![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 21 to 45 of 45. Go back in thread:
Posted by fairywings on September 11, 2005, at 12:06:29
In reply to Re: cyber hugs are different, posted by happyflower on September 11, 2005, at 11:55:36
>>He says he would try to comfort me with his words, well maybe it would work, but I don't want to go there with him. I guess I still have trust issues with him even though I feel like I do trust him a lot. Weird.
Awww, happy, i bet he'd be incredibly comforting with his words. i know you have so much sadness in this area, i'm so sorry for everything you've gone through, it's so painful. i hope, if it would help, that one day you are able to get there with him, and he is able to show you how wonderfully he can comfort you.
fw
Posted by happyflower on September 11, 2005, at 12:12:32
In reply to Re: cyber hugs are different » happyflower, posted by fairywings on September 11, 2005, at 12:06:29
>> Awww, happy, i bet he'd be incredibly comforting with his words. i know you have so much sadness in this area, i'm so sorry for everything you've gone through, it's so painful. i hope, if it would help, that one day you are able to get there with him, and he is able to show you how wonderfully he can comfort you.
>
Thanks Jazzy for your support. His presence even comforts me, so I am sure his words in crisis would be comforting too. Actually he makes me feel a lot better about myself when I am feeling down on myself. I know is words would be comforting, but I still want more from him that I can't have. I want him to hold me while I cry my eyes out. I guess we all want what we can't have. It is so sad to want something from him that I can't have because I am his client and not his friend.
>
>
Posted by Poet on September 11, 2005, at 12:14:06
In reply to Hi, I'm GG. I'm a cryer, posted by gardenergirl on September 11, 2005, at 9:28:47
Hi GG,
Uh, no, I can't picture you being all blubbery for 50 minutes. Maybe you had one of those mini packs of kleenex in your purse, but I don't remember seeing you carry around the giant economy box.
<<I used to be very embarrassed about crying there (when I first started). His response was kind of cute...."Any time you walk into a room and see this many boxes of Kleenex everywhere, you ought to assume it's okay to cry."
I think your T's response was kind of cute, too. I once grabbed a kleenex to dust something in my T's office, so that box right next to me is useful for something.
Poet
Posted by happyflower on September 11, 2005, at 12:16:17
In reply to Re: cyber hugs are different » fairywings, posted by happyflower on September 11, 2005, at 12:12:32
Posted by 10derHeart on September 11, 2005, at 12:22:09
In reply to Hi, I'm GG. I'm a cryer, posted by gardenergirl on September 11, 2005, at 9:28:47
I'm pretty much similar to you, gg.
I can't remember a session for a long time where I haven't cried.
I don't mind too much any more. Try not to think of how ugly I probably look. When I've mentioned that to T., he says he's so focused on my tone of voice (hurt) and what I'm telling him (pain) at those times, he NEVER notices what crying might do to my face.
Hmm..I guess I believe him.
I usually don't cry on the way home. Just feel drained and relieved and somewhat *lighter.* Funny, though, I often cry on the way there. I think that's anticipation of the fact I *can* cry there, and I just think too much about what I might say, what he might say, and the tears
come...I have a love-hate relationship with my own tears in therapy, it seems. Love them because that stuff just can't stay bottled up forever....it just poisons me eventually. Hate them because I do feel too open and unable to *control* the session, as far as showing how I really feel about something at my own pace any longer...the darn tears kind of give it all away...
Lately I've noticed, I have this tendency when my T. asks about something, or makes an observation, and it hits a nerve I didn't realize I even had till that second.....as I'm crying I keep saying, "don't say that, don't say that." If I peek at him then ('cause I've probably been looking down 98% of the time) he looks sad. :-(
<sigh> It's hard. How can we produce so many tears anyway?!
your friend in sogginess - 10der
Posted by Annierose on September 11, 2005, at 14:01:19
In reply to Re: Now where the heck do ya find that! » Annierose, posted by fairywings on September 11, 2005, at 11:59:03
I can't find a good one either. Totally with you on that. I did have a sales clerk at Walgreen tell me that she likes the 2 wand ones (white, then black) but you have to work fast. Haven't experimented with them yet.
Posted by Racer on September 11, 2005, at 14:02:05
In reply to Crying?, posted by muffled on September 10, 2005, at 23:19:52
> I never cry at therapy. I don't cry. It shows weakness.
