![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 72. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 13:57:43
Sorry guys - one more trigger..
I am so emotionally tortured..and I keep getting into problems with men in my life.. with my fahter and with my husband.
And there is so much of immaturity on my part and their part.
My father thinks somehow that I need to live according to what he taught me .. And my husband thinks I should support him fully and leave all that my dad taught.
And wahtever I learnt till my 25 th year in life, I had to change everything to suit my husband.
And I have through a complete revamp of my ideas, what I want in life etc..
And I am so emotionally tortured. I have to figure out everything from scratch.
And my dad insisted almost every day on my life from childhood that I need to go to the US. And I came. But now my husband wants me to go back to India. And it is so terrifying to me.
I keep resisting my husband, and he gets very mad. He even shakes my head and pulls my hair. And today he was so angry and hit the bathroom door, and it broke a little. I haven't been physcially violent towards my husband for the past 3 yeras. But everytime there is an argument, he gets physically violent - not too much, but he pulls me forcefully, and pulls and shakes my hair.. and sometimes he has beaten me. It is not very bad, and I feel like maybe I kind of made him angry.
And to give him credit, his father has some health issues now, and he wants to go back. I am not able to go back to India peacefully.. I struggle emotionall so very much. And I am extremely conflicted. I try to give in to my husband's other demands as much as possible, but this one, I am so emotionally troubled to think of going back to India. I feel life is meaningless if I go back. Almost like a phobia or something.. I cry so much, and I get mad..
I feel like not having any man in my life anymore. I hurt myself too much with my ex T also..Somehow it never works out ok, and I think I am much better off with women in my life.
Posted by sunny10 on May 12, 2005, at 14:15:40
In reply to I think I have some serious issues **trigger**, posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 13:57:43
just one question.
Is it okay in India for men to disgrace themselves by resorting to physical violence? To act like an animal instead of a creature of higher intelligence? I know that Buddhism doesn't support this kind of behavior...
I ask because I know it's not okay in the USA...
How can you say he "has beaten" you, "but it wasn't that bad" ????
How bad does it have to be before it's "bad"??
I'm starting to feel that this "serious issue" you're having isn't really a problem with you, but with your husband. And it's not a problem of "re-thinking your life", it's a matter of trying to come to terms with something that is just not right. No wonder you're having problems coming to grips with that- you should never have to come to grips with that.
Are you okay???
Posted by Tamar on May 12, 2005, at 14:31:29
In reply to I think I have some serious issues **trigger**, posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 13:57:43
> Sorry guys - one more trigger..
> I am so emotionally tortured..and I keep getting into problems with men in my life.. with my fahter and with my husband.
> And there is so much of immaturity on my part and their part.
> My father thinks somehow that I need to live according to what he taught me .. And my husband thinks I should support him fully and leave all that my dad taught.
> And wahtever I learnt till my 25 th year in life, I had to change everything to suit my husband.
> And I have through a complete revamp of my ideas, what I want in life etc..What do *you* believe in? Do you agree with your father, or your husband, or neither? I don’t think you can really be happy unless you decide for yourself what you want in life. You just can’t ever live up to other people’s expectations.
> And I am so emotionally tortured. I have to figure out everything from scratch.
> And my dad insisted almost every day on my life from childhood that I need to go to the US. And I came. But now my husband wants me to go back to India. And it is so terrifying to me.This sounds like a very serious problem for you. I thought for a while that you were somewhat resigned to returning to India, or that you had agreed with your husband to go back just for a year and then return to the US. But it seems to be still unresolved, do you think?
> I keep resisting my husband, and he gets very mad. He even shakes my head and pulls my hair. And today he was so angry and hit the bathroom door, and it broke a little. I haven't been physcially violent towards my husband for the past 3 yeras. But everytime there is an argument, he gets physically violent - not too much, but he pulls me forcefully, and pulls and shakes my hair.. and sometimes he has beaten me. It is not very bad, and I feel like maybe I kind of made him angry.
ANY physical violence is too much, in my opinion. You should not have to live in fear of being attacked by your husband. Have you told your T about this violence?
> And to give him credit, his father has some health issues now, and he wants to go back. I am not able to go back to India peacefully.. I struggle emotionall so very much. And I am extremely conflicted. I try to give in to my husband's other demands as much as possible, but this one, I am so emotionally troubled to think of going back to India. I feel life is meaningless if I go back. Almost like a phobia or something.. I cry so much, and I get mad..
(((((pinkeye)))))
> I feel like not having any man in my life anymore. I hurt myself too much with my ex T also..Somehow it never works out ok, and I think I am much better off with women in my life.
