![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 15 to 39 of 39. Go back in thread:
Posted by Emme on July 4, 2003, at 9:04:43
In reply to Re: talked to friend briefly, posted by kara lynne on July 3, 2003, at 23:38:25
Hi. Okay. Today feels like it's starting out bad again. I've got to try to keep it contained somehow. My friend sent out a general e-mail to a number of people with an update on what he's been up to. At least I was on the list. But there was no response to the message I sent. I think he's choosing not do deal with it. You're right. He probably has his own issues too. Maybe it's not all me. Somehow I grew up with a big guilt complex over expression of anger. I wonder if my brothers feel the same way...they certainly express anger more.
All of this is a lot of emotional reaction over something relatively minor. My emotional reservoir is not well stocked.
Also, I tend to be extremely sensitive to what people say to me (or don't say), and how they say it. I just soak it up like a sponge and let it gnaw at my self esteem. And the bigger the conflict, the worse I'd feel of course. (Though in the past I didn't used to hurt myself.) I know I do it. But counseling hasn't gotten me to stop doing it yet. I guess I know what to talk about next time I see my therapist. Let's make a deal - we'll both try to give ourselves a break over the next difficult thing that happens. Thanks for the support and input.I hope you have a good 4th.
love, emme> Hi Emme,
> Yes, you make perfect sense. I also have a lot of conflict around the expression of anger. I really understand the impulse to go directly toself punishment after the expression of rage.
>
> When you don't respond to the first 20 people who are nasty, the 21st might understandably be shaky. But anger in response to a nasty person is a perfectly understandable response. I know those "unbalanced" responses that come from having suppressed them for so long. But consider that your friend might also have his own issues around anger--his reaction isn't necessarily an accurate guage from which to judge yourself so harshly.
>
> I certainly don't have any answers. It's easy for me to tell you to give yourself a break I would not offer myself. But I am trying.
>
> I'm so glad you're a little better today, and that you have good help available. Love, K.L.
>
>
Posted by Emme on July 4, 2003, at 9:08:41
In reply to Re: talked to friend briefly » kara lynne, posted by Emme on July 4, 2003, at 9:04:43
> I hope you have a good 4th.
> love, emmeUnless you're not in the U.S. I haven't been paying attention...Bad emme, bad emme.... ;)
Posted by noa on July 4, 2003, at 10:17:24
In reply to Re: talked to friend briefly » kara lynne, posted by Emme on July 4, 2003, at 9:04:43
Sounds like you are one of us--the 'flaming amygdala gang'. I recognize the instant panic that occurs in interactions with people when you feel overwhelmed with feelings, worried about having hurt them, or feeling hurt,etc. The trick is to try to get the thinking brain--the cortex--to talk to the reactive brain--which includes my 'favorite' part--the amygdala--to calm it down with reason and openness to the potential for solving problems thoughtfully.
It takes a lot of practice. I've gotten much better at it, but I still have my fight-or-flight moments big time (lately it is at work with my bully boss). When this happens, its total amygdala action--zoom--I flee. Thinking and reason are not in the room at all.
I guess what has changed over time for me is that I calm down quicker now. But I know what it is like to be totally flooded with feeling--it feels to me like reason and language are totally inaccessible and nothing will calm me down. When flooded with emotion, it can be overwhelming, which is I guess where the cutting comes in for you.
Can you find substitutes for cutting that would have similar physiological effects on your state of arousal? How about some sensory integration stuff--like brushing with those "cornbrushes" (not too hard though!). Sensory integration (ironically abreviated as SI same as self injury) uses deep touch. Dinah once mentioned another sensory integration technique that she uses sometimes--tightly wrapping oneself in a sheet or blanket.
Hope today is calmer for you!
Posted by kara lynne on July 4, 2003, at 13:40:30
In reply to Re: talked to friend briefly » kara lynne, posted by Emme on July 4, 2003, at 9:04:43
*Let's make a deal - we'll both try to give ourselves a break over the next difficult thing that happens. *
Sounds good to me Emme--ok, remember, we have a deal!!
In my family it was not the same for men as ait was for women; I was thinking that throughout our emails, so it's interesting that you bring it up. It was not the same in a lot of ways. Right now I'm just amazed at how unkind my father is being to me. It's as if he's punishing me for not being able to keep an abusive man around. It's very hard for me to come to terms with. *He* can sure be angry, but any show of mine invites instant rejection from him. Hey, he stopped talking to me the other day because I suggested he needed a shot of freon in his car air conditioner.
