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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 2 to 26 of 26. Go back in thread:
Posted by Miss Honeychurch on February 15, 2005, at 15:07:58
In reply to T and Valentine's Day, posted by LittleGirlLost on February 15, 2005, at 15:02:30
You are not alone! I thought about what my T was doing all day, hoping he was by himself and not having ANY fun!
Posted by LittleGirlLost on February 15, 2005, at 15:14:48
In reply to Re: T and Valentine's Day, posted by Miss Honeychurch on February 15, 2005, at 15:07:58
lol.... the problem is that the day is over, and I am STILL thinking about it! ugggh
Posted by Speaker on February 15, 2005, at 15:23:27
In reply to Re: T and Valentine's Day, posted by LittleGirlLost on February 15, 2005, at 15:14:48
I asked what fun thing he did for V Day and he said the funniest thing was he overheard a man picking up flower say: Oh no, I have to have a vase, the flowers don't count without a vase :).
He kind of sidestepped it but it brought a smile so it was OK.
Posted by pegasus on February 15, 2005, at 17:05:06
In reply to I Asked :), posted by Speaker on February 15, 2005, at 15:23:27
But you know that he probably picked up some flowers too, right? Unless he heard that at the grocery store or something.
Posted by LG04 on February 17, 2005, at 1:48:50
In reply to T and Valentine's Day, posted by LittleGirlLost on February 15, 2005, at 15:02:30
my therapist lives in another country so she doesn't celebrate valentine's day but she's right now on vacation with her husband and i was absolutely eaten alive by jealousy these past two weeks, knowing she was going away alone with him. it was so hard for me to tell her about it but i did. i can't stand that her husband gets to spend all this intimate time with her.
i'm even jealous of their sexual relationship, even though i am not sexually attracted to my T. it's just that he gets to know her in an intimate way that i will never see. it's the emotional intimacy that they share in being sexual with each other that makes me so jealous. I hate these feelings. they are so painful. we talked about where they come from (most of it is related to my parents' relationship and what i felt and wanted from them) but probably there's a little bit that is the adult me who just wishes i could have more time with her and be THE most important and special person in her life as i assume her husband is. (though she says she doesn't look at relationships in that way...that each one is unique and different...but give me a break, obviously her husband is more important and special to her than any of her clients).
anyway talking to her about the jealousy does help.
it's interesting that now that she has left for the vacation, i don't really feel it. it was all in anticipation of her leaving for vacation. i don't know what that means. i'll have to ask her when she returns.
just know that you are definitely not alone on this one.
LG04
Posted by LittleGirlLost on February 18, 2005, at 12:37:16
In reply to Re: T and Valentine's Day » LittleGirlLost, posted by LG04 on February 17, 2005, at 1:48:50
> just know that you are definitely not alone on this one.
>LG04,
Thank you so much for sharing that with me. I am so embarrassed to say I feel the same way. I am jealous of her husband and everyone else who knows her. I am jealous of their sexual relationship, but like you said, not about the sex, but about the emotional closeness. What can be more emotionally close than that!? But at the same time, there is a part of me that also feels scared about her having sex with him. I'm afraid he is going to hurt her, and I don't want anyone to hurt MY THERAPIST! I try to tell myself that they are married and it's different... actually I can't think about that for long. It's mainly the emotional closeness of sex.
So you have talked to your T about this? That's awesome! How did she react? I'm afraid to tell her this... not even the sex part, but just the whole jealousy!
LGL
Posted by LG04 on February 18, 2005, at 23:36:29
In reply to Re: T and Valentine's Day » LG04, posted by LittleGirlLost on February 18, 2005, at 12:37:16
hi, it's also validating for me that you feel the same way!
and for me too, part of it is my fear that her husband will hurt her! i made her promise that he is nice and safe and nothing will happen to her!it was hard for me to tell her. i felt these feelings for over a year (not at all times, it would come up at different times) and never told her until now. what a relief. she was great about it. she understood immediately that it's not about her, that it's transference. i asked her if she thinks differently of me now, is it awful what i feel, if we could still hug after sessions, etc., and she was as reassuring as can be. she said everything i am feeling is normal for what happened to me. that any "little girl" in my situation would feel similarly.
were you sexually abused? i was, by my father, so my fear that her husband will hurt her (i.e. my dad will hurt my mom) makes total sense.
