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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by headachequeen on October 30, 2004, at 1:31:25
In reply to Re: Today's date..., posted by rainy on October 29, 2004, at 6:05:51
> Good morning. Yesterday, when I was glued to this board and typing rather addictively, it occured to me that perhaps people occasionally come on to start an argument (troll?) or to tease, or for some other less than valid reason.
>J suspect the same party and for the same reasons...
note the lack of response...
have had the smae experience on other boards - in one case the persone admitted eventually he was doing a blind test for a psych paper..
kat
Posted by headachequeen on October 30, 2004, at 1:31:25
In reply to Re: Today's date..., posted by stresser on October 29, 2004, at 8:03:40
> Good morning everyone, things are going smoothly here so far. Knock on wood. M can't ride her bike to school because we live 10 miles away and the snow would start to cause a problem for her within the next month or so!!! Rainy- do you live in a warm climate? It's been raining here on and off for several days now, and the leaves are falling in clumps! What a mess, the dog drags in leaves, so now I feel like I should rake the carpet! <G> Have you tried to babble mail me agian? I haven't seen anything. I feel that I can easily become addicted to this site. I get on here and lose track of time, then I'm late to my morning "coke meeting" with my friends. (Several of us meet for a "real" fountain coke, syrup, soda water, the old fashioned thing. I'm ADDICTED to them.)
>
> Kat- Thanks for the suggestion to ask M for help, I never thought about that for helping her self-esteem. What a wonderful idea, thanks once again. I am not gaining weight that will effect my job, thank heavens!!! Whew. YET. If I don't stop with the candy and COOKIES, I'm sure I will put on some. I know I have about five pounds I need to take off, because I don't like the way my cloths feel. I WILL NOT GET ON THE SCALE, until I know it's off. Haaaaaa I'm not fooling myself, I just don't want to see it. I'm taking the course so I can work more, I have also been thinking about it for around a year or so because it looks like something I would love to do. Must go, I think today I will make that coke a diet. Ewwwww. Better than nothing. -LWell, then, L admit to her that you refuse to face the scale until you are sure you have lost the five pounds and you need her help to do that... this is a form of binbe eating... and you as an adult are not above needing help, HER help...
get her help with the exercises and stuff for the classes too...
I am an expert now on dealing with daughters... all the things I know now how to do because I have years of thinking of how I should coulda...
I have a toilet paper ribbon door thing I thought of too late that would have saved so much trouble... and so many others...
You are human and she needs to know it...
and she can help... use the two factors...
that and topomax can help her...and real soda fountain coke.. maybe when you are both doing well you two could share one of those times and really talk....
what a concept...kat
Posted by headachequeen on October 30, 2004, at 1:31:27
In reply to Going off Welbutrin also..... » rainy, posted by stresser on October 29, 2004, at 12:53:53
> As for asking M what she wants, I have done that endlessly. Her pdoc. has also done that when she's by herself and with us in there with her. She says "I don't know", and we ask "what do you mean?" She then says "I don't know" I just keep waiting for her to let me know, but for now things are going smoother.M doesn't know what she wants...
she lacks self-esteem... she doesn't like herself but she doesn't like herself... and does not know how to say that -- heaven, she does not know how to identify that reality...
what teenager, what adult really, knows how to roll out of bed and recognise the fact that she or does not like her/himself?
and then when faced with a room full of people, adults too boot, mother, father, and therapist, is able to admit it out loud?
Well, I am not able to do that...
I can do it here because there are no faces to see...
Hey, world, I am not satisfied with me; I do not particularly like very much either and I am not sure who else could unless I achieve the perfect size, look, appearance, job, outfit, basically unless I am brilliant and all the things that they expect me to be, all the things they expect of me. I can say that here in a face-less room with no one I am ever going to see or meet in real life. But there she is in a room with three people who matter very much to her, two of whom she loves and she hopes, but is not always certain, love her...
What do you want, M? Well, how is she supposed to answer?Reminds me of an experience a few years ago when we hosted two Canada World Youth participants. They were here for three months. For three days they were away on one of those let's learn about ourselves experiences and our two came back ready to throw in the towel and go home...
one of the activities, directed by the untrained leaders was one in which the participants pinned sheets of paper on their backs then sat in a circle while each participant walked around writing on their backs the thing they liked most and the worst thing about each participant. Now they were with these people only on work sites and when they socialised. The idea was to integrate with the families as much as possible. As we are a bilingual family and our Canadian participant was a francophone wanting to learn English as did our hispanich participant, our two were very much with our family, and delightful girls. Our hispanic girl happened to come from the wealthy part of a poor island country and was further along in university than were the others, all university students. These students all assumed she was a snob and wrote derogatory and cruel comments about her and NO positive comments. SHe brought home her sheet.
