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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Dr. Bob on August 1, 2001, at 12:02:35
[Posted by Neal on August 1, 2001, at 1:49:41]
> Cam, like all of us, occasionally needs a break from this board. He'll probably be back sometime soon.
Posted by Gracie2 on August 3, 2001, at 3:00:40
In reply to Redirected: Cam Come Back!, posted by Dr. Bob on August 1, 2001, at 12:02:35
Come on, Cam, give us a break. You decide that we're a pack of idiots, and you leave. A bunch of people beg you to come back, so you return until someone else pisses you off and you leave again.
A lot of people here like and respect you, including me, but we're here because we're hurt and confused and we need help, and our social graces may be lacking. I know it's hard to overlook and if you don't want the responsibility
of being the resident pharmacist, if you would rather talk about your own pain or never deal with us again, please say so.
-Graceless
P.S. to everyone reading - according to those who have suffered near-death experiences, prayers from the living help those in the afterlife. Please say a prayer for Cam's daughter and the 250 soldiers from the 502nd Infantry who were killed in a military aircrash on their way home for Christmas after a 6-month peace-keeping tour in the Sinai. May God bless them and keep them until we see them again.
Posted by Cam W. on August 3, 2001, at 10:32:30
In reply to Re: Redirected: Cam Come Back!, posted by Gracie2 on August 3, 2001, at 3:00:40
Gracie - I am having a hard time with all the shit surrounding issues of grief. The best advice I get is, "Time will heal". That really doesn't help me keep a job or keep me from doing stupid things. The court cases, lawyers, bosses, confusion, aggravation, self-doubt, anger, insecurity, lost feeling, what-ifs, words unsaid, things undone, those hurting around me, helplessness, futility, what next, why bother....
I find that I have trouble opening up to psychotherapists (probably haven't found the right one) or even good friends. I am not a religious person in any sense of the word; nor will I ever be. I have trouble holding onto false hope. My dreams are shattered. I also have guilt because I cannot "buck-up" and be there for my wife and 6 year-old (who are also hurting, and there is nothing I can do to "fix it".)
There is no joy in Muddville.
Sincerely, Cam.
Posted by Gracie2 on August 3, 2001, at 14:11:20
In reply to Re: Grief » Gracie2, posted by Cam W. on August 3, 2001, at 10:32:30
Cam-
Please accept my apologies for my last post; I was out of bounds. It was late, I was getting depressed, and sometimes I miss my brother so much that my heart physically aches. We were very close. Even worse, my own mother blames his death on me ("He wouldn't have joined the Army if you hadn't...") I know that, in her own grief, she did not know what she was saying, and I know it's not true. Still, it is a staggering load for me to carry.
I do not belong to any organized religion, but I have to believe that I will see Shayne again someday. I just have to believe that. I talk to him every day, and I tell myself that he can hear me. Prehaps it's true, or prehaps I'm certifiable.
Either way, I had no invitation or any right to comment on your daughter, and I am truely sorry.
-Gracie
Posted by medlib on August 3, 2001, at 17:46:19
In reply to Re: Grief » Gracie2, posted by Cam W. on August 3, 2001, at 10:32:30
Cam--
Please stop trying to get your ducks in a row--adult ducks don't do that, unless they're migrating away... An alternative might be to stop trying to be the former Cam altogether.
It's absolutely necessary to become numb to survive the extended logistical horrors of death. Fortunately, SSRIs (not to mention benzos and tranqs) do a good job enabling that state of suspension. Having turned your emotions off for a while, it's hardly surprising that you can't just turn on the right emotions to the right person at the right time. You don't expect that of a *car*; why should the human machinery be different?
Instead of trying to be strong for your family, you might consider beginning to let yourself need them. Children, in particular, find it very empowering to be of value to a parent. It needn't be anything more than asking for a hug, or a hand-holding walk, or putting your head in *her* lap.
I believe that the death of dreams is an inevitable part of life. Some are lingering losses--"I guess I'll never be..." Others are sudden and traumatic--a career-ending injury, death of a loved one. One of the hardest to give up is the illusion that you're powerful enough to *make* something happen for yourself or someone you care for, if you just want it enough. Whatever and however it's lost, if it was important, the same question remains; "What good is life if it doesn't include that?" If time heals, maybe it does so by giving us the opportunity to figure out what we can do with what's left. Perhaps rebuilding yourself is a bit like confronting a whole closet of old clothes: you try on one piece at a time, seeing what still fits, if anything; what you still like enough to wear again; and what you're ready to consign to the past. What you end up with may not be much, but now there's space for new stuff.
If being PB's pharmacist doesn't fit you right now, feel free to pack it away for another season or relegate it to the past--with our thanks. It's just one piece. If you feel like trying on a few others here, have at it; no one can see what you don't want to expose, and you run little risk of hearing anything therapeutic (except accidentally).
Cleaning out closets (psychic or otherwise) takes time. (Hell, I haven't unpacked all the boxes from my mother's house after 2+ years! Of course, she lived in that house for 49 years and never threw anything away. Some of us are just more deliberate than others, too.) Be patient with yourself and trust others to do likewise.