Anyway, remember our deal and keep posting. And yes I am in the US, but I hate the 4th of July; all I think about is how scared the animals get from the explosions (me being one of them, I guess). People do really stupid things and light dynamite in theaters and things like that. I try not to think about it too much.
Posted by fallsfall on July 4, 2003, at 14:20:52
In reply to Re: talked to friend briefly, posted by kara lynne on July 4, 2003, at 13:40:30
4th of July. I hate loud sudden noises. So I hate firecrackers, and balloons, and guns.
When I was little my family went to the local football field to watch the fireworks. I hated it. I sat through the whole show with my hands over my ears crying. Now that I've grown I still don't like fireworks, but I have kids so I needed to tolerate a certain amount. I eventually found that I could park my car away from the fireworks. We could still see them, but they weren't as loud, and you didn't feel them in your stomach. 2 of my 3 children came with me. The third went up close with his dad.
This year I am not planning to go at all.
P.S. The worst birthday party game: My best friend (and I) were probably 5. The game was to see how many balloons you could pop by sitting on them! I didn't play.
Posted by kara lynne on July 4, 2003, at 15:35:28
In reply to Re: 4th of July » kara lynne, posted by fallsfall on July 4, 2003, at 14:20:52
Oh God. Balloons popping! Just the thought that they *could* pop is enough to drive me crazy.
When I was younger my parents used to take my poor, scared dog and me to my grandmother's house (remote, quiet area) on the 4th of July to spend the night. I'd be there now if I could! I try to send prayers to the animals--so many dogs run away and are lost on the 4th of July.
Thank you so much for understanding.
Posted by kara lynne on July 4, 2003, at 15:36:56
In reply to Re: talked to friend briefly » Emme, posted by noa on July 4, 2003, at 10:17:24
Just makes me want to start a band: "Noa and the Flaming Amygdalas".
Posted by kara lynne on July 4, 2003, at 15:41:36
In reply to Re: 4th of July » kara lynne, posted by fallsfall on July 4, 2003, at 14:20:52
A friend of mine invited me up to Lake Arrowhead for the 4th of July. She said they do laser shows instead of fireworks due to the fire hazard. Now *that* sounds like a good idea to me!
Unfortunately I can't leave my cat; she's having such a difficult time adjusting to the move. Ironically she's deaf, and I think it adds to her hypersensitivity. Just what we need around here, some more hypersensivity! (I'm glad on days like these that she's deaf, however.)
Posted by fallsfall on July 4, 2003, at 17:09:32
In reply to fallsfalll---also..., posted by kara lynne on July 4, 2003, at 15:41:36
Laser Light show. That would be a great idea. You get the pretty without the bang.
I was thinking, hmmm if I were deaf I wouldn't hear the fireworks - but they reverberate in your stomach so I guess that's not a solution.
When I was growing up, my dog hid under a child-size table in my bedroom during thunderstorms. The fireworks weren't close to the house. I think my current dogs bark at the fireworks. One of the times I got the maddest was when a neighborhood kid was setting off fireworks on the street while my baby was trying to nap. Boy did he hear from me.
Posted by noa on July 4, 2003, at 17:41:32
In reply to Re: talked to friend briefly, posted by kara lynne on July 4, 2003, at 13:40:30
I HATE fireworks. I mean, they are pretty and all and I remember liking them when I was a kid, but now I hate them. It is the noise--the explosions, I think. And the crowds, too.
Posted by noa on July 4, 2003, at 17:42:54
In reply to Noa, posted by kara lynne on July 4, 2003, at 15:36:56
> Just makes me want to start a band: "Noa and the Flaming Amygdalas".
LOL! If only I were musical!!
Posted by noa on July 4, 2003, at 17:46:33
In reply to Re: fallsfalll---also... » kara lynne, posted by fallsfall on July 4, 2003, at 17:09:32
What is much worse than the organized fireworks is the random firecrackers people set off. Just now I was sitting here at my computer and I heard this faint whistling sound and I went into hyperalert thinking it was a firecracker outside. The organized stuff will sound like a thunderstorm, not too close, from here, but if people go and do their own fire cracker stuff, lord only knows how I'll deal with that.
Just in the news this week, there was a truck explosion--a truck filled with fireworks--and an explosion at a fireworks factory.