She wanted to leave the programme. We spent a night and a day talking her into staying and toughing it out, showing them that she was better stuff than they were...
Here is M in the same position in a way... put in a room with three people whe she needs to impress because they hold her future in their handds...
and one of them asks what she wants...
does the therapist expect her to ask for candy or toys? a new car? new clothes?
She wants to be accepted be her peers, to be loved, to be acceoted and loved and wanted, she wants to fit in and be loved at home, to know that if she makes a mistake and has an accident she will still be loved, that if she has a poor mark she is still loved, that if she does not look like Barbie it does not matter, that no matter what, she is loved for who she is...
She wants to be loved no matter what and does the therapist think that she can say this in front of him or to him?
I couldn't tell my therapist this... I can write to all of you but uou are not sitting in this room...
maybe I should email him a copy...
and he wanted to have sessions with my husband there... yeah, right...
im his next life!
sorry it is so long
but it hit a nerve or three
kat
Posted by bridgey1128 on October 30, 2004, at 1:31:27
In reply to Re: Today's date... » stresser, posted by headachequeen on October 29, 2004, at 15:43:09
I'm glad all of you seem to be doing pretty well. Mountains sounds like a nice place to be. Wish I could get away. I love the NC mountains this time of the year. The leaves are just absolutely gorgeous. A couple of years ago I got to go to Alaska with the singing group I am in in Sept. The weather was absolutely fantastic. We walked out of the airport to the most clean smelling air I think I have ever smelled in my life. In fact, it was the most clean smelling AIRPORT I have ever smelled in my life!! Dried my nose and my skin out after 10 days though. I have southern humidity skin, lemme tell ya. But anyway, they had really beautiful trees and mountains there, and you could see the snow actually starting to fall on the peaks on the mountains. You could actually SEE it falling from the sky onto the tops of the mountains. They were really high up. But the leaves still didn't compare to the colors we have in NC. They had a lot of red and we have red and golds and oranges. Our fall has come really late this year. It's almost Nov and our leaves are STILL green!! It's 5:45 and it's 63 degrees. Tomorrow it's supposed to be 81. That's NC for you. If you don't like the weather..just wait a minute. Last year when I did South Pacific, opening night it dumped a HUGE ice and snow storm (we don't usually get snow, we get ICE!!)and so they had to cancel opening night because of the ice and some snow. Well...the NEXT DAY it was 70 degrees outside and then the next it was almost 80!!! This was the most bizarre weather we had ever seen. Oh, did I mention this was MARCH!! I had just started Topomax so I hadn't gotten the stupids too bad at this point. Let's just hope, at 200mg and another year later that we don't have another deep freeze and big thaw! Enjoy the beautiful colors! God has an amazing paintbrush!
Posted by rainy on October 30, 2004, at 1:31:28
In reply to Re: Going off Welbutrin also..... » stresser, posted by headachequeen on October 29, 2004, at 16:05:03
Kat. I think it was I that hit those nerves--you know I'm not dissing L and all she and her husband are doing for M, don't you?
What bugged you the most about what I wrote?
rainy
Posted by headachequeen on October 30, 2004, at 15:10:13
In reply to Re: Going off Welbutrin also....., posted by rainy on October 29, 2004, at 19:49:19
> Kat. I think it was I that hit those nerves--you know I'm not dissing L and all she and her husband are doing for M, don't you?
> What bugged you the most about what I wrote?
> rainyYou did not hit any nerves.. it was the therapist hit those nerves... what an incredible thing to say to a child in front of her parent... for that matter in front of the therapist...
what do you want...
adults can be such dolts when dealing with kids
they just don't get it and to think that I was one for pete's sake...
kat
Posted by stresser on October 30, 2004, at 21:00:50
In reply to Re: Going off Welbutrin also....., posted by headachequeen on October 30, 2004, at 15:10:13
Yea! I found your posts on the "social board", and will look here now as well as the physco med. board. Don't worry, not one of you hit a nerve, and don't ever hold anything back that can help me. I am taking your advice Kat, with asking her for help. I think it's an act of bravery for you to share these feelings about what you wish you could have done for your daughter. I really need to hear it, and saying thank you doesn't seem like enough. Your advice is critical, and I want you to know I use it.