and i was so emotionally starved by my mom, i desperately wanted her attention, all of it. and she was so symbiotic with me that i "learned" that people belong to each other. (my dad abusing me taught me this too). so i wanted my mom all to myself, i thought that's how relationships are. we don't share people.
and lots more. it's so complicated. but all very normal for the way i was raised, and i am simply projecting/transferring this all onto my therapist.
i don't know if any of this resonates with you. i'm interested to hear. but what i can say is that jealousy is such a sucky feeling. i really have a hard time dealing with jealousy. i am not normally a jealous kind of person. and this jealousy goes so deep, it's like a knife in my heart.
she went on vacation this week and some of the jealousy has subsided, but i am afraid that next time we talk, it will come back in full force. i just have to keep remembering it's about my mom, and not her, and do whatever grieving and working thru i need to do.
i think therapists are used to clients feeling jealous of their relationships with others. i bet your therapist would be fine with it.
let me know,
LG04
Posted by LittleGirlLost on February 23, 2005, at 14:45:48
In reply to Re: T and Valentine's Day » LittleGirlLost, posted by LG04 on February 18, 2005, at 23:36:29
> hi, it's also validating for me that you feel the same way!
I totally agree! And I apologize for taking so long to respond - been sick with the flu. :(
> and for me too, part of it is my fear that her husband will hurt her! i made her promise that he is nice and safe and nothing will happen to her!
Wow you actually did that?! Cool. I'm afraid to say anything like that to her. I think I'm embarrassed to talk about sex to begin with, but given the fact that I'm focusing on HER sex life, doesn't that seem a little weird?
> what a relief. she was great about it. she understood immediately that it's not about her, that it's transference. i asked her if she thinks differently of me now, is it awful what i feel, if we could still hug after sessions, etc., and she was as reassuring as can be. she said everything i am feeling is normal for what happened to me. that any "little girl" in my situation would feel similarly.awww that's wonderful that she handled it so well! I guess for me I wasn't sure how to relate it to transference. Actually I'm still confused.
> were you sexually abused? i was, by my father, so my fear that her husband will hurt her (i.e. my dad will hurt my mom) makes total sense.
Ugh! I've never actually admitted this yet, but I guess I was. I have very little memory, but everything else fits into place. Aha! Now that struck a chord with me.... your fear that her husband will hurt her (dad hurting mom) makes complete sense to me. So am I projecting my feelings on to her?
> and i was so emotionally starved by my mom, i desperately wanted her attention, all of it. and she was so symbiotic with me that i "learned" that people belong to each other. (my dad abusing me taught me this too). so i wanted my mom all to myself, i thought that's how relationships are. we don't share people.I'm sorry you experienced this... Not sure I can relate though. I always felt that my mother never cared about me.
> I'm interested to hear. but what i can say is that jealousy is such a sucky feeling. i really have a hard time dealing with jealousy. i am not normally a jealous kind of person. and this jealousy goes so deep, it's like a knife in my heart.I know what you mean. I'm not a jealous person either which is one of the reasons I'm even embarrassed to bring this up. For me it seems like such an ugly quality. And what an awful feeling it is.
> i think therapists are used to clients feeling jealous of their relationships with others. i bet your therapist would be fine with it.On some level I know you are right. My therapist is quite experienced and extremely knowledgeable. I think it's more my embarrassment and fear of looking "bad" that gets in the way. I see her tomorrow... Maybe I can bring this up. Eeeks!
> let me know,
> LG04Thanks!! I just hope you see this post since I'm a few days late.
LGL
Posted by LG04 on February 24, 2005, at 17:31:17
In reply to Re: T and Valentine's Day » LG04, posted by LittleGirlLost on February 23, 2005, at 14:45:48
Hi LGL,
how did your meeting with your therapist go? i really understand how hard it is to bring this stuff up. but you say your therapist is experienced and knowledgable, so i bet she'd handle it okay. maybe you can start out just by asking her about transference, what it means, etc.I'm so sorry you were sexually abused. i am sure your therapist will be able to help you with this as well.
your question about my fear that my t's husband will hurt her, yes it's projection. my dad hurt me by having sex with me, so it makes sense from a child's perspective that my dad would hurt my mom while having sex with her. so if i'm projecting "mom" onto my therapist, transferring all my fears there, then i am very scared that "dad" (therapist's husband, who of course i've never met) will hurt "mom" (therapist) while having sex.
