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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 17 of 17. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Susan J on March 13, 2004, at 12:49:49
OK, first off, this does NOT mean I'm going to kill myself.
But I have been absolutely OBSESSING about suicide for the past month now.
What does that mean? Life is EXTREMELY stressful for me right now, but I'm not falling apart sad right now. I'm not happy, but I know *me,* and I've been much worse than this.
I don't wanna think about killing myself....I don't get why it's consuming so much of my time...
Anyone else done this?
Susan
Posted by DaisyM on March 13, 2004, at 13:14:58
In reply to Obsessing about Suicide, posted by Susan J on March 13, 2004, at 12:49:49
Susan,
I have to say the first time I was where you are, I shocked the hell out of myself. I use to be the ultimate polyanna -- I ALWAYS found the silver lining and looked at the bright side.
And then...and then. I felt so trapped, couldn't see a way out and started to realize that I *did* ultimately have a way out. It was a really big, black hole to be in.
I finally confessed these thoughts to my Therapist. I was sure he'd be mad, or even, wouldn't want to work with me anymore. I posted about this a month or so ago on Psychological. He was great though, and we talked about what was really behind the thoughts, how this was part of depression and what to do with the thoughts when they came up. It made it better, less scary in some ways to have them. And he said he wouldn't want to stop working with me, in fact, he would insist on seeing me more. (big sigh of relief)
And talking about it took some of the intensity away. I still *know* I hold that card, and it still floors me to *know* this. But, I strongly suggest you talk to someone about your thoughts and what is driving them. I don't think it is unusual at all but still, you don't want to dismiss it.
I don't know if it helps to know you aren't alone in this. Oh, the other thing I found helpful was the book, "Undercurrents" because I saw myself in parts of the book and that was the first time I found how I was feeling so accurately articulated.
Be nice to yourself and keep posting.
Daisy
Posted by tinydancer on March 13, 2004, at 13:16:14
In reply to Obsessing about Suicide, posted by Susan J on March 13, 2004, at 12:49:49
Are you in therapy right now? This sounds like obsessive compulsive thinking to me. I think that its okay to be open about it. I also think that it is part of human nature to wonder and dwell upon suicide, and how one could do it and so on, without it meaning that one would ever actually do it. Just keep being open about what's on your mind and I also suggest reading the site which was pointed out a few posts above here-"Suicidal?Read this first" It might help you sort your thoughts a bit, it did for me. Sorry I can't be of more help Susan.
Posted by Susan J on March 13, 2004, at 13:21:41
In reply to Re: Obsessing about Suicide, posted by DaisyM on March 13, 2004, at 13:14:58
Thanks, that book looks really interesting. I'll try to pick it up today.
S.
Posted by Susan J on March 13, 2004, at 13:24:01
In reply to Re: Obsessing about Suicide » Susan J, posted by tinydancer on March 13, 2004, at 13:16:14
I was in therapy, for 2 years. I stopped going because I'm working 70-90 hours a week right now. I'm sure that's the stress causing the thoughts.
But it is interesting to think it's somehow related to OCD. My brother's got that, but I've never really had obsessive thoughts to the point they've really bothered me. But also this Wellbutrin is bringing out weird behavior/thoughts in me anyway.
I'll see if I can't get another appointment.
Thanks.
Susan
Posted by tinydancer on March 13, 2004, at 13:55:39
In reply to *Was* in therapy » tinydancer, posted by Susan J on March 13, 2004, at 13:24:01
I thought about the OCD connection due to the fact you said you couldn't stop thinking about it, even though you wanted to stop thinking about it. Perhaps that made it even worse? I have a lot of compulsive thoughts but that may be more my dx territory. You said that you have never had compulsive thoughts to the point they bothered you but the degree of the suicidal thinking makes me think otherwise. I'm glad you're getting an appointment! Keep us posted.
Posted by fallsfall on March 13, 2004, at 13:58:12
In reply to *Was* in therapy » tinydancer, posted by Susan J on March 13, 2004, at 13:24:01
I have found that suicidal thoughts have a purpose for me. My guess is that they have a purpose for you, too, but it could be a different purpose.