> I want to cry I think. Its supposed to be a good thing I hear.
> Anybody else the same?I swing both ways -- when I'm not crying in therapy, it's a good bet that I'm actively anorexic outside therapy. When I'm engulfed by huge, racking, choking sobs through most of each session, it's usually during a time that I'm eating more regularly.
For me, holding back tears -- yes, because they are a sign of weakness, of vulnerability -- goes along with trying very, very hard not to feel anything that would provoke tears. Holding my feelings in such tight confinement is only possible if I hold all other sensations in equally tight control, thus the starvation, the hyperactivity, etc. It all goes together with a lot of other symptoms.
When I cry in therapy, though, it feels so frightening! That's said as someone who can boost stock in Kleenex just by watching "Gone With The Wind" or "Anne of the Thousand Days!" Like Dorothy Parker, it can be said that I cry at Victorian costumes. In therapy, though, it's so frightening, it feels as though all my defenses are stripped away, and all that's left is the raw core of me, and my pain. I hate it.
And it helps me.
Mind you, it would help if I could cry like normal people, with the tears coming out of my eyes, rather than all running out my nose. I'm sure I'm terribly attractive with snot all over my face. A girlfriend gave me some good advice, though, for when that happens: "The only thing you can do at that point is take off your shoes and blow your nose on your socks." I have no idea what it means, but it helps.
Why does crying in therapy help me? It's partly because letting the feelings out in any way at all helps. Holding them inside just allows the poison to spread throughout my system. Catharsis is a good thing, and I know that it will moderate itself as I let go of more and more of the pain that's built up over the years. It also helps because the more I go through the horrible tears, the more I break down those defensive barricades, the more I experience those feelings without being destroyed, the more faith I have that I can survive my feelings.
For me, though, I know that having the right therapist is vital for getting anywhere -- and that crying is an outward sign of that. With a bunch of the therapists I've seen in recent times, I couldn't shed a tear to save my life. I couldn't feel anything that would lead to anything mroe than maybe a hiccough. Funny thing, during those periods I lost a few pounds... My current therapist is working out for me, and I'm pretty sure I've come close to flooding out her office. I know that the other day I finished off both boxes of tissue in her office, and she had to go get another box from the next room!
I don't know if any of htat helped you. It helped me to write it. I guess I can go to the same meetings as GG now. "Hello, my name is Racer, and I am a cryer..."
Posted by fairywings on September 11, 2005, at 15:07:55
In reply to Re: Hi, I'm GG. I'm a cryer » gardenergirl, posted by 10derHeart on September 11, 2005, at 12:22:09
Awww 10der,
When you said this:
"Lately I've noticed, I have this tendency when my T. asks about something, or makes an observation, and it hits a nerve I didn't realize I even had till that second.....as I'm crying I keep saying, "don't say that, don't say that." If I peek at him then ('cause I've probably been looking down 98% of the time) he looks sad. :-("
I thought what an incredible thing to have happen in therapy, to have your T so tuned in to you, to be able to open you up and see into what's really going on, and yet be so sensitive to your feelings. This is so incredibly touching.
fw
Posted by fairywings on September 11, 2005, at 15:08:29
In reply to Re: cyber hugs are different » fairywings, posted by happyflower on September 11, 2005, at 12:12:32
Posted by fairywings on September 11, 2005, at 15:14:20
In reply to Re: Now where the heck do ya find that! » fairywings, posted by Annierose on September 11, 2005, at 14:01:19
> I can't find a good one either. Totally with you on that. I did have a sales clerk at Walgreen tell me that she likes the 2 wand ones (white, then black) but you have to work fast. Haven't experimented with them yet.
Nah, I haven't found that to be true with the brand i tried, i'll check the brand, and let you know, i know there are a couple out there with the white and then black. i didn't have to work fast that i remember, i'm so blind and have to be right in the mirror, i think i'd remember that. the thing i remember didn't like about it, was that it stayed on my lashes for a full week! even with remover! but it's been awhile since i've used it. i'll try it again this week, and report back. i don't think it clumped, i think it was just getting it off.
fw
Posted by Dinah on September 11, 2005, at 15:16:16
In reply to Re: Hi, I'm GG. ! » muffled, posted by gardenergirl on September 11, 2005, at 11:12:47
My therapist used to pointedly offer me kleenex when I cried. Now, I'm not talking about runny nose crying obviously that needs a kleenex. But just tears. I think I told him that that bothered me, because he stopped. And I ignore that it probably bothers him that I don't mop up my tears.