As for the darn babble mail.....my babble doesn't work. I tried to babble rainy yesterday and I don't think it worked. If you got one rainy, please let me know. I'm not posting anything urgent, just trying to figure out why it's not working. -L
Posted by rainy on October 31, 2004, at 9:51:06
In reply to Redirect: mountains and snow, posted by Dr. Bob on October 30, 2004, at 1:34:18
Hey, we're missing messages! Like Kat's observations about how hard it can be to talk to a therapist and my nosy response about her nerves, and Bridgey's description of the NC Fall. Frankly, that wasn't much about medication either and it didn't get redirected--life's not fair.
Your comments, Kat, about it being easier to talk about ourselves here than face to face with a "real" person are interesting--I think it's a matter of trust in either case and it certainly takes longer in a room full of people than on a board. Here, our body language doesn't give us away, or help us express ourselves,for one thing and there's no way to really converse.
Stresser, I hope you didn't read me as saying I understand eating disorders to be caused by parents. I don't think anybody does. I am hypothesizing, again from what I've read and my own experience, that it can be useful to have a kind, informed competant adult, who's emotionally divorced from the situation, on board as well as the pdoc. I may be way out of date and I still think we're on the wrong board for this discussion. I babbled you last night--any luck?
And now, to quote Forrest Gump, that's all I've got to say (and it wasn't about medication either.) Well, not quite all.
It occured to me that the post wherein I suggested that Sresser and I try another babble and then immediately went full force ahead to share my opinion about therapy etc might have been an example of the foot in mouth syndrome that I've been blaming on Topamax.
Thursday? I began increasing the dose from 300 mgs to 350 but I forgot, forgot, about slow and just chopped a couple in half and took an extra half. That meant increased irritability and maybe impulsivity. On the other hand, impulsivity and hypomaina go together and I have a strong suspicion that it's the real me peeking out, maybe colored by the medication.
Will we ever know? This has been my theme song since I started on this board.
I'd really like to know how you guys think your personalities have been affected by Topamax.
Good morning.
rainy
Posted by headachequeen on October 31, 2004, at 9:51:06
In reply to Re: Redirect: mountains and snow » Dr. Bob, posted by rainy on October 30, 2004, at 7:28:15
> Hey, we're missing messages! Like Kat's observations about how hard it can be to talk to a therapist and my nosy response about her nerves, and Bridgey's description of the NC Fall. Frankly, that wasn't much about medication either and it didn't get redirected--life's not fair.
> Your comments, Kat, about it being easier to talk about ourselves here than face to face with a "real" person are interesting--I think it's a matter of trust in either case and it certainly takes longer in a room full of people than on a board. Here, our body language doesn't give us away, or help us express ourselves,for one thing and there's no way to really converse.
> Stresser, I hope you didn't read me as saying I understand eating disorders to be caused by parents. I don't think anybody does. I am hypothesizing, again from what I've read and my own experience, that it can be useful to have a kind, informed competant adult, who's emotionally divorced from the situation, on board as well as the pdoc. I may be way out of date and I still think we're on the wrong board for this discussion. I babbled you last night--any luck?
> And now, to quote Forrest Gump, that's all I've got to say (and it wasn't about medication either.) Well, not quite all.
> It occured to me that the post wherein I suggested that Sresser and I try another babble and then immediately went full force ahead to share my opinion about therapy etc might have been an example of the foot in mouth syndrome that I've been blaming on Topamax.
> Thursday? I began increasing the dose from 300 mgs to 350 but I forgot, forgot, about slow and just chopped a couple in half and took an extra half. That meant increased irritability and maybe impulsivity. On the other hand, impulsivity and hypomaina go together and I have a strong suspicion that it's the real me peeking out, maybe colored by the medication.
> Will we ever know? This has been my theme song since I started on this board.
> I'd really like to know how you guys think your personalities have been affected by Topamax.
> Good morning.
> rainyWHOA !!!!! only in 25 mg increments... that will send you to the grumpys and to eye problems and to all sorts of problems that you do not want to think of.
Rainy, I had not thought of body language... and of facial responses... we talk to therapists or to parents for that matter, and our body language and their body language says sooooo much that sets off the whole world into criticism that may not even be their but that we read...
trust disappears because we imagine things that are not there...another memory appears of the time we worked at a youth camp, some group of sadists came up with the idea of a camp for twelve-to-fifteen-year-old boys and girls -- yes, a co-ed group at that volatile age and when the camp had become a war zone that could not work for some reason, a friend conned me into directing it one year. I of course because, anything I do my husband helps, conned my husband into helping.
There is going to be a reference to trees,
Dr. Bob , but it is vital to the comparison, I promise...