i know it seems weird, all this transference and projection stuff. but i can see how it's helpful. if i didn't have transference with my therapist, then i never would have known about these intense fears i have, or figured out their origin.
let me know how things are going,
LG
Posted by LittleGirlLost on March 3, 2005, at 13:49:29
In reply to Re: T and Valentine's Day » LittleGirlLost, posted by LG04 on February 24, 2005, at 17:31:17
> let me know how things are going,
> LGUnfortunately not too well. My session last week was awful and I'm not looking forward to going tonight. I thought about your post and everything you said, but I could not bring myself to bring any of it up. It bothers me that I'm thinking about her sex life even though it seems to give insight into me. It just seems weird! I'm embarrassed that I think/thought of this, but I can't really deny it either. So I don't know what to do. Plus it's extremely difficult for me to open up in the first place, so to have to talk about this!?! Ugh!
So yeah, my session last week.... I felt like I had nothing to say and felt stupid because of it. My mind goes blank, or this that I was intentionally avoiding, but I leave feeling stupid and frustrated... Like if I'm not going to talk, why do I bother going? Doesn't seem to bother her though; but why would it? She's still getting paid! Ohhhh what to do!
LGL
Posted by Bent on March 4, 2005, at 7:13:52
In reply to Re: T and Valentine's Day, posted by LittleGirlLost on March 3, 2005, at 13:49:29
Hi LGL.
This is tough for me but I had to respond to your post. While I think maybe our reasons are different, I too have similar thoughts about my T's sex life. It weirds me out that I think about it but I do. I have never talked to her about this. I cant imagine bringing it up. I think it may be just a part of my curiosity and my need to know that she is human too. I am not at all sexually attracted to her but I wonder if she feels things like I do -on a sexual level. I have wondered how often she has sex. It seems so weird to me to think this. I feel like a freak. One thing that I realized from your post was that I dont worry about her husband being anything but just about perfect. I dont worry for her safety, in fact I think her husband treats her wonderfully and knows just what she wants. I have no basis for these thoughts - this is simply what my mind has created and I dont know why. Now I feel weird having written this...to send or not to send??
Posted by LG04 on March 5, 2005, at 15:15:55
In reply to Re: T and Valentine's Day » LittleGirlLost, posted by Bent on March 4, 2005, at 7:13:52
don't feel weird, it's one of those things that are "normal" for what we've been through.
just today i was feeling so frustrated b/c i was thinking, I WANT TO KNOW HOW OFTEN SHE HAS SEX! and what she is like in bed, things like that. and i too am not sexually attracted to her. i understand that it comes directly from the sexual abuse and the transference that i have with her. i understand that as a kid, i wanted to know what my parents sex life was like, how often they had sex, what they were like in bed together, what they did to each other (most of it was more geared towards my mom, not so much my dad, like what she like in bed and so forth. unfortunately i already knew what my dad was like although i was still curious if he was the same with her as he was with me), all those things, b/c i felt very left out and many other things that i have figured out both alone and with my therapist's help.
it might also be in a tiny way a "real" thing with her in the sense that with our therapists we have so much intimacy but obviously the sexual boundaries are impenetrable -- thank goodness -- so it's something that we are never allowed to know. and that can be really frustrating. if i wasn't ever allowed to know where she lives or something, that might be very frustrating to me too. so in some ways maybe it's the "you aren't allowed to know this about me" that makes me want to know. in other words, because it's a boundary, i want to break thru it. but actually i don't think it's so much that. i think it has to do with what i wrote above. it's about my parents.
also, in some ways i think it's normal b/c of my need for "twinning," that is wanting a role model, someone to tell me and explain to me the ways of the world and what is normal and all that. my mom never spent time with me, she never showed me how to bake a cake or balance a checkbook or put on makeup or anything at all. everything i learned, i learned on my own or from other role models i found along the way. and b/c my sexual experiences were SO F*CKED UP (my dad raping me from a young age isn't exactly normal), i want to know what a normal sexual experience should be like and what is normal sexual response and all those things. even though i have had them as an adult, the kid me still wants someone to explain it all to her and model it for her in a way. and maybe even the adult me.