I know well that salty residue.
Posted by Racer on September 11, 2005, at 17:06:06
In reply to cyber hugs are different » muffled, posted by Poet on September 11, 2005, at 11:31:26
> Hi Muffled,
>
> I don't do hugs in real life, either. Cyber hugs don't involve actual physical contact so I'm okay giving and receiving them.
>
> Your friend in nuttiness and no physical contact, please.
>
> Poet
I think I'm with muffled on this one: since I'm not comfortable with hugging people I don't know very, very well, I don't do cyberhugs, either. In situations where cyberhugs might be expected or appreciated, I will say flat out that I don't offer them, and offer what I can offer instead, but I just don't feel right with the cyberhug thing.{shrug} Chacun à son goût...
Posted by Racer on September 11, 2005, at 17:09:09
In reply to Re: Now where the heck do ya find that! » Annierose, posted by fairywings on September 11, 2005, at 15:14:20
I used to use Clarins, which tended to be hard to get off with remover, but certainly was cry-proof. Just their regular mascara, and I'm sure it was waterproof.
Now I'm liking the MAC mascara, mostly the colors, but their ZoomBlack is pretty darned nice stuff, and I haven't cried it off yet. (Then again, I never use it on my lower lashes...)
OK, was anyone here still confused about whether I was male or female? (That comes up now and again...)
Posted by fairywings on September 11, 2005, at 22:01:31
In reply to Re: Now where the heck do ya find that! » fairywings, posted by Racer on September 11, 2005, at 17:09:09
LOL I guess a guy could use mascara too! ; )
fw
Posted by sleepygirl on September 12, 2005, at 0:36:17
In reply to Crying?, posted by muffled on September 10, 2005, at 23:19:52
It took me a long time to cry in therapy. It seems though that there's a lot I can't talk about without crying - so I've learned to go ahead and talk anyway. I also seem to store up a lot of tension (just going about my days), and it's one of the ways I release it.
-BUT- I kind of needed permission the first time - a little push of the tissue box in my direction - terribly uncomfortable showing that much emotion at first, but it is what it is
-cry if you need to :-)
Posted by sleepygirl on September 12, 2005, at 0:43:08
In reply to Re: Crying? » muffled, posted by Racer on September 11, 2005, at 14:02:05
Wow, that really made sense, the stifling of tears, not being able to eat- all that tension built up, and yes vulnerability is hard :-)
Posted by fairywings on September 12, 2005, at 10:03:37
In reply to Re: Crying?, posted by sleepygirl on September 12, 2005, at 0:36:17
Okay, so what kind of tissues do your T's have in their offices? The nice fluffy ones, or the cheap generic ones? There are tissues all over the place at my p-doc and T's office, (although I did take note and noticed only ONE box in my T's office! YIKES! Dare I cry?!) but they're the ones that are provided by the drug companies. Bleh! Never really checked 'em out, guess i better do that before i blow my nose into one of them and ...... well you know, that could be a problem if it's one of those cheap one ply generic jobbies! LOL would serve 'em right, now wouldn't it?!
fw
Posted by fairywings on September 12, 2005, at 10:20:19
In reply to Re: Crying? » muffled, posted by Racer on September 11, 2005, at 14:02:05
>
>> For me, Holding my feelings in such tight confinement is only possible if I hold all other sensations in equally tight control, thus the starvation, the hyperactivity, etc. It all goes together with a lot of other symptoms.this makes a lot of sense racer, holding back the tears, holding back all of the feelings, not ever wanting to feel vulnerable with anyone ever. i never thought about it until i came to these boards, but this post really says it all. i experience it in body sensations and physical problems - feeling every nerve in my body through my skin, severe muscle tension, psoriasis, ibs, anxiety attacks, feeling nauseated, eating/not eating, feeling exhausted.