Do you want to leave your husband? What would be the consequences if you left him and stayed in the US?
Posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 14:33:58
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger**, posted by sunny10 on May 12, 2005, at 14:15:40
Thanks Sunny
But he gets very angry, and I make him angry.
But today I asked him - if your mother made you angry, would you pull her hair and shake her head like this? And he said he would'nt. And apologized.
And he is a very good guy basically. I feel like I am the one doing all the bad things. And I am the one not able to live up to my promise of going back to India. And his father is really getting sick, and I feel it is my responsibility to let my husband take care of his father. I don't want to be a jerk and not let him do that. But I am finding it so very hard.
I somehow try to compromise - ask my husband to go first and I will stay here or 6 months there, 6 months here kind of arrangement.. but my hsuband isn't interested in any of it.
And I agreed to him before my marriage to go back.. that is what makes it bad for me.
But I agree about the physical violence. He gets upset about everything, and he gets really reall mad.. Once I said it is ok to have an affair (we were talking about someone else, not me), and he beat me. And then once I said something about his religious guru, he beat me, and once I said I wanted to go and meet some spriitual person who he didn't approve of, and he beat me for that, and tore my dress. And if I talk of getting a divorce he used to beat me. It has happened 10 - 15 times in the past 2 years.
And everytime I think it will stop, but it stops for a few months and he resorts to it again. I don't know really if I am making him like this..
Posted by rainbowbrite on May 12, 2005, at 14:50:23
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » sunny10, posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 14:33:58
Pinkeye you are in no way responsible for this!
you need to know that. no one is responsible for another persons agression. Please please dont give in to him. it makes me so sad to hear about waht you are going through. No one should experience this. Let him go and you stay, or do what you want. living your life according to someone else isnt fair to you.i hope you are ok
((pinkeye))
Posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 14:53:48
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » pinkeye, posted by Tamar on May 12, 2005, at 14:31:29
Thanks Tamar
>What do *you* believe in? Do you agree with your father, or your husband, or neither? I don’t think you can really be happy unless you decide for yourself what you want in life. You just can’t ever live up to other people’s expectations.
I don't know what I believe in. That is the problem. I really don't have any idea what I want to do in life or what I think is right to do. I all the time just believed what my fahter said, and I lived according to that. But now I am realizing that it was not at all correct. And my husband says completely different things. And I am really really confused.>ANY physical violence is too much, in my opinion. You should not have to live in fear of being attacked by your husband. Have you told your T about this violence?
Men in India usually atleast slap their wife or some minimal physical violence is there in almost all the families that I know of. So that is why I try to think it is normal to get little bit violent when you get so angry.
I keep accepting to my hsuband that I would go back. But then I become so agitated the next day. I keep trying to make up my mind and think of all the good things that I will get by going back to India... but I just seem impossible to really makie up my mind to go back. I have been working on this issue for the past 4 years even with my ex T. But I am not able to make up my mind. Taht is the problem. I think even if my father was sick, I probably may not go back. I am not sure, why I feel so strongly.. It is almost like it is out of my hands. I am fine with giving in lot of stuff for my husband, but when it comes to this, I beocme so depressed, and mad and angry and upset. And it is very torturing for me. I think I have some sort of emotional issue there.. It is not a simple decision of going back to my home country. I think somehow it triggers soemthing else for me.
I don't know about leaving my husband. He is a nice person basically. I am very affectionate towards him and take care of him and cook for him etc. But I don't have too much of emotional bond with him. It is possible that my issue with my father was affecting my relationship with my husband.
You know the worst thing is, I can understand things very well with my brain.. but emotionally it is all too much for me.
I feel I am so immature - I should never have married. I am not capable of dealing with one more person in my life. And one more family. I feel I am not capable of being a wife.
Posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 15:03:40
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » pinkeye, posted by rainbowbrite on May 12, 2005, at 14:50:23
thanks Rainbow.
I keep feeling I am responsible for it.. I am not able to grasp that I am not.
I dont want to hold my husband back. I have told him several options.. he can resign his job and go and be there, and I will take up a travelling job (my ex manager agreed to give me a job where I could travel once in 3 months to India), and I will keep going back and forth for a year..But I know I am responsible for the mess. I keep hurting myself with all men in my life, and it just cannot happen without something seriously wrong with me. There must be something horribly horribly wrong with me. And I have tried my best to find out and fix it, but it seems beyond my grasp. Somehow I am terribly messed up.