Posted by kara lynne on July 4, 2003, at 17:51:18
In reply to Re: firecrackers, posted by noa on July 4, 2003, at 17:46:33
Exactly. And the punk kids who do things like set off M80's (I forget if that's the right name) in movie theaters. That happened a couple of years ago to me 4th of July--when I thought I was escaping the chaos by sitting in a nice, calm movie theater. Really cute.
Posted by whiterabbit on July 4, 2003, at 22:09:25
In reply to Re: talked to friend briefly - Karya Lynne, posted by Emme on July 4, 2003, at 9:08:41
Both of my hospital admissions were involuntary and made on an emergency basis, so I had to start out at the top in the "high risk" category. At this level you're considered to be possibly violent or suicidal, so there are a lot of restrictions for your own safety. You wear hospital scrubs and slippers and you have no access to your possessions at first. You're confined to the ward, which usually consists of a dayroom with television & reading material, patient rooms, nurses station, private rooms for counseling, & someplace to eat & socialize. You do have free access to the telephone and visiting hours.
Even at this level you're not treated like a prisoner where everyone is subject to all the same rules. They start to ease up on restrictions as soon as they determine that it's safe to do so.
I was always treated with respect and remember on several occasions being genuinely touched by the kindness of a staff member. I saw only one person being forced into restraints after getting combative with an orderly, and they let him go again as soon as he settled down. Otherwise I saw no one being physically restrained in any way beyond confinement to the ward.At the hospital with the good psychiatric program there were two wards - one for high-risk patients and others who needed close supervision. Some patients appeared to be senile, psychotic or severely retarded - also harmless. I never felt threatened or offended by any of these patients who were pretty much out of touch with their surroundings. And there were plenty of other patients like myself, rational but overwhelmed by their emotional pain. I was admitted to this ward as a suicide risk for a short period of observation. I suppose my lab tests results from the emergency room showed a high blood alcohol content, as my nurse seemed aware that not only was I frightened out of my wits, I was also terribly hungover. After watching me pace for awhile, agitated and crying, she caught up with me in the hallway & asked when was the last time I had slept. It had been quite some time, and I hadn't slept really well for ages. She asked if I would like to have something that would help me calm down and get some rest.
Back in my room, the nurse brought me some pills in a cup & sat down next to my bed. She seemed very concerned about me. I took the pills and sighed, "Don't know why I'm bothering, nothing helps me sleep, I've tried everything you could..." Wham, I was out. I slept for quite awhile and woke up feeling better than I had for a very long time. I had been seriously sleep-deprived and completely exhausted.
If your psychiatrist admits you on a voluntary basis I don't believe you will have to worry about this level of restriction. You are there, after all, of your own accord. Obviously voluntary commitment is preferable before things get so bad that you end up being involuntarily committed - or dead. If you're worried, ask your psychiatrist what kind of restrictions you can expect after a voluntary admission.
Don't worry that they'll lock you up in there and not let you out for a long time. It's an understandable fear but unfounded. Inpatient care of any kind is horrendously expensive and each day you spend in the hospital must be justified to whomever is picking up the tab. The whole process of inpatient treatment is geared towards making you well enough as efficiently as possible so that you can go home. Aside from the prohibitive cost, there are patients waiting for your bed.
My first recommendation for finding a good hospital program is to make sure that the ward is segregated as I described. On my second admission to a different hospital (the other hospital was full), all the psychiatric patients were housed on the same floor and not separated. Both hospitals had 2-man rooms with private showers and seemed to assign roommates according to their general stability. But at the second hospital you had to share the dayroom and the rest of the ward with all patients. I found this to be really unpleasant. There were several elderly patients with Alzheimers and they made a huge racket, shouting the same thing over and over ALL day long. It was disconcerting and depressing for
everyone.At the "good" hospital I was assigned to a social worker/counselor type person in addition to the nurse. She was awesome, very kind and concerned.
She gave me her pager number & told me to call any time I needed to talk. After a day and a half on the restricted ward she recommended that I be moved and I thankfully graduated to the "other side".At the bad hospital program, there was group therapy but no individual counseling. This made a huge difference in my general impression of the hospital's treatment & care. The individual counseling added a personal touch that was definately lacking at the second hospital. While I was always assigned to a specific nurse at both places, them nurses stay pretty busy. They just don't have time to sit down & chat with you for more than a few minutes, while a therapist does -
that's her job. She assesses your mental condition & makes up a report for the doctor to refer to when he's deciding on your treatment plan. She's also a go-between: she has direct contact with the psychiatrist while the patient usually does not (aside from the usual 10 or 15 minute visit, just like on the outside).
