have said (and say) things in anger that I regret. Perhaps what it comes down to is about being able to reflect on our relationships and know we always did our best to be loving, kind and respectful, and that the people in our lives know they are loved. And, we also need to be able to forgive ourselves for things said and done in the heat of the moment. You know, instead of dwelling on the negative moments in the relationship, focus on the positive aspects of the relationship. I don't know. Maybe that doesn't make any sense at all.
I think death is really getting to me. I hope this is a normal reaction. I feel like Im going through something that 5 year olds experience.
-- I think it is a normal reaction. We all go through the questioning phase. For me, I think it is a natural and necessary part of the life cycle (as difficult as it may be).
> Thank you for being there for me
-- Any time :-) Take care of you.
Tamara
Posted by rainbowbrite on February 21, 2005, at 1:59:01
In reply to Re: how to cope and accept? » rainbowbrite, posted by TamaraJ on February 20, 2005, at 22:13:44
>-- Maybe it's just me, but I don't think it means that we should (or even can) walk around on eggshells trying to avoid never getting mad at the people we love. We are human after all, and anger and frustration are normal emotions in my mind. People are going to tick us off once in a while, no matter how much we love them, and we will say things that we regret. I have said (and say) things in anger that I regret. Perhaps what it comes down to is about being able to reflect on our relationships and know we always did our best to be loving, kind and respectful, and that the people in our lives know they are loved. And, we also need to be able to forgive ourselves for things said and done in the heat of the moment. You know, instead of dwelling on the negative moments in the relationship, focus on the positive aspects of the relationship. I don't know. Maybe that doesn't make any sense at all.
that made sense. and yeah its impossible to be nice all the time. Ive actully been trying. Not an easy thing to do! I agree I think this is something i should talk to a T about, when I get that sorted out. Its a haunting feeling that is very uncomfortable.
I also think strengthening relationships a little more to make them less superficial and more real is a wise move for me. And letting them know how I feel about them.
> I think it is a normal reaction. We all go through the questioning phase. For me, I think it is a natural and necessary part of the life cycle (as difficult as it may be).
this makes me feel better, I have been feeling very abnormal becasue of this.
Tamara, your posts are always so insightful :)
Thanks
Posted by TamaraJ on February 21, 2005, at 11:57:09
In reply to Re: how to cope and accept? » TamaraJ, posted by rainbowbrite on February 21, 2005, at 1:59:01
Its a haunting feeling that is very uncomfortable.
-- I agree. I can be uncomfortable and haunting, particularly when there are no concrete answers to the questions we have. There is no right or wrong way to think, feel, act or cope. I guess it is a matter of "to each her/his own" when it comes to grieving. I think though, through discussion with others, we come to some kind of understanding, and do what is most therapeutic and beneficial for our own individual needs and circumstances.
>
> I also think strengthening relationships a little more to make them less superficial and more real is a wise move for me. And letting them know how I feel about them.-- Yes. But, IMHO, letting people know how you feel isn't just about the "I love you's" and the "you are important to me's", it is also (and, maybe more importantly) about the seemingly simple and inconsequential things we do that tell people we care. Sometimes it's about actions speaking louder than words perhaps. I have strong relationships with those around me who I care about, but I do have a strong, inherent tendency to close off at times. I am working on that.
> this makes me feel better, I have been feeling very abnormal becasue of this.-- I'll say it again - you are not abnormal by any means :-)
> Tamara, your posts are always so insightful :)-- Thanks. You are very kind. I thank you too. I have found this dialogue very helpful.
All the best to you, and take good care.Tamara
>
Posted by rainbowbrite on February 21, 2005, at 13:23:31
In reply to Re: how to cope and accept? » rainbowbrite, posted by TamaraJ on February 21, 2005, at 11:57:09
Actually I made some progress on this, even though it was an accident I actually read a post in here, I thought I was in pscyhology, but I handled it.
-- Yes. But, IMHO, letting people know how you feel isn't just about the "I love you's" and the "you are important to me's", it is also (and, maybe more importantly) about the seemingly simple and inconsequential things we do that tell people we care. Sometimes it's about actions speaking louder than words perhaps. I have strong relationships with those around me who I care about, but I do have a strong, inherent tendency to close off at times. I am working on that
Oh me too. I am really good at closing up. actions are good but what about all the horrible things you say to people in general. Or I should say in my life maybe 2 people? do actions take it back or do words, I guess when I think about it actions are stronger since words are over-used at times. btw im not a b**tch by any means I just get frustrated by certain people and say whats on my mind kind or not :(.-- I'll say it again - you are not abnormal by any means :-)
you sure?? :-) thanks
Posted by TamaraJ on February 21, 2005, at 14:25:34
In reply to Re: how to cope and accept? » TamaraJ, posted by rainbowbrite on February 21, 2005, at 13:23:31
> Actually I made some progress on this, even though it was an accident I actually read a post in here, I thought I was in pscyhology, but I handled it.
-- Good for you. Baby steps are good :-)
>
> Oh me too. I am really good at closing up. actions are good but what about all the horrible things you say to people in general. Or I should say in my life maybe 2 people? do actions take it back or do words, I guess when I think about it actions are stronger since words are over-used at times. btw im not a b**tch by any means I just get frustrated by certain people and say whats on my mind kind or not :(.-- I know you are not b*tchy :-) And, I am sure that the people in your life know that too. Sometimes our anger and frustration can be overwhelming and push us to the limit causing us to act out of character and say harsh and maybe hurtful things. I guess when you think about it, it hurts us as well because we beat ourselves up with negative self-talk afterwards. Although easier said than done, sometimes we just need to disengage and take a step back and out of the situation until we are calmer and can get our point across without being harsh and unkind. But it doesn't mean that one has to let go of directness and assertiveness.
>
> you sure?? :-) thanks-- Well, if you are abnormal then so am I :-) Ok, maybe not the best and most flattering indicator! Oh well, I will revel in my abnormality!
Take care.
Tamara
Posted by rainbowbrite on February 21, 2005, at 23:19:08
In reply to Re: how to cope and accept? » rainbowbrite, posted by TamaraJ on February 21, 2005, at 14:25:34
>sometimes we just need to disengage and take a step back and out of the situation until we are calmer and can get our point across without being harsh and unkind. But it doesn't mean that one has to let go of directness and assertiveness.
This is exactly whatI need to do in this situation! I know I do, its hard though. Unfortunatley I will never lose my assertiveness, soemtimes I wish I would. OR maybe just my anger.>-- Well, if you are abnormal then so am I :-) Ok, maybe not the best and most flattering indicator! Oh well, I will revel in my abnormality!
haha well you sound pretty normal so Ill take it as a compliment. But maybe abnormal is better, normal is no fun :)
Thanks
rain
Posted by TamaraJ on February 22, 2005, at 18:52:56
In reply to Re: how to cope and accept?, posted by rainbowbrite on February 21, 2005, at 23:19:08
As promised, here's one of many links that provides information on the stages of grief.
http://www.uiowa.edu/~ucs/griefloss.html
Take care.
Tamara
Posted by rainbowbrite on February 22, 2005, at 20:49:25
In reply to Rain, as promised » rainbowbrite, posted by TamaraJ on February 22, 2005, at 18:52:56
This is the end of the thread.
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