When I start thinking of killing (or hurting) myself it is usually because there is some stressor in my life that I feel is out of control. Suicidal (or para-suicidal) actions are something that I *can* control - so in that way thinking about them is comforting for me. In addition, when I tell my therapist about the feelings, then I know that I will have his attention - and he will know that something serious is going on.
I've started trying to be pre-emtive about this. When I feel things getting stressful, I try to talk about it. If I can get people to understand the issue when I talk about it then I don't have the "need" to resort to suicidal thoughts. It has taken many years to get to this place.
I would suggest that you make an appointment with the therapist you were seeing. The hour it takes to see her will be much less than that productivity that you are losing due to the stress and the thoughts.
Please take care of yourself.
P.S. As an ex-workaholic, I do feel the need to plea for a more balanced life for you... Substitute a couple of fun activities for some of those work hours...
Posted by octopusprime on March 13, 2004, at 16:08:43
In reply to Obsessing about Suicide, posted by Susan J on March 13, 2004, at 12:49:49
Susan J -
good to see you here, sorry you are having a rough time.
like you, i am having recurring suicidal thoughts, though they are more intermittent than yours. it's typically when i'm driving at night and i think about pulling the car into oncoming traffic. it's very strange and i think it is related to working too much (though not as much as you!)
many people at my office work similar hours to yours. people are getting edgy. i implore you to consider a vacation or a few days off.
all the best
ps - maybe it is time for a med change?
Posted by Jai Narayan on March 13, 2004, at 17:33:55
In reply to Re: Obsessing about Suicide » Susan J, posted by octopusprime on March 13, 2004, at 16:08:43
The lure of ending all the stress with one action. I have the feeling it's not so easy. I too have been seduced by the idea, feeling that my life is too much and ending all the stress could be very peacful.
I have been on the treadmill of what seems to be endless work that will just eat me up.
When I hear you say you are listening to that little voice that talks about sucide...well it makes my heart ache.
I can't bear to loose you.
I would miss you too much.
I know you are just entertaining the notion but honey, it's just a breath away.
Sucide is such a carnivourous beast.
It has such lure and glamor....
okay I have said enough.
Take a breath and see if there is another kind of thought that will take the place of the sucidal seduction.
A long life has it's benefits...I hope to be chatting with you when we are old and rocking in our rocking chairs, picking our teeth and scratching our arm pits.
I want to know who you are then too.
Posted by obSession on March 13, 2004, at 17:40:25
In reply to Oh Susan, posted by Jai Narayan on March 13, 2004, at 17:33:55
dont know if this is what u want to hear...but i was soooooooooooooo obsessed with suicide...would spends hrs fantasting about my funeral ect ect............it actually passes after a while it does , something may be bothering u and may be trying to distract u mind from it...i think that suicide is somewhat a fantasy for me at times which takes me out of my immediate environment and makes me feel that i dont have to be here if i dont want to.gives me that feeling of control!
Posted by Dinah on March 13, 2004, at 18:14:13
In reply to *Was* in therapy » tinydancer, posted by Susan J on March 13, 2004, at 13:24:01
Susan, I've always thought that my suicidal thoughts had an OCD component. Especially the recurring persistant ones. Some of my mental health professionals seem to agree, others don't.
But I can sort of tell an obsession. There's a "feel" to them. If you've got OCD, maybe you know what I mean. And suicidal obsessions in response to stress have that "feel".
You're working long enough hours that the stress has to be building up, and when it builds up it has to discharge somewhere. Why don't you try to make sure you can keep working by scheduling a therapy appointment to discharge some of that stress safely.
Posted by cubic_me on March 13, 2004, at 18:40:13
In reply to Obsessing about Suicide, posted by Susan J on March 13, 2004, at 12:49:49
I tend to get intrusive suicidal thoughts when I am stressed or have little time to think about myself. I think that they are my mind's way of telling me that things really aren't going so well and I should stop ignoring my problems. In that situation my suicidal thoughts tend to go along the line of 'i could jump out of that window' or 'i feel like shooting myself in the head/chest' etc, whereas when I have time to think about what I am feeling I think 'the pain is too much, I want to disappear' etc. I think that they are definately different types of suicidal ideation and I'd be interested in what you think when the thoughts come into your mind.