if there was some kind of women's sex circle and discussion, i would be the first to sign up. somewhere to talk about these things TOTALLY OPENLY and even to be able to be naked in front of each other and see what each other looks like and to be able to ask questions and compare experiences and ask about how they experience orgasms and what feels good to them and what doesn't and all those things. and i'd be totally willing and wanting to share my feelings and experiences with them. i want this whole subject to stop being so damn private and hidden from each other. we are all women. our sexuality is such an important part of our lives? why do we treat it as a forbidden topic, that we don't discuss our sex lives with others in a way that helps us to understand ourselves better and to grow?
see that makes me think about my therapist again. i can ask her almost anything in the world. i can ask her what makes her cry and i can ask her what makes her feel mad and i can ask her just about anything about herself but i can't ask, "what makes you feel aroused or have an orgasm?" why not? what is wrong with that question? it seems really normal to me. but the fact that i know i can't sort of reinforces this sense that sex is dirty and bad and all those things. it makes me feel like our whole society is so damn sexually repressed. WHY CAN'T WE TALK ABOUT IT AND ASK QUESTIONS??? and especially to our therapists, to whom we look at for answers and guidance in so many other ways.
okay i'm off my soapbox now. i just might ask my therapist exactly what i asked above.
so those are my thoughts. i think most if not all of it is transference stuff b/c i've had these same thoughts and feelings towards other people with whom i've had transference. not with this kind of intensity, but i am much more in touch with these feelings than i've ever been before and i'm emotionally closer with my therapist than i've been with any of the others that i had transference with, so it makes sense that with her the feelings would be more intense.can you tell your therapist, "i have something that i want to talk about but i can't do it. it's too embarassing and i feel too weird about it." and then see where she goes from there. i've said that to my therapist before and she asks me questions that help me to get it out slowly. and she also reassures me along the way that it's okay and she won't judge me or anything like that. so maybe you can just start by indicating that you have something to talk about but can't do it.
good luck and let me know what happens. maybe it's just not the right time for it right now. but remember that telling her will help you to grow and to deal with the issues that are underlying your curiosity. you're not thinking about these things for no good reason. there is a reason. it might be painful to figure it out (it sure is for me), but i'm glad it's out in the open and that i am understanding so much better what my internal experience was like as a child, because from this point, i can start to heal from it.
LG
Posted by Daisym on March 5, 2005, at 18:02:55
In reply to Re: T and Valentine's Day, posted by LG04 on March 5, 2005, at 15:15:55
Hi LG,
I hope you don't mind that I added a trigger alert to your last post. You said a lot of very important things and were so honest, I just don't want anyone to wander onto this like I did and well, get triggered.
I think you ask so many great questions. There are several books that are really explicit about women's sexualality and there are a couple for women who've been sexual abused. I'll try to dig up some names for you.
You sound like you've asked so many intense questions of your therapist, why wouldn't you just tell her this too? She might decline to answer but you could talk about why you want to know, what this need is and how you fill it.
I've had the same "is this normal" questions pop up many times, not just about sex. My therapist says there is no normal, but that everything is a negotiation between two people. If it makes you feel bad, scared or hurt in anyway, you should try to figure out why, change it or say "no". Easier said than done sometimes.
I'm impressed with how much you've put together for yourself already. And I'm sorry about your history. Amazing how it invades so many places of your life isn't it?
Posted by LG04 on March 5, 2005, at 23:05:54
In reply to Therapist and Sexual discussions (Trigger +above) » LG04, posted by Daisym on March 5, 2005, at 18:02:55
Hi DAisy, i don't mind at all that you put the trigger warning, i didn't even think about it. i guess i am not sure what might be triggering for someone and what isn't. i always understood that suicidal talk or self-mutilation talk can be triggering, but i didn't realize that anything else was. so thank you for letting me know and i'm sorry that you got triggered. you are okay now?
i would love to get the names of the books from you.
probably i will talk to my therapist about it at some point, just not at this moment. it's been so intense lately and i am trying to de-intensify things for a little while, just to catch my breath. but yes, it's something i'd like to hear her opinion on.
thank you for your compliments towards me. and yes, it's amazing how csa affects everything. but it's not a surprise unfortunately. what i can say is that it affects my life less than it used to, so that's a positive thing.
