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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 14 of 14. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Meri-Tuuli on August 28, 2005, at 14:29:58
Hey Link,
I read on PB that you use exercise for its AD effects. I totally agree that exercise is really important. However, I was wondering what kind of exercise and for how long/intensity do you think its best.
best wishes
Meri-Tuuli
Posted by linkadge on August 28, 2005, at 17:27:34
In reply to Question for Link - exercise, posted by Meri-Tuuli on August 28, 2005, at 14:29:58
I generally jog for depression. There is some fairly conclusive evidence of its AD effects on multiple levels.
Enhanced neurogenesis, enhanced monaminergic function, increased 5-ht1a receptor expression, decreased cortisol responces, increased opiate functions, PEA increase, increased levels of nerve growth factors BDNF, GDNF, NGF, NT-3, increased anandamide levels (marajuanna like compound), improved sleep archetecture, the list goes on.
The most beneficial effects seem to be gained from aerobic exercise. The more the better up to a point.
Excessive exercise can depleat certain vitamins and minerals, so take supplements if undergoing intense exercise.
I find that 1/2 hour will provide a noticable improvement in my condition in about 3 weeks. Some benefits will be seen right away (some antianxiety effects) while others (antidepressant effects) can take longer.If you can jog, work up to 30 minautes if possable, if 45 then better. If jogging is not possable, brisk walking, swimming biking etc, will still provide many of the benefits. Weight lifting does not seem to be linked to the same biochemical effect as aerobic exercise.
I personally aim for 45 minautes a day, but my depression can benefit for upto about 1.5 hours. (split up through day).
Linkadge
Posted by Meri-Tuuli on August 29, 2005, at 4:51:52
In reply to Re: Question for Link - exercise, posted by linkadge on August 28, 2005, at 17:27:34
Hi Link -- thanks for the post.
I can jog for 30 minutes, but trouble is, I get soooooooooo bored and distracted and usually give up. I have no motivation whatsoever! I have gone jogging with some gals from work which has taught me that I can actually physically jog, its just that by myself I get distracted/bored. Plus by myself I always feel really self conscious!
I also walk into work each day ~25mins but I guess I really need to do more exercise - heart rising stuff.
Meri-Tuuli
Posted by linkadge on August 29, 2005, at 9:09:46
In reply to Re: Question for Link - exercise, posted by Meri-Tuuli on August 29, 2005, at 4:51:52
I got a MP3 player, and listen to my favorite tunes, that keeps me going.
Linkadge
Posted by JLx on August 29, 2005, at 9:56:55
In reply to Re: Question for Link - exercise, posted by Meri-Tuuli on August 29, 2005, at 4:51:52
I walk listening to unabridged recorded books on tape or CD that I get from the library. Most are not just read but in effect, acted, as the narrators vary voices and tone to distinguish characters or mood. Excellent for passing the time and motivation.
JL
Posted by linkadge on August 29, 2005, at 10:50:21
In reply to Re: Question for Link - exercise » Meri-Tuuli, posted by JLx on August 29, 2005, at 9:56:55
And the cool thing is that when you are running, you are experiencing enhanced neurogenesis, so listening to books on tape could possably serve to direct these new neurons to more indivudualized learning.
Sometimes I find that when exercising, my worst fears start to solve themselves. The new connections are brimming, and I can often see problems from an entirely different angle.
Linkadge
Posted by john berk on August 29, 2005, at 11:45:05
In reply to Re: Question for Link - exercise » JLx, posted by linkadge on August 29, 2005, at 10:50:21
Hi link.
that is extremly interesting!! i run also, and the enhanced mental clarity, especilly right after a run, is amazing!! exercise is a big part of coping with depression for me!!
the other benefits you mentioned will be icing on the cake, rt. on!!! peace..john
Posted by linkadge on August 29, 2005, at 11:55:32
In reply to Re: Question for Link - exercise, posted by john berk on August 29, 2005, at 11:45:05
Oh goodness, I could go on and on.
The following link shows the effect of exercise, antidepressants, and their combination on BDNF expression in hippocampal cell feilds.
The combined antidepressant and exercise provided to most robust increase in BDNF, but what I found the *most* interesting was that exercise alone appears to be more effective than antidepressant alone, at least in terms of neurogenesis (which some propose to be the end target of any effective AD treatment)
What I get from this study is that you're better off out jogging on no antidepressant, than you are sitting on the couch and popping a pill.
http://www.nature.com/npp/journal/v21/n5/fig_tab/1395383f1.html
Linkadge
Posted by Meri-Tuuli on August 29, 2005, at 12:27:56
In reply to Re: Question for Link - exercise, posted by linkadge on August 29, 2005, at 11:55:32
Wow links, thats pretty impressive - I have also heard on the news recently that exercise is as effective as ADs for mild depression.
I suppose some exercise is better than none, but personally I find that it needs to be quite intensely aerobic for it to work effectively.
So I guess I should try to aim for 30-45 mins a day for five days/week do you reckon?
Meri
x
Posted by john berk on August 29, 2005, at 13:17:40
In reply to Re: Question for Link - exercise, posted by Meri-Tuuli on August 29, 2005, at 12:27:56
Hi!! for a full endorphin release response from running, i was told to run at least the last quarter mile as quickly as possible!!
it is true, the harder you push, the more the benefit as far as endorphin release, but even hard walking can produce results. it all depends on one's fitness level.
when i was running in 5k races, i found that i only felt a good "rush" if in practice i went under a 6 minute mile during my long runs.
of course this quicly lead to burnout, lol, so now i just combine walking and running, and feel quite well. i still get that feel good rush most times!! and the health benefits are enormous!!
good luck...john
Posted by linkadge on August 29, 2005, at 14:36:59
In reply to Re: Question for Link - exercise, posted by Meri-Tuuli on August 29, 2005, at 12:27:56
It certainly would not hurt, and if you have a mental illness there is a good chance it could help.
Linkadge
Posted by linkadge on August 29, 2005, at 14:39:39
In reply to Re: Question for Link - exercise » Meri-Tuuli, posted by john berk on August 29, 2005, at 13:17:40
Yeah, I have used exercise and abused exercise.
I think the best amount of exercise is an amount that you know you can sustain, and you know isn't hurting you.
Linkadge
Posted by alohashirt on August 31, 2005, at 22:09:22
In reply to Re: Question for Link - exercise, posted by linkadge on August 29, 2005, at 14:39:39
I have had problems with motivation and exercise for most of my adult life. As a kid I used to ride horses and swim. As an adult I have gone to gyms which I find tedious beyond belief.
I have always been a closet boxing fan and 18 months ago started exercising at a boxing gym. It is amazing fun, constantly challenging and I feel as though I am learning something. Jumping rope is hard. I go to a gym that is explicitly for recreational boxers and so there is a mix of people of all ages, perhaps 40% women. Perhaps because it's just so darn hard there is a cameraderie that I haven't seen at a gym before - a sense of shared pain and perspiration. It's a wonderful mood changer and stress reducer though its meant I've had to buy a whole new wardrobe of clothes. See http://trinityboxing.com
Posted by linkadge on September 3, 2005, at 7:22:15
In reply to Re: Question for Link - exercise, posted by alohashirt on August 31, 2005, at 22:09:22
Thats great, stick to it and you'll continue to reap the benifits.
Linkadge
This is the end of the thread.
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