>
> When I cry in therapy, though, it feels so frightening! In therapy, though, it's so frightening, it feels as though all my defenses are stripped away, and all that's left is the raw core of me, and my pain. I hate it.
i haven't yet, so of course, this terrifies me. i'm sorry it feels so bad. i can visualize how it must feel, how is your T with you, what do they do? do they just sit there? omg, the panic, i'm so sorry.>
> And it helps me.
>
> Mind you, it would help if I could cry like normal people, with the tears coming out of my eyes, rather than all running out my nose. I'm sure I'm terribly attractive with snot all over my face. A girlfriend gave me some good advice, though, for when that happens: "The only thing you can do at that point is take off your shoes and blow your nose on your socks." I have no idea what it means, but it helps.LOL, that is so funny! Why your sock?! You have to explain that, and oh, wouldn't that make you look just a little funny? have you actually done this? hmmmm...... wonder what your T would think then. i would guess it would take thier mind off the tears, that's for sure!
The snot things is so me, and i didn't want to say anything, PLUS i have sinus problems big time, so my nose BLEEDS too, lovely huh? so on top of not wanting to cry because of the tears and the runny nose and snot, i have a freaking bloody nose! i got one last week as i was walking out the door to go to my T's.>
> more I experience those feelings without being destroyed, the more faith I have that I can survive my feelings.
> For me, though, I know that having the right therapist is vital for getting anywhere -- and that crying is an outward sign of that. "Hello, my name is Racer, and I am a cryer..."You're funny and have a lot of words of wisdom! gotta love that.
fw
Posted by Poet on September 12, 2005, at 18:14:02
In reply to Re: cyber hugs are different -- tangent » Poet, posted by Racer on September 11, 2005, at 17:06:06
Tangent has several meanings, I guess in this case it could be either one: touch or change from the original purpose.
My purpose was to tell Muffled that I while I don't hug IRL, I will hug in cyberspace. Agree. Disagree. It don't matter to me.
My French is limited, so I don't have a clue as to what you said, but vive la difference.
Poet
Posted by Deneb on September 12, 2005, at 20:06:31
In reply to cyber hugs are different » muffled, posted by Poet on September 11, 2005, at 11:31:26
> Hi Muffled,
>
> I don't do hugs in real life, either. Cyber hugs don't involve actual physical contact so I'm okay giving and receiving them.
>
> Your friend in nuttiness and no physical contact, please.
>
> PoetMe too! I don't like people touching me IRL...not even my own family...we never hug or even pat each other on the back.
I'm not affectionate at all IRL, but I am in the cyberworld...go figure!
So...when you meet me IRL, don't be offended if I don't hug you or seem awkward when someone hugs me!
Deneb
Posted by kerria on September 14, 2005, at 20:32:54
In reply to Crying?, posted by muffled on September 10, 2005, at 23:19:52
Hi Muffled,
Crying is way overrated. i cry for almost the whole session and it doesn't make me feel any better.
What happens is that i think of therapy as a place of comfortless despair when i remember crying in front of T and he does nothing. And T says nothing to help. i've actually told T that i resent crying in front of him because he doesn't help and i remember him looking at me in such a strange way, not knowing what to say.The hard thing is what will your T be able to say or do to comfort you? There's nothing so sad and alone as to cry in front of someone who never says, "It's going to be ok" or "It's not so bad" or anything at all to help you feel better. i even think that my T lost touch with how much it hurts inside to cry. He's heard it all.
Crying in therapy could make you feel resentful towards your T if he or she never helps by saying something that comforts.
Muffled i hope that you have the freedom to cry if it helps (((safe hugs)))
take care,
kerria
Posted by muffled on September 15, 2005, at 17:30:52
In reply to Re: Crying? » muffled, posted by kerria on September 14, 2005, at 20:32:54
> Hi Muffled,
>
> Crying is way overrated. i cry for almost the whole session and it doesn't make me feel any better.
> What happens is that i think of therapy as a place of comfortless despair when i remember crying in front of T and he does nothing. And T says nothing to help. i've actually told T that i resent crying in front of him because he doesn't help and i remember him looking at me in such a strange way, not knowing what to say.
>
> The hard thing is what will your T be able to say or do to comfort you? There's nothing so sad and alone as to cry in front of someone who never says, "It's going to be ok" or "It's not so bad" or anything at all to help you feel better. i even think that my T lost touch with how much it hurts inside to cry. He's heard it all.