LG04
Posted by daisym on March 6, 2005, at 1:16:03
In reply to Re: Therapist and Sexual discussions (Trigger +above) » Daisym, posted by LG04 on March 5, 2005, at 23:05:54
I'm doing OK today. The trigger for me was about your dad having sex with you. I've also been triggered by descriptions of beatings. I guess it depends what you are sensitive to. These days it is everything for me! *sigh*
Two books that I would recommended are "Sex for One" by Betty Dodson and "Courage to Heal" which has chapters on sex and intimacy.
I'm curious if you have a current relationship with your dad and mom? Have you ever talk with either about this?
Posted by LG04 on March 6, 2005, at 13:01:30
In reply to Re: Therapist and Sexual discussions (Trigger +above) » LG04, posted by daisym on March 6, 2005, at 1:16:03
hi daisy,
my father passed away 10 years ago. my mom and i do have a relationship.
as soon as i started having flashbacks, i cut off my relationship with my father and he knew why though he denied everything. several years later he got cancer. then i heard from someone that he only had a few months left to live. i was still early in my healing process but i knew i had to confront him about the incest or i'd regret it. so i wrote him a long letter about it, about how his sexual abuse of me affected my life and the pain and everything else, and i asked him to please admit it before he died. i went to his house where much of the abuse took place and read it to him (my rabbi was with me, i would never have gone alone).
he denied everything. i expected it but obviously it still hurt. i saw him two more times after that (it was incredibly triggering for me so i couldn't see him very often). i also called him almost daily until he died. i don't know why. i guess i just knew it was my last chance to ever be speaking to him and you know, despite all the pain and horror of what he did, i still loved him and he was still my dad.
he cut me out of his will which hurt terribly. my only sibling, my sister (whom he also abused but she is in total and complete denial and idolizes my dad and has not spoken to me in 10 years) got everything. i went to the funeral and stood in the back with my friends while he received accolades of what a wonderful man he was. i sat in front at the gravesite service with the rest of my family (who were not speaking to me), but when the time came for each person present to put in a shovel full of dirt (a Jewish tradition), i refused. it was my way of showing that even though he was my father, i was not going to lie or pretend that i thought he was this wonderful man deserving of this kind of respect.
my mom and i did not speak for 5 years. she denied everything also and when my dad had cancer, she completely took care of him (they had been divorced already for 12 years!) while at the same time, i was in and out of hospitals for suicial ideations and cutting and so forth, and i couldn't work from such debilitating depression and constant flashbacks and didn't even have enough money to buy food so i had to go to a food pantry for a while (while my mom was married to a millionaire, i kid you not). she became very involved in the false memory association and blamed my incest memories on evil therapists. (even though my flashbacks almost always occurred outside the therapists' office)
she had basically given me an ultimatum: recant your accusations of incest or we will not be in your life. in black and white: choose your family or choose yourself. i chose myself.
it was a horribly painful time of my life. living without my family, even though they are f*cked up, was so painful. (i have cousins and an aunt with whom i'd always been close, and they also stopped speaking to me, also my grandma) but eventually i started to get back on my feet again. a few times i ran into my mom and we spoke a little bit and she would ask me to re-connect wih her and go to a false memory syndrome therapist. can you imagine? sometimes it ended up with me screaming at her. i couldn't handle her denial. i could not be in a relationship with her while she denied everything. it made me feel like i didn't exist.
eventually we tried therapy together (it was the only way i'd be in her presence) but the therapist SHE picked was neutral about the incest and wouldn't even say if he believed me or not. and whenever it came up, my mom would go nuts and say she can't handle this and it's not true, etc.
i don't even know how but eventually we made our way back into a relationship with each other and then with the rest of my family. (except my sister) It has taken a long time and i still feel the effects of the rupture in my relationship with them, but things for the most part are back to normal with everyone except my sister. i kept sending her birthday cards until last year. finally i realized that i had shown her over and over again that i am open to a relationship with her. i can't do it anymore. the rejection is too painful. i don't expect her to ever be in my life again. i represent to her the incest and she needs to stay as far away from it as possible.