I would definately recommend a treatment program that assigns you to an individual counselor, therapist or social worker.I had no problem with the restrictions myself. After a long stretch in the military, hospital restrictions seem mickey mouse and they didn't offend me. In fact, after a couple of days I kind of started to appreciate having someone else make all the decisions - being temporarily relieved of most everyday responsibilities is curiously liberating. No job, no housework, no kids, nobody to impress, no pressure, nowhere you have to go & nothing you have to do but concentrate on getting well. At the good hospital, my blood pressure was monitered a couple of times a day because of my hypertension. Even with medication, my bp usually hovers around the barely acceptable 140/90. I was astounded at the rate that my blood pressure fell while I was an in-patient. The nurse told me this wasn't unusual, as patients are relieved of most common stressors. Normally the most difficult decision you have to make is what kind of dessert to order with your meal.
While this all may sound incredibly boring, I don't remember getting too bored at the first hospital. Your whole day is organized with different activities - mealtimes, visiting hours, psychiatric evaluations by the therapist and doctors, group counseling and classes for patient education. (The classes weren't strictly mandatory, but otherwise you were confined to your room during classtime & I'm sure inattendence is not noted as progress.) I didn't mind participating - it was fascinating to hear stories from the other patients, & to learn that we were far from just "a pack of loonies". Two patients I remember in particular: the quiet woman who always carried her stuffed bear was an executive at a Fortune 500 company, and a medical resident whose boyfriend had managed to entice her into injecting heroin & she got hooked. I sat up with her one evening & held her hand while she cried - she HAD to clean up to continue her residency but she loved the guy who was still using. My heart ached for her. I hope she was able to break away from him and go on to fulfill
her dream of being a doctor.So there you go: more than you ever wanted to know about in-patient treatment. I really hope you consider a short stay at a good hospital with a reputable psychiatric program. Ask your psychiatrist to recommend a hospital where she has treatment privilages. A week or so in a really good program can be very therapeutic and a tremendous help in diagnosing your condition and planning the best medical treatment for you. It also helps to connect with the other patients who are struggling as you are with emotional pain.
It does make you realize that you're NOT strange,
NOT different, NOT unworthy, NOT alone...and not unloved.-Gracie
Posted by Emme on July 6, 2003, at 9:31:59
In reply to In-patient treatment (long and long) » Emme, posted by whiterabbit on July 4, 2003, at 22:09:25
Gracie,
Thanks for taking the time to post such a long and thoughtful reply. That helps me have an idea of what questions to ask.
Emme
Posted by Emme on July 6, 2003, at 9:53:45
In reply to Re: talked to friend briefly » Emme, posted by noa on July 4, 2003, at 10:17:24
> Sounds like you are one of us--the 'flaming amygdala gang'.Flaming Amygdala Gang. I like that. Almost as good as the informal group I was a member of - the Angry Whiners' Club. :)
Yeah, I definitely get to feeling a bit overwhelmed and feel kind of traumatized by really negative interactions. Especially if someone else comes at me with a very angry tone of voice or if I feel guilty (and it's probably often unnecessary guilt).
> I recognize the instant panic that occurs in interactions with people when you feel overwhelmed with feelings, worried about having hurt them, or feeling hurt,etc. The trick is to try to get the thinking brain--the cortex--to talk to the reactive brain--which includes my 'favorite' part--the amygdala--to calm it down with reason and openness to the potential for solving problems thoughtfully.
The only way I've been able to do that is with the help of whoever is available to talk about it, offer perspective, and calm me down. I'm not good at doing it for myself - yet. I need to be like a duck and let stormy stuff roll off my back.
> It takes a lot of practice. I've gotten much better at it, but I still have my fight-or-flight moments big time (lately it is at work with my bully boss). When this happens, its total amygdala action--zoom--I flee. Thinking and reason are not in the room at all.
Have you seen the book How to Deal with People You Can't Stand ..or is it Dealing with People you Can't Stand... Well, that's not helpful if I can't quite recall the title. But it's something like that. Anyway, if you can get your amygdala maybe halfway there, this book offers some good concrete stragegies for dealing with people like you boss, and it's a fun read to boot. I thought of it because he describes difficult people by personality type...."grenade", "tank", etc. and you describe your boss as a bully.