Posted by rainbowbrite on May 12, 2005, at 15:13:53
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » rainbowbrite, posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 15:03:40
you know what I think, I think there is nothing wrong with you besides the fact that you were maybe not exposed to the best role models. How can we have healthy rea;ltionships when we are not exposed to them...it is so frustrating.
and you may not have made the best decisions in your life? i dont know, but Im sure you have not made a huge mess of things and besides I believe it always takes 2 when it comes to relationships.
If you look deep down inseide yourself for answers and use your gut you may have more than you think you do. How content are you in this marriage? I know it is so hard, I hate making decisions more than anything. Have you tried couples therapy?
I just can not emphasize enough how it is not ok to physically hurt another person. It seems like your husband was receptive to what you said about hitting his mother, maybe that approach is a good one to try to help him see what he is doing is so wrong.Take care of yourself
Posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 15:28:22
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » pinkeye, posted by rainbowbrite on May 12, 2005, at 15:13:53
Thank you.
We have tried couples thearpy about 3 years back for the same issue wiht my exT. I agreed to go back to India with him, but then my hsuband changed his mind, and wanted to be here as well. So it became a non issue for us. But my hsuband got into several problems himself, and I was struggling with that. Now my husband wouldn't come to couple therapy (I have asekd, and he makes fun of therapists. He doesn't like them anymore).
I get very hurt in my relationship with men. My father, my husband. For that matter even my exT. I got so hurt, and I know for 100% sure, he is a good person, and he didn't have any intention of hurting me. Even if my father and my husband had not been that great, I know my ex T was very good. But I got hurt myself with him also.
You know what I actually feel, I am not fit to have a good relationship with any man. That is what I really believe. Either they abuse me or treat me like a doormat, or if they are good, then they don't like me. IT is hugely messed up.
Posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 15:30:27
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » rainbowbrite, posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 15:28:22
I think I should really stay by myself. I think I should get a divorce and just stay by myself. I don't think I ever want any relationship with anybody. I have had enough.
Posted by anastasia56 on May 12, 2005, at 15:31:49
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » pinkeye, posted by rainbowbrite on May 12, 2005, at 15:13:53
the common thread in all your posts pinkeye is
you blaming yourself alot.No matter what the situation doesn't that seem lopsided? No one is ever that wrong or bad.
you couldn't have known how you would feel about going back to India when you made that promise years ago.
i echo everything everyone has said to you here. As my mother used to say "If everyone were jumping off the Empire State Building would you do it too?" Just because most families in India experience some violence towards wives does not make it right. Just because most wives in India feel it is their duty to follow their husbands directives, does not make it right. You are your own person with a right to a future that will make you happy.
ana
Posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 15:44:36
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger**, posted by anastasia56 on May 12, 2005, at 15:31:49
The thing is I think somehow I can fix it.. Somehow if I were better or somehow changed my attitude or somehow please my hsuband little more, maybe he would have been more affectionate towards me. Maybe he wouldn't have gotten into all that cult thing. Maybe he would have been more considerate towards me.
I really feel people kind of get what they deserve.. and if I am getting bad things in life, it is because I deserve it. Maybe it is what is taught in my religion.
And I felt guilty about liking my ex T also.. somehow I feel I don't deserve to be treated with respect, becuase I liked someone outside of marriage.
And even with my fahter, I alwasy thought somehow if I changed myself, he would like me or not scold me or not scold my mom.
My new T also says the same thing that you guys do.. that somehow I always manage to blame myself .. and she thinks it is a huge issue for me with my dad. My dad always used to say take responsibility and don't blame circumstances or others. And she thinks my problem with men is because of my getting really abused by my dad. She thinks what my dad is really serious - and that it has really damaged me.
Maybe I am just irrevocably damaged..
Posted by Dinah on May 12, 2005, at 16:02:56
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » anastasia56, posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 15:44:36
It would be nice if we had the power to control other people's reactions. Kids especially like to think that if they're good enough, they'll be treated better, because they have no real power to leave or to make things better, so their only power is the illusory power they give themselves.
But no one has that kind of power. Your husband thinks it's ok to hurt someone he supposedly loves when he gets frustrated. Maybe it's cultural, maybe he's just never had to learn differently.
You have no power over him.
You have power over your own life. You can decide what you want for yourself, and more importantly for the kids you might have. I wouldn't want any daughter of mine growing up thinking it's her destiny to be beaten, as long as it's not too "bad".
Most of us here are a bit broken. But it doesn't have to be irrevocable unless you choose it to be. If you throw up your hands and say nothing will ever change, guess what? Nothing will ever change.
It's totally up to you.
I always hate that.