Posted by Elle2021 on March 14, 2004, at 3:20:53
In reply to Obsessing about Suicide, posted by Susan J on March 13, 2004, at 12:49:49
> Anyone else done this?
Yes, all the time. I would never actually go through with it, but it's a recurring thought that definitely dominates my thoughts. I think about it pretty frequently. I think it just comes from feeling so depressed. I'm glad you clarified that you aren't going to actually do it. I'd miss you. My T makes me fill out a short mood questionnaire every session and it asked "do you have thoughts of suicide?" "Do you feel like you want to die?" I say yes to the first one and no to the second one. I haven't figured out a way to quit obsessing about it, but if i do I'll let you know...and if you figure it out first, then do let me know won't you. Hope you feel better soon.
Elle
Posted by Elle2021 on March 14, 2004, at 3:25:02
In reply to Re: Obsessing about Suicide » Susan J, posted by Elle2021 on March 14, 2004, at 3:20:53
Dinah and CubicMe
That is pretty interesting how your suicidal thoughts have the obsessive feel to them. I know what you mean by "obsessive feel." Of course, you know that I have OCD, but my suicidal thoughts don't have that feel to them... They have more of the depressive feel. If you don't mind can you tell me about the way yours feel?
Elle
Posted by Susan J on March 14, 2004, at 11:51:34
In reply to Re: OCD and Suicidal Thoughts, posted by Elle2021 on March 14, 2004, at 3:25:02
Well, more and more I think this is just a byproduct of these horrendous work hours and lack of control I have over my own life right now.
Thank you for all the kinds words. I can't take any time off until mid-April, but I should be able to get a therapy appt. again.
It's just scary to not be able to stop thinking about it, ya know? And I'm not going to kill myself...I guess it's just with all the thinking about it, it makes me feel like I'm one step closer to saying, well, maybe doing that isn't so bad.....and that's *not* where I want to be right now. LIke one of my failsafes has been taken away. I'm not describing it very well....it's just scary to me, that's all.
Let's see what the therapist says....
Thanks again,
Susan
Posted by Dinah on March 14, 2004, at 15:22:30
In reply to Re: OCD and Suicidal Thoughts, posted by Elle2021 on March 14, 2004, at 3:25:02
I guess I've had both types. But the sort that I get when I'm stressed and anxious rather than depressed just have that OCD feel to it. I can only describe it in relation to a dog I have who used to seizure. The thoughts have the same "physical" sort of feel to them, like something in my brain has gone wrong.
When I'm depressed, the thoughts have depth. I might think about *why* I think I'd be better off not alive, or why my family would be better off, or hopeless feelings about why it would never get better.
The OCD seems just to be stuck thoughts. A lot shallower. Just repetitive images or thoughts. I think it might just be a stress discharge. The more I'm in my head, rational, working hard, not being in touch with myself, the more likely that sort of thought is to happen.
It's hard to explain.
Posted by shar on March 14, 2004, at 16:27:12
In reply to Thanks, Guys, posted by Susan J on March 14, 2004, at 11:51:34
Susan,
As your response (and the responses of others) suggest, suicidal thoughts IMO have a lot to do with feeling helpless about how life is going and having an out if the pain is too great.I don't mean helpless as in weak. I mean feeling the inability to control the input or stimuli or (when we were little) getting hurt. My suicidal ideation is pretty much related to being hurt, and treated badly at a time in my life where I truly could not control the outcome. I remember wishing I was dead when I was pre-school.
Alternately, suicide and those related thoughts gave me hope in a way, knowing I could 'get out' if things were too bad. Like an escape pod or safety hatch.
The previous advice is as much as I could offer. It might be a good idea, if you trust your T, to have a visit or two. And, changing whatever you can in your life to make things feel better (regardless of whether or not it makes OTHERS feel better) could help, too.
Best of luck,
Shar
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