> I guess what has changed over time for me is that I calm down quicker now.That's good. It sounds like the self-talk is working for you.
> But I know what it is like to be totally flooded with feeling--it feels to me like reason and language are totally inaccessible and nothing will calm me down. When flooded with emotion, it can be overwhelming, which is I guess where the cutting comes in for you.
Overwheleming emotion *and* the need to punish myself if I feel guilty.
> Can you find substitutes for cutting that would have similar physiological effects on your state of arousal?I've found from time to time that causing some pain without breaking skin actually physically calms me a little - bizarre - and I normally have little tolerance for pain. That kind of thing doesn't do much for the guilt, but at least I feel a little less aroused.
> How about some sensory integration stuff--like brushing with those "cornbrushes" (not too hard though!). Sensory integration (ironically abreviated as SI same as self injury) uses deep touch. Dinah once mentioned another sensory integration technique that she uses sometimes--tightly wrapping oneself in a sheet or blanket.
I could experiment with some of these things. I haven't tried the ice cube thing yet, but I think I might.
Emme of the Flaming Amygdala
Posted by Emme on July 6, 2003, at 10:09:17
In reply to Re: talked to friend briefly, posted by kara lynne on July 4, 2003, at 13:40:30
> *Let's make a deal - we'll both try to give ourselves a break over the next difficult thing that happens. *
>
> Sounds good to me Emme--ok, remember, we have a deal!!You bet!
> In my family it was not the same for men as ait was for women; I was thinking that throughout our emails, so it's interesting that you bring it up. It was not the same in a lot of ways.
That's bad. I think in my family I'm not sure where gender fits in. My mother can certainly express anger. I'm not sure how my brothers feel about expressing their anger because I've never asked them. But I might ask one of them. He's got a bit of a temper on him, but he may or may not feel bad when he loses it. My dad doesn't overreact if I grouch at him a little once in a while. Mom gets much more hurt. But years ago my dad used to be something of a bully and he's really mellowed out.
> Right now I'm just amazed at how unkind my father is being to me. It's as if he's punishing me for not being able to keep an abusive man around. It's very hard for me to come to terms with. *He* can sure be angry, but any show of mine invites instant rejection from him. Hey, he stopped talking to me the other day because I suggested he needed a shot of freon in his car air conditioner.
Oh my gosh. That sounds dreadful. You deserve for him to have *your* best interests at heart and for him to treat you with respect. Has your father always been verbally abusive? It sounds like you know the score here, but if your father's treatment ever causes you to start to doubt or blame yourself, tell yourself: It's not me, it's him.
> Anyway, remember our deal and keep posting.You too. I haven't been reading all the threads, so I'm not completely up on things, but I do hope you're doing okay in your new place, that your exams went okay. I'll look around on the board to see what the situation is with your ex - I hope you get some peace soon.
Emme
Posted by kara lynne on July 6, 2003, at 14:24:13
In reply to Re: talked to friend briefly » kara lynne, posted by Emme on July 6, 2003, at 10:09:17
Hi Emme,
Good to hear from you. My father isn't so much verbally abusive as he is passive aggressive. He will just turn off and stop speaking to me and become very punishing with silence. He also gets very sarcastic.It's interesting because when I was telling him that we broke up I mentioned that my ex had said some things to me that were unforgiveable. He never asked me what they were, he just immediately said, "You should always forgive."
I think he really respected my ex (who didn't show much respect for me); they could relate on an intellectual level which is of foremost importance to my father. He has really sent me conflicting, crippling messages about my own abilities in life. I'm trying hard, but separating from a lifetime of negative enmeshment is no easy task.
Anyhow....hope you are doing well and let's talk again soon.
Posted by kara lynne on July 6, 2003, at 14:45:56
In reply to Re: talked to friend briefly, posted by kara lynne on July 6, 2003, at 14:24:13
...that he was pretty demeaning to my mother in front of all the kids while we were growing up. It became a form of bonding to mother-bash. My mother, while not a wonderful mother, certainly was not helped by this.
It's all so complicated because at a certain point he became guilty and I was then supposed to take care of my mother emotionally. Then I was punished for showing anger towards her--something that had been previously almost rewarded. I know he also resented his own mother like mad.