Posted by PM80 on May 12, 2005, at 16:10:59
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » anastasia56, posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 15:44:36
STOP blaming yourself. You keep going in circles with the end and the beginning being that it is your fault somehow. Your feelings are just as valid as your father's or your husband's. Stop thinking that they are not. That is stinkin'-thinkin' as my T would say.
Try, just for the hell of it, to think about the facts without putting blame on anyone. Think about how you feel about things without worrying about whether that feeling is right or wrong. It simply is. Your feelings exist and it's okay. I'm not lying. You do not have to be able to explain your feelings or why you have them. Let yourself listen to you and don't feel bad about it. It is what is. Honestly, this helps me when I'm trying to figure out how I feel about things.
Posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 16:22:19
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » pinkeye, posted by Dinah on May 12, 2005, at 16:02:56
thank you.
I am not able to reply too much anymore. I just so hate myself..
I am no good. I was kidding myself when I wanted my ex T to like me.. no wonder he said there is no question of liking me.. he must have understood how crappy I really am.
I really don't feel like doing too much of anything anymore.. not even try to live well. I have got my first under performance review in this past 3 months. I have never gotten an under performance so far. My manager was asking me waht is wrong with me.. that I used to do things so well, and now I am just not doing anything.
I just want to go someplace where there is no one.. and I will live by myself. this is all too much for me.
Posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 16:23:05
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » pinkeye, posted by PM80 on May 12, 2005, at 16:10:59
Posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 16:24:39
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » pinkeye, posted by PM80 on May 12, 2005, at 16:10:59
thank you PM80. I am not so well now.. Not able to reply too much now. but thanks.
Posted by Dinah on May 12, 2005, at 16:29:51
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » Dinah, posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 16:22:19
I'm sorry, Pinkeye. I hate to be evaluated negatively at work. It just sends me reeling.
You're going through some rough times with some rough decisions. You aren't awful, you're overwhelmed.
Deep breaths now. One bad review does not a bad person make (thank heavens). It feels rotten, but it doesn't make you a rotten person.
Posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 16:35:40
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » pinkeye, posted by Dinah on May 12, 2005, at 16:29:51
yeah.. and I am not able to concentrate at work or learn things too much.
I have always had above expectation or meeting expectation. This was the first time they said I was not able to meet the regular expectations. It is not too bad, and anyway I am planning to resign after couple of months - to go back to India if I have to. Or will take up a travelling job. Anyway, this week is my fifth year in my company anniversary. And it feels bad to not be able to leave the company finally wiht good review.
Posted by JenStar on May 12, 2005, at 16:43:36
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » Tamar, posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 14:53:48
hi pinkeye,
I too am troubled that your husband hits you and pulls your hair. That is completey unacceptable, or should be, to you! You do NOT deserve that.Can I ask a personal question? Did you marry for love, or was it an arranged marriage? Was your husband respectful when you first got married?
Would it be possible to divorce and live here alone in the USA? It sounds like you're very far off from making a decision like that, but I was wondering from a legal residence standpoint if you could even do it.
Also, it doesn't mean that YOU'RE the immmature one if your husband beats you or treats you poorly. HE is the immature one, the one with the problem.
I'm thinking of you! take care of yourself.
JenStar
Posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 16:59:52
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » pinkeye, posted by JenStar on May 12, 2005, at 16:43:36
I think I feel so worthless, and not deserving.. and not good and cannot be loved or respected. I don't know why I feel that. But that is the way I feel.
I am realizing more and more.. I feel totally not worthy of being treated with respect, or loved. Atleast by men. With women, I am fine.
Somehow I think I behave like a child still with men.. somehow I think it is ok for them to kind of spank me or teach me, or things like that. I have felt that way towards most men in my life.. infact almost all of them.I can stay here if I want to. I do have a Green Card. but I think I am not capable of staying alone or finding someone again and remarrying. I mean, emotionally, I am way too weak to do all that.
Posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 17:04:21
In reply to Re: I think I have some serious issues **trigger** » JenStar, posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 16:59:52
How do you guys feel about yourselves? Do you like yourself? Do you think yourself as a good woman basically?
How do you guys relate to men in your life? Do you get beaten? Or kind of illtreated?
I find that in spite of trying so hard, I always end up getting not respected..or liked really and myabe there is some real issue with me.
My new Ts theory is that it was all my father's upbringing.. He kind of managed to treat me like a child for a long time, and treat me like a wife, and treat me like a pseudo adult and gave me kind of pseudo independance. He would always say you can do what you want, but I always knew that I had to do things the way he wanted it. And my husband is like that very much. He keeps saying that I have full freedom, but he won't tolerate even if I deviate slightly from what he wants.