Pax vobiscum---medlib
P.S. Lurking is okay, too; just remember to call home occasionally.
Posted by Cam W. on August 3, 2001, at 20:04:02
In reply to Re: Grief » Cam W., posted by medlib on August 3, 2001, at 17:46:19
medlib - Thanks, you've been tremendously helpful to me; now and in the past (still embarrassed about the answer I gave to the runner who was starting Zyprexa). You do make a lot of sense; and yes, I need to find a "new normal". Some things need to be thrown out, but PB isn't one of them. I have learned too much clinical insight from this board, even when giving answers. Ultimately, this does enhance my knowledge base and makes me better at my job (even though my boss thinks I an a dangerous psychotic and will not let me fill prescriptions in his stores because my depression would be a hazard to the customers. Actually, I have been at work for 3 weeks now and he has not returned any of my calls, but passed messages through the other staff. Watch out, I might do something crazy!).
Peace be with you as well, my white kni... er ... fair maiden.
Sincerely, Cam
Posted by Lorraine on August 5, 2001, at 10:23:20
In reply to Re: Grief » medlib, posted by Cam W. on August 3, 2001, at 20:04:02
Cam: I don't know you, although I have read your posts for the past 6 months. Recently, I met Neal (an "oldtimer") and he told me about your loss. As a parent of two, I know that I cannot imagine, cannot let myself imagine, the loss of a child and my heart goes out to you. I found a website written by a parent who about surviving the loss of a child and I thought it might be useful for you:
http://adrr.com/living/sloss.htm
I hope it is helpful for you.
Posted by Cam W. on August 5, 2001, at 14:47:01
In reply to Re: Grief » Cam W., posted by Lorraine on August 5, 2001, at 10:23:20
> Cam: I don't know you, although I have read your posts for the past 6 months. Recently, I met Neal (an "oldtimer") and he told me about your loss. As a parent of two, I know that I cannot imagine, cannot let myself imagine, the loss of a child and my heart goes out to you. I found a website written by a parent who about surviving the loss of a child and I thought it might be useful for you:
>
> http://adrr.com/living/sloss.htm
>
> I hope it is helpful for you.
Posted by mair on August 5, 2001, at 22:13:50
In reply to Re: Grief » Cam W., posted by medlib on August 3, 2001, at 17:46:19
>Medlib - yours was one of those posts I'd like to be able to reread from time to time. How apt and well written. Thanks
Mair
Posted by medlib on August 7, 2001, at 4:24:05
In reply to Re: Grief » medlib, posted by mair on August 5, 2001, at 22:13:50
Hi Mair--
What a delightful surprise!. I'm happy that something I posted was of value to you; it was very kind of you to take the trouble to let me know.
Being from the planet Asperger, managing to communicate successfully is an infrequent, always accidental experience for me. Such an event used to impel me into fits of analysis, trying to determine what had "worked". I was pursuing the dream I'd had since early childhood that one day I'd figure out how people made connections with one another. It was obvious early on that I was "other"; not until a lifetime later, when I discovered that it had a name and other inhabitants (which I learned from dj here on Babble), was I able finally to bury that dream and move on.
At first, I stopped posting, thinking that, if it served no purpose, why bother? Eventually, I was able to post what I wanted to, when I was moved to do so, because I could. If something I post happens to make contact, it's a lovely bonus.
Anyway, that's how what I wrote applies to me (sorry, I realize you didn't ask). Thanks for the rainbow!---medlib
Posted by medlib on August 7, 2001, at 4:42:49
In reply to Re: Grief » mair, posted by medlib on August 7, 2001, at 4:24:05
Hi--
Good grief! Last night I tried to post a reply to Willow, who was wondering if she was the only one online; my post was lost because Dr. Bob had shut down the board. Tonight the board rolls over before I can post my thank you. I would *not* have posted what I did had I known it would top a new board. I know that I compose very slowly, but I must be even slower on the uptake. Clearly, I am supposed to shut up.
"Message received, Houston. Over and out."---medlib
Posted by Willow on August 7, 2001, at 6:43:45
In reply to Re: Grief » mair, posted by medlib on August 7, 2001, at 4:24:05
> What a delightful surprise!. I'm happy that something I posted was of value to you;
Medlib, contributions like yours are the "meat and potatoes" of this board. There are a few babblers posts I read even if the thread isn't applicable to me and you are for sure one of them.
BEST WISHES
Willowps the mirapex is going to be a no go for me. migraines starting from it. : (
it is working though for better energy despite insomnia. only been a couple weeks almost.
Posted by sar on August 7, 2001, at 22:00:03
In reply to Re: Grief » medlib, posted by mair on August 5, 2001, at 22:13:50
Dear Cam,
i'v been on pb (& mostly psb) for 6 months or so and have always appreciated your professional responses. i'm very sorry about your loss...i can't imagine how it feels. i hope you are well.
please know that you are appreciated by more people than you realize.
heart crying,
sar
This is the end of the thread.
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