Early on I heard him making sexually demoralzing comments about women with my brothers. I remember going out to breakfast once with him and my two brothers. My brothers were laughing about the fact that they had both slept with a roommate I'd had in the psychiatric hospital (I was hospitalized when I was 15 years old for depression--for nine months.) My father also seemed to be in on the joke. I said it wasn't funny, that this particular girl had told me stories of sleeping with a knife under her pillow in case her molesting stepfather should come in her room.
So I got the message early about what women were good for. I know (although I'm not supposed to) that my father lost his virginity to a prostitute, although I'm told that wasn't unusual for the era.
Oh Emme, I've really gone off here, haven't I? I don't really have any point, but it all seems to swim around in there somewhere.
Thank you for letting me ramble on.
Posted by Emme on July 6, 2003, at 21:34:10
In reply to and I guess it's no small thing..., posted by kara lynne on July 6, 2003, at 14:45:56
Aw gee. You must be made of tough stuff to have survived. That's a pretty harsh environment you just described. What are you brothers like now - did they grow up and become better guys? Do you have much contact with them?
Between your ex and your father you have a lot of sh** being heaped upon you. Since your father is being unkind and unsupportive, is it possible for you to distance yourself from him and have minimal contact for a while?
Don't worry about rambling or having a point. Every now and then, stuff just needs to spill out... BTW, I can't recall if you mentioned what you are studying.
Emme
> ...that he was pretty demeaning to my mother in front of all the kids while we were growing up. It became a form of bonding to mother-bash. My mother, while not a wonderful mother, certainly was not helped by this.
>
> It's all so complicated because at a certain point he became guilty and I was then supposed to take care of my mother emotionally. Then I was punished for showing anger towards her--something that had been previously almost rewarded. I know he also resented his own mother like mad.
>
> Early on I heard him making sexually demoralzing comments about women with my brothers. I remember going out to breakfast once with him and my two brothers. My brothers were laughing about the fact that they had both slept with a roommate I'd had in the psychiatric hospital (I was hospitalized when I was 15 years old for depression--for nine months.) My father also seemed to be in on the joke. I said it wasn't funny, that this particular girl had told me stories of sleeping with a knife under her pillow in case her molesting stepfather should come in her room.
>
> So I got the message early about what women were good for. I know (although I'm not supposed to) that my father lost his virginity to a prostitute, although I'm told that wasn't unusual for the era.
>
> Oh Emme, I've really gone off here, haven't I? I don't really have any point, but it all seems to swim around in there somewhere.
>
> Thank you for letting me ramble on.
Posted by kara lynne on July 7, 2003, at 15:01:03
In reply to Re: and I guess it's no small thing... » kara lynne, posted by Emme on July 6, 2003, at 21:34:10
Hi Emme,
Yes, I'm trying to distance myself as much as possible. Unfortunately I'm still somewhat financially dependent on my father, especially at the moment. I'm ashamed to admit it, but hopefully that won't be forever. I also have so much guilt around them (isn't that supposed to be another form of anger turned inward?). I have guilt about the financial stuff and about not being a "good daughter"--not staying in touch, etc. But they've been so glaringly unsupportive right now it makes it a bit easier to be a bad daughter--i.e. take care of myself.I had to distance myself from my brothers greatly. One is a nauseating new age lawyer (now there's an oxymoron!)--the new age because he married a Swiss homeopathist and he tends to become whatever woman he's with. She's new agey, so he is. But it just covers up his narcissism and passive anger. He does his best to demolish me and has our entire lives--but I always look like the bad guy when I won't put up with it anymore. He claims to be so rejected by me and my family buys it, because I won't play the game with him any longer. As my therapist is fond of saying, "Never go to dinner where you are the main course."
My other brother had a severe drug addiction for many, many years. He has cleaned up, but really has no life and lives at home with my parents at 47. It's really sad. He has a wonderful, gentle soul and at one time was an artist and a musician. But he just gave everything up somewhere inside along the way.
Anyhow, enough about me!! How are you doing these days? What's going on with your therapist and the hospital prospect?
Thanks for listening again.
P.S. more about studies to come--
Posted by Emme on July 8, 2003, at 0:54:54
In reply to Re: and I guess it's no small thing..., posted by kara lynne on July 7, 2003, at 15:01:03
Hi Kara Lynne,
I'm having an insomnia kind of night. So I'm catching up on e-mail and the like. And my legs are getting eaten by something that slipped in through my screens...ah well, that's what after-bite is for.