I still have a hard time with my mom. Our relationship is very superficial. she helps me a lot with financial situations and we go to dinner and stuff together, but i don't ever feel really comfortable with her. i love her and i prefer having her in my life, but i still have to hide everything emotional from her. so most of me is hidden and she doesn't really know me. it's very hard. she can be supportive about non-threatening things though.
my biggest issue in therapy is letting go of the wish for an ideal mother, for the mother that i never had. i am so resistent to giving up that fantasy, even though the fantasy doesn't help me at all in my life and only causes pain. whenever i start to get close and begin to grieve, i end up backing away from it. i really want to deal with it, to let it go, i suppose i am in that process just by getting close and backing away. but i want it to happen NOW and be done with it.
anyway, that is the story with my parents. it's a common scenerio but it's not the only scenerio. i have an incest surviving friend whose dad (not the abuser) so much wants to be there for her and is so wonderful with her since she told him a little while ago.
i hope that helped for whatever information you were seeking. if you have any more questions, i'm happy to answer them.
hang in there. it really does get better. today i am fully functioning (most days anyway!) with a full-time job that i love. i have grown in so many ways in my ability to have intimate relationships. much of it has come from my current therapist, with whom I have had many "corrective emotional experiences." i still experience a lot of emotional pain though. i still have a lot to work thru. but my first years of therapy were just living thru flashbacks and trying to survive. so it has gotten better, that's for sure.
LG04
Posted by bent on March 6, 2005, at 13:37:41
In reply to Re: T and Sexual discussions **possible trigger » daisym, posted by LG04 on March 6, 2005, at 13:01:30
Wow, what a story. Thank you for sharing. For all you have struggled with you sound very strong in your writing. I admire your bravery. Do you transfer a lot of your mom-searching on to your T? That's a major thing for me with my T. I am always looking for my mother and for the past few years that's what I have consciously and unconsciously been trying to make my T. We talk about it but I am still uncomfortable at times, although I have come along way. Thanks again for sharing.
Posted by annierose on March 6, 2005, at 19:40:21
In reply to Re: T and Sexual discussions **possible trigger » daisym, posted by LG04 on March 6, 2005, at 13:01:30
thank you for sharing your story. you are so brave and a remarkable young woman!
Posted by LG04 on March 6, 2005, at 21:57:01
In reply to Re: T and Sexual discussions **possible trigger » LG04, posted by bent on March 6, 2005, at 13:37:41
thanks bent for all the nice things you said.
i definitely transfer my mom longings to my therapist. that's the biggest issue that i struggle with in my relationship with her. i am working so hard to let it go, to let the mom fantasy go, but when i get close to the pain, i back away (both from the pain and i threaten to leave therapy b/c it's too much for me). it's SO SO overwhelmingly painful. we are trying different things to help me lessen my transference with her and to be able to grieve the mother that i so desperately want. i really want to let it go. it's not productive for me and i would be so much happier if i could stop looking and just accept that it won't ever happen. but my little kids go nuts inside when i start to grieve. they want to keep pretending forever.
i know that i am making progress on this but i sure wish it would be over already. i guess b/c the pain is so intense, it has to be slow, touching the edge of the grief and then backing away and then going in it again and then backing away...until i eventually work it thru.
any helpful hints you've found on trying to work it thru?
LG04
Posted by LG04 on March 6, 2005, at 21:58:29
In reply to Re: T and Sexual discussions **possible trigger, posted by annierose on March 6, 2005, at 19:40:21
Posted by LittleGirlLost on March 7, 2005, at 9:50:18
In reply to Re: T and Valentine's Day, posted by LG04 on March 5, 2005, at 15:15:55
LG04 & Bent,
Thanks you both for your (ongoing) input with this. I can't say much now, I'm in a really bad place. But I hope that hearing your story and similar thoughts will inspire me to bring this up with my therapist.
LGL
Posted by daisym on March 7, 2005, at 23:31:05
In reply to Re: T and Sexual discussions **possible trigger » daisym, posted by LG04 on March 6, 2005, at 13:01:30
Thank you for taking so much time to write out your story. You were very brave to confront your dad - I can't imagine how bad it hurt to hear him deny it.
A few months ago my sister told me she was "touched" by our dad too...she was looking to reconnect with me. We are on different planets as far as our life styles go but I'm being as supportive as I can be. She doesn't know about me and I'm not telling her. It is complicated but best for now. I'm sorry your sister can't accept your overtures. Families are so hard!
I was really struck by what you said as far as your mom stuff goes. I'm sure this is going to be my biggest struggle -- to stop wanting what never happened and can now never, ever happen. I think that touching the grief, and stepping back is the only way to get through such a painful thing. It feels like rejection of your very core self and that is just too much to bear. I know that my separation issues from my therapist are wrapped all around this. I just don't know how to be done with it either.