Do you guys get to do what you want?
Posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 17:22:54
In reply to Can I ask you all something? **trigger**, posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 17:04:21
And what do you guys feel about being a woman? I have serious issues around it.. possibly caused by my father's confusing treatment of me for several years.. he treated me like a tom boy, like a child, like a wife, like a man.. and he has caused me so much of confusion.. he has said things like men won't like you if you are smart, and at the same time telling me men will like me if I am smart.
And in my culture it was not a common thing for woman to be career oriented and work and everything.. especially in my family circle and in my town. most of my cousins didn't finish their degrees and most of them got married by 20 or something to a guy their parents chose. I was always the odd one out.. I used to study pretty well, and was constantly teased by all my cousins. They used to say if I am so brainy, no guy will ever like me. And I had huge issues even to go to engineering college. lot of my relatives said who will ever marry you if you do engineering and study so well? And my cousins always told me I was like a man. because I was so geeky.
And to top it all, I was extremely fat when I was young - was about 200 pounds. and my paretns used to make me wear so loose clothes, and there was like no shape.. and many days, I never felt like an attractive person for several years. only after I came to college, I started realizing there were other girls who were like me.
My dad caused me so much of conflict in my sexuality.. and I feel to be a good woman means to not work, and to stay at home, and to listen to whatever your husband says (possibly influenced by my culture)..But I do work - in fact I am in one of the best companies in the world, and I have a very highly challenging career. But it adds a lot to the conflict of wehther I am a good woman or not. And my hsuband follows a cult, where they say good woman don't work. And it only adds to the conflict so very much.
And I think perhaps one of the reasons I put up so much with men is because I somehow feel like I am not a good woman basically. And I feel actually if I protest against my hsuband and leave him etc, or stand up to my rights, then I am not a woman kind of thing. But sometimes I jsut take too much, and become extremely angry at my husband.. but that is mostly if I lose complete control.
Do you guys understand what I am talking about? Can some of you shed some light into what you think?
Posted by Dinah on May 12, 2005, at 17:41:57
In reply to Can I ask you all something? **trigger**, posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 17:04:21
Well, we mainly come from Western culture where achievement is prized as much for women as for men.
I don't think of myself as a woman at all. But I do consider myself a good enough person. Moreover I think that all people deserve basic common decency and respect merely because they *are* human. They don't have to earn the basics.
So it has never occurred to me to be with anyone who didn't treat me with respect. It is such a basic requirement that I don't even think about it. I also insist upon it for my son from my husband. More than lack of abuse, I also insist that he treat him with the respect he deserves, regardless of his age.
Actually, while my husband has never ever raised a hand to either of us, I don't think he meets my standards on the issue of respect. So I keep insisting that both of us be treated respectfully, but I don't always get that. It doesn't keep me from thinking I deserve it.
So I separate the two topics. Everyone deserves basic respect, especially from those who love them.
As a separate issue, I have decent self respect and reasonably accurate self esteem. I acknowledge that I am good at some things, and not so good at others. I know I'm smart, and that I'm not attractive. Like most people in the universe I'm a bit of good and a bit of bad.
But I'm not sure I can personally understand how important it is for you to be seen as a good "woman". I tend to see things in a gender neutral way.
Posted by pinkeye on May 12, 2005, at 18:32:58
In reply to Re: Can I ask you all something? **trigger** » pinkeye, posted by Dinah on May 12, 2005, at 17:41:57
hmm.. I understand..
But I think it is very important for me to a good "woman" - even perhaps more than being a good person and treated with respect as a person. Possibly because that is what I lacked the most.
And I have this notion, that you have to earn respect. That becuase you are a human - you may not be given respect.. I had to earn it all the time as a child - if I didn't do well, I wouldn't get respect, and I would get scolded at. My fahter has pounded on me so many times again and again and again if I lack in something - if I didn't learn english, or if I didn't read news etc. I was constantly terrorized about soemthing or the other in my life always. And my mother was too. Perhaps it is all because of that. I know I am blaming my fahter too much tehse past few weeks, but I want to understand exactly what happened.. otherwise, I keep blaming myself for everything.
My T says it was possibly because of the constant abuse I had that I had grown very uncomfortable with the concept of being a woman. She says I just resisted it, because I was not comfortable with my dad treating me like a wife. She says I grew very uncomfortable with my body because of it..and that is why I have these very basic doubts. She says it is common for kids who are kind of abused to have these doubts.
Go forward in thread:
Psycho-Babble Psychology | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.