> Yes, I'm trying to distance myself as much as possible. Unfortunately I'm still somewhat financially dependent on my father,
That's tough. No doubt about it.
> especially at the moment. I'm ashamed to admit it,
Don't be. Many of us have been there. My folks have helped me out here and there when I was in grad school, well beyond an age where I thought they should have to. And I knew others in the same situation. They'd take care of plane tix to see them, helped me buy a car when my old jalopy bit the dust, etc.
> but hopefully that won't be forever. I also have so much guilt around them (isn't that supposed to be another form of anger turned inward?). I have guilt about the financial stuff and about not being a "good daughter"--not staying in touch, etc. But they've been so glaringly unsupportive right now it makes it a bit easier to be a bad daughter--i.e. take care of myself.Okay, now, if they're being unsupportive, just repeat to yourself: It's not me, it's them. If they're not going to mellow and be more supportive, then you have the difficult task of trying to figure out how to manage a relationship with them that will enable you to take care of yourself. Easier said than done of course. :) And I can see where guilt would creep in.
> As my therapist is fond of saying, "Never go to dinner where you are the main course."
I like that!
> My other brother had a severe drug addiction for many, many years. He has cleaned up, but really has no life and lives at home with my parents at 47. It's really sad. He has a wonderful, gentle soul and at one time was an artist and a musician. But he just gave everything up somewhere inside along the way.That is too bad....
> Anyhow, enough about me!! How are you doing these days? What's going on with your therapist and the hospital prospect?
Well, after another bit of a setback last week, I seem to be at least holding together. I'm not in agony, and I can get a little done. So I think I will stay out of the hospital for the time being. It'll be about 3 weeks till the consultation/scond opinion with the person my pdoc recommended.
> Thanks for listening again.Don't mention it.
> P.S. more about studies to come--
Good.
Emme
Posted by Emme on July 9, 2003, at 22:33:42
In reply to Re: and I guess it's no small thing... » kara lynne, posted by Emme on July 8, 2003, at 0:54:54
Hi K.L. Just checking in to see how you are doing.
Emme
Posted by kara lynne on July 9, 2003, at 23:09:44
In reply to Kara Lynne? You there? , posted by Emme on July 9, 2003, at 22:33:42
Dear Emme,
Thank you so much for checking. I've been feeling so disconnected and alone.I'm not doing so well (posted below), but trying to get through. It's really difficult not to feel that I am abandon-able. That's what this means to me. I know it says more about him than me, but deep down it just feels like I'm unloveable, and leave-able. He certainly isn't fighting for me, that's for sure.
I'm really tired and it makes me more obsessive. I see my doctor next week, but there aren't too many things left to try at this point. Last week I tried Paxil XR, but I had so many nightmares...my *cat* started having nightmares sleeping next to me! Really--she would be fast asleep and jolt awake crying so plaintively until I petted her and she went back to sleep.
Anyway, thank you again for checking in. How are things going with you? Kara
Posted by Emme on July 10, 2003, at 7:23:26
In reply to Re: Kara Lynne? You there? , posted by kara lynne on July 9, 2003, at 23:09:44
> Dear Emme,
> Thank you so much for checking. I've been feeling so disconnected and alone.Ooh, sorry to hear that. Glad you started posting again.
> I'm not doing so well (posted below), but trying to get through. It's really difficult not to feel that I am abandon-able. That's what this means to me. I know it says more about him than me,
And just keep telling yourself that. Easier said than done, I know. But you're not abandonABLE. He's abandonING.
> but deep down it just feels like I'm unloveable, and leave-able. He certainly isn't fighting for me, that's for sure.
I don't mean to offend, and I hope you won't take this the wrong way, but it may be better that he's not fighting for you. Shows his true colors all the more. You don't need to be tempted to go back into a situation where you'll be hurt again and again.
> I'm really tired and it makes me more obsessive. I see my doctor next week, but there aren't too many things left to try at this point. Last week I tried Paxil XR, but I had so many nightmares...
I had really unpleasant nightmares last time I tried Paxil. Night after night. It started to wear on me. If the nightmares don't subside, then there's GOT to be another option. Every time my doctor says we're running out of options, she somehow comes up with a new one.
> Anyway, thank you again for checking in. How are things going with you?
Thanks for asking. I'm tired and wish my brain were sharper. But I'm holding together for the moment.
Emme
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