>
> Crying in therapy could make you feel resentful towards your T if he or she never helps by saying something that comforts.
>
> Muffled i hope that you have the freedom to cry if it helps (((safe hugs)))
>
> take care,
> kerriaThanks Kerria for taking the time to care when you are struggling so. I guess you haven't found a new T? or sorted out stuff with the old one? I hate to say it but your old T. sounds awful. Man if I cried in front of my T. and she just sat like a stone, thats it man, I'd go off and freak on her. How dare she just sit there when my guts are all over the floor. But I haven't cried yet. Almost did but I ran out. I came back in a bit once I was cooled out. So I have no idea what she'd do? Life is sure freaking confusing isn't it? People sure as heck are.
Thanks kerria. That was a real nice post. Muffled.
Posted by gardenergirl on September 16, 2005, at 8:14:12
In reply to Re: Hi, I'm GG. I'm a cryer » gardenergirl, posted by Poet on September 11, 2005, at 12:14:06
> Hi GG,
>
> Uh, no, I can't picture you being all blubbery for 50 minutes. Maybe you had one of those mini packs of kleenex in your purse, but I don't remember seeing you carry around the giant economy box.LOL, that would be a funny picture. And I didn't have anything to blubber about around y'all. Except maybe because I was so moved and touched at getting to meet everyone in person, and feeling so instantly comfortable.
>
> I think your T's response was kind of cute, too. I once grabbed a kleenex to dust something in my T's office, so that box right next to me is useful for something.
:) That's very cute.}}}}Poet{{{{ (air hugs)
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on September 16, 2005, at 8:20:45
In reply to Re: Hi, I'm GG. I'm a cryer » gardenergirl, posted by 10derHeart on September 11, 2005, at 12:22:09
> I'm pretty much similar to you, gg.
>
> I can't remember a session for a long time where I haven't cried.I've had some, and I usually comment on it. Sometimes those are really dissatisfying sessions, though. (guess I'm a masochist?) But sometimes you need those sessions where you stay very superficial or situational. There's got to be some balance and relief from the deep work, I think.
>
> I don't mind too much any more. Try not to think of how ugly I probably look. When I've mentioned that to T., he says he's so focused on my tone of voice (hurt) and what I'm telling him (pain) at those times, he NEVER notices what crying might do to my face.Good to know. I'll adopt that answer for my T, too. :)
> I usually don't cry on the way home. Just feel drained and relieved and somewhat *lighter.* Funny, though, I often cry on the way there. I think that's anticipation of the fact I *can* cry there, and I just think too much about what I might say, what he might say, and the tears
> come...Wow, I haven't done that. I can imagine sitting in the waiting room having already cried.... That would be uncomfortable for me. Although that just happened a few weeks ago. I had a pdoc appt. right after my therapy appt. The look on the receptionist's face when I walked in, and it was obvious I had been crying was kind of funny. She looked like she was thinking, "Most people LEAVE her like that, but they don't walk in like that!" But then again, I suppose people do come in when they are in crisis, so I suppose I was projecting there.
>
> Lately I've noticed, I have this tendency when my T. asks about something, or makes an observation, and it hits a nerve I didn't realize I even had till that second.....as I'm crying I keep saying, "don't say that, don't say that." If I peek at him then ('cause I've probably been looking down 98% of the time) he looks sad. :-(Oh...it's so hard when someone says or does something that hits that nerve just right, isn't it? It's kind of like when you are upset about something, and you say to your friends, "Don't be nice to me right now" because the minute someone shows kindness, the waterworks open.
>
> <sigh> It's hard. How can we produce so many tears anyway?!A very good question...Hey, nice to know I can be productive in something! I don't procrastinate on crying...:-D
>
> your friend in sogginess - 10der
>
>
gg
Posted by gardenergirl on September 16, 2005, at 8:22:38
In reply to Re: Hi, I'm GG. !, posted by Dinah on September 11, 2005, at 15:16:16
So he stopped offering you Kleenex eventually?
Every once in awhile, I am tempted to bring in one of my husband's hankies. Sometimes, even if it gets really damp, it just feels more substantial than Kleenex. Better for my nose, too.
gg
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Psychology | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.