For the first three years we met up with the worst thugs it was ever my privilege to meet, then life calmed and we began to have a youth camp. In the second year we began a clearing in the trees and built a small log cabin. It was a privilege each night for one cabin group to 'sleep out' at that 'cabin', well, around that cabin.
There was precious little sleeping and a lot of talking, and we always saw to it that there was extra adult staff sleeping out at Cabin 10 so that the staff camper ratio was almost matched.
In the dark there were no faces-- and now Rainy you have hit upon it, there was no body language, and total trust...
one young girl told me one night that she almost didn't come back...totally... these children and some of them may have been fifteen but they were children, talked to staffers about the things that bothered them most and deepest. They would sort out their sleeping bags nearest the staffer or staffers they trusted most and the conversations in the dark carried on long into the night....
Body language was missing...
It went on for years until I realised that I was really getting too old to sleep on the ground
and I really miss it...
now some of our Cabin ten survivors carry on the tradition...
Facelesseness I figured was important but
Body language
I had never picked up on that one
thank you
kat
Posted by headachequeen on October 31, 2004, at 9:51:06
In reply to Re: Redirect: mountains and snow » Dr. Bob, posted by rainy on October 30, 2004, at 7:28:15
> Hey, we're missing messages! Like Kat's observations about how hard it can be to talk to a therapist and my nosy response about her nerves, and Bridgey's description of the NC Fall. Frankly, that wasn't much about medication either and it didn't get redirected--life's not fair.
> Your comments, Kat, about it being easier to talk about ourselves here than face to face with a "real" person are interesting--I think it's a matter of trust in either case and it certainly takes longer in a room full of people than on a board. Here, our body language doesn't give us away, or help us express ourselves,for one thing and there's no way to really converse.
> Stresser, I hope you didn't read me as saying I understand eating disorders to be caused by parents. I don't think anybody does. I am hypothesizing, again from what I've read and my own experience, that it can be useful to have a kind, informed competant adult, who's emotionally divorced from the situation, on board as well as the pdoc. I may be way out of date and I still think we're on the wrong board for this discussion. I babbled you last night--any luck?
> And now, to quote Forrest Gump, that's all I've got to say (and it wasn't about medication either.) Well, not quite all.
> It occured to me that the post wherein I suggested that Sresser and I try another babble and then immediately went full force ahead to share my opinion about therapy etc might have been an example of the foot in mouth syndrome that I've been blaming on Topamax.
> Thursday? I began increasing the dose from 300 mgs to 350 but I forgot, forgot, about slow and just chopped a couple in half and took an extra half. That meant increased irritability and maybe impulsivity. On the other hand, impulsivity and hypomaina go together and I have a strong suspicion that it's the real me peeking out, maybe colored by the medication.
> Will we ever know? This has been my theme song since I started on this board.
> I'd really like to know how you guys think your personalities have been affected by Topamax.
> Good morning.
> rainy
It took some searching and I am not good at that these days but I have found the missing messages... considering the missing ones were related to the topics were are discussing it is most confusing that they are moved actually...
go to
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/social/20041026/msgs/408991.htmlthis is where they were redirected...
not sure how to find the social otherwise...
or how to redirect serious stuff back either...
Posted by stresser on October 31, 2004, at 11:18:46
In reply to Re: Redirect: mountains and snow, posted by headachequeen on October 30, 2004, at 15:16:49
I don't know how to re-direct anything either, so I just check the social board for your posts. I just babble mailed myself, and it didn't work. It said it worked, but nothing arrived. What do I do? -L
Posted by rainy on October 31, 2004, at 12:12:54
In reply to Re: Redirect: mountains and snow, posted by stresser on October 31, 2004, at 11:18:46
quick, stresser, I just babbled you and it said congragtulations, your mail SEEMS to have been sent successfully. Also I gave you my e-mail address again--somebody must be having a wonderful time.
Kat, Redscarlett, Merry, Iris2, Lorilu, any of you guys out there, pleaase read the directions in Bob's post about redirecting messages. I went to the links suggested and they are like another language--I don't understand a word. Stresser, I think you said you had the same problem with written directions. Also vocabulary--how do you "book mark" something?
Bob, I apologize that this isn't about meds, but I'd like to learn to use this board appropriately and easily.
rainy, the computer unnerd
Posted by Dr. Bob on October 31, 2004, at 22:59:37
In reply to Re: Redirect: mountains and snow » stresser, posted by rainy on October 31, 2004, at 12:12:54
> I went to the links suggested and they are like another language--I don't understand a word.
Sorry about that. But I'm glad you made it here anyway!
> Also vocabulary--how do you "book mark" something?
Maybe you have "favorites" instead of "bookmarks"?
Bob
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