Yeah - "it's a process" -- I know! I wish it was a faster one.
Thanks again for sharing. It is always good to hear from someone a few years ahead of me.
Posted by LG04 on March 8, 2005, at 0:18:18
In reply to Re: T and Sexual discussions **possible trigger » LG04, posted by daisym on March 7, 2005, at 23:31:05
hmmmmmm...i don't know that i'm a few years ahead of you. maybe in certain areas but probably in other areas you are ahead of me! i also have a lot of separation issues with my therapist although they are getting better. i live across the world from her but we still talk twice a week. that's how hard it is for me to separate! thankfully she has never said that we have to, even when i moved back to america. she has told me that she will be here for me the rest of my life.
i don't get it. i tell myself, "she really loves you and that's okay. you can let her love you." but it's hard. but i am learning from her that maybe, just maybe, i deserve it. otherwise why would she love me? of course she doesn't love me PERFECTLY like a good fantasy mom should do, so i get mad at her even though she is so wonderful. i test and i challenge and i can really get angry too. (sometimes though it's for real things, 'cause she makes mistakes). The only time i've really screamed at her was in my car, and she was halfway around the world so it was okay, she didn't hear me even if the rest of the neighborhood did. :)
today i did an in-take for group therapy for incest survivors and i liked the therapist who interviewed me. and then i heard the little kids inside saying, "will you be my mommy?" they want one so badly. they don't want to give up. i don't blame them. as you said, it's like rejection of your very core self. and for me it mostly means i'll never get certain needs met that were meant to be met. i don't know how to let go of the longing for someone to meet those needs. because i feel like i still need for them to be met!! so how can i just give up hope? but i know i have to. it's too much to bear though.
it sounds like you are trusting your gut with your sister. the most important thing is to keep yourself emotionally safe. my therapist always says, "you don't have to trust someone all at once. and you don't have to trust either completely or not at all. you trust a tinsy tinsy bit and see how that goes. little by little. only at your pace and only as it feels safe." i always thought i have to trust all the way or not at all, and that if i didn't trust someone i would hurt their feelings so i had to trust everyone. the world is much safer when i realize that who i trust and how much i trust is completely in my control.
oh yes, the process. aren't you just ready to strangle that word??!!!!
LG04
Posted by Bent on March 9, 2005, at 8:15:22
In reply to Re: T and Sexual discussions **possible trigger » bent, posted by LG04 on March 6, 2005, at 21:57:01
I dont think I really have any suggestions as far as getting through this. I so often ask my T when will it (the feelings) just go away. Of course its not very reasonable to think they can just go away. I wish there was a switch I could turn off.
I know what you mean about the pain. I often long for my T and I dont tell her about it. She knows the basics and how I tend to see her or want her to be my perfect mother. I just dont tell her the intensity of it. I wish I could tell her that I feel like I love her. Just yesterday I asked her if she thought things were ok between us and she said that the fact that we were talking about indicates they are. Thats true because there was a time when I wanted to run from therapy all together rather than ask her about 'us'. I can (slowly) talk about it now, and I am learning that she isnt going to abandon me, so I guess things are ok between us.
Really I think the best thing is to keep talking about the feelings. Easier said here than in therapy sometimes I know. Its a battle in my mind everytime I want to talk about my feelings towards my T - but then I talk about them, and I feel better. I guess that means I am on the long and winding road to get through transferenceville. I wish someone who has made this journey would write us a map though!!
Posted by annierose on March 9, 2005, at 16:04:41
In reply to Re: T and Sexual discussions **possible trigger » LG04, posted by Bent on March 9, 2005, at 8:15:22
Bent -
I think you are absolutely right. When I first worked with my T (back in 1983), I quit several times everytime she asked about "our" relationship ... questions like "Is that how you feel here sometimes?" or the like, sent me running fast. I eventually quit. Now, YEARS later, I returned to therapy (same T in fact) and know I have the strength and courage to talk about my feelings with her. AND it is so HARD and so embarassing, but it is helpful. I am so happy she is still practicing (we were both pretty young back then) and I am finally able to work through this relationship. I am getting so much more out of therapy now that I can admit to having feelings about my T. And those sessions are sometimes the most productive. And I still withhold the depth of those feelings, but I'm surprising myself with what comes out of my mouth. My T couldn't be anymore helpful with this.
Annierose
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