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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Hugh on October 9, 2019, at 9:13:09
Extremely low doses of phenytoin could help some people with depression and anxiety -- and many other ailments. Phenytoin (Dilantin) is an anticonvulsant that has been used to treat epilepsy for over 80 years.
Philip Bird, an Australian physician, thinks that low doses of phenytoin may enhance GABA neurotransmission, thereby correcting the imbalance between the GABAergic and glutaminergic systems.
In this patent application, Bird discusses the use of ultra-low-dose phenytoin to treat dementia, reading disorder, ADHD, acquired brain injury, visual fatigue, autism, PTSD, schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, chronic pain, tinnitus.
https://patents.google.com/patent/EP2729216A1
If you scroll to the bottom, Bird lists numerous examples (case reports). For most of them, the ideal dose of phenytoin appears to be 2-3 mg. Some patients responded better to a dose of 1 mg. One patient responded best to 0.5 mg. One patient responded best to 0.1 mg.
Posted by Lamdage22 on October 9, 2019, at 10:29:38
In reply to Ultra-low-dose phenytoin may enhance GABA, posted by Hugh on October 9, 2019, at 9:13:09
Thanks so much for sharing. I have never heard of it and will do some research. Can I drive my car on it?
Posted by Lamdage22 on October 9, 2019, at 12:40:18
In reply to Re: Ultra-low-dose phenytoin may enhance GABA, posted by Lamdage22 on October 9, 2019, at 10:29:38
It sounds like its really worth a shot. How did the anecdotal patients get their physicians to prescribe it?
Posted by Hugh on October 10, 2019, at 11:05:35
In reply to Re: Ultra-low-dose phenytoin may enhance GABA, posted by Lamdage22 on October 9, 2019, at 10:29:38
> Thanks so much for sharing. I have never heard of it and will do some research. Can I drive my car on it?
You're welcome. There would be no problem driving on it.
Posted by Hugh on October 10, 2019, at 11:15:20
In reply to Re: Ultra-low-dose phenytoin may enhance GABA, posted by Lamdage22 on October 9, 2019, at 12:40:18
> It sounds like its really worth a shot. How did the anecdotal patients get their physicians to prescribe it?
The physician who prescribed it in the case reports is an Australian named Philip Bird.
I'm not sure if this holds true where you live in Germany, but in the US, drugs that have been approved by the FDA can be prescribed by any physician for off-label purposes. (This doesn't mean that any physician would be willing to do this.)
Philip Bird uses ultra-low-dose phenytoin prepared by compounding pharmacies. You could check with compounding pharmacies in your area and ask them if they can provide the names of physicians who use their services.
Posted by Lamdage22 on October 11, 2019, at 3:30:25
In reply to Re: Ultra-low-dose phenytoin may enhance GABA » Lamdage22, posted by Hugh on October 10, 2019, at 11:15:20
Does it need to be taken sublingually or is taking it by mouth fine?
Posted by Lamdage22 on October 11, 2019, at 3:56:32
In reply to Ultra-low-dose phenytoin may enhance GABA, posted by Hugh on October 9, 2019, at 9:13:09
Once daily?
Posted by Hugh on October 11, 2019, at 11:44:04
In reply to Re: Ultra-low-dose phenytoin may enhance GABA, posted by Lamdage22 on October 11, 2019, at 3:30:25
> Does it need to be taken sublingually or is taking it by mouth fine?
Either way is fine.
Posted by Hugh on October 11, 2019, at 11:45:01
In reply to Re: Ultra-low-dose phenytoin may enhance GABA, posted by Lamdage22 on October 11, 2019, at 3:56:32
> Once daily?
Most people take it once daily.
Posted by Lamdage22 on October 11, 2019, at 11:57:50
In reply to Re: Ultra-low-dose phenytoin may enhance GABA » Lamdage22, posted by Hugh on October 11, 2019, at 11:44:04
That's cool. I have a good feeling about this stuff. Its safer than trying really new meds that haven't been around for very long. I will try to get it and will let you guys know how i do when i succeed
Posted by Hugh on October 11, 2019, at 15:04:53
In reply to Re: Ultra-low-dose phenytoin may enhance GABA, posted by Lamdage22 on October 11, 2019, at 11:57:50
> That's cool. I have a good feeling about this stuff. Its safer than trying really new meds that haven't been around for very long. I will try to get it and will let you guys know how i do when i succeed
I'd suggest starting with a very low dose -- maybe 1 mg or even lower. Good luck.
Posted by Lamdage22 on October 12, 2019, at 10:33:33
In reply to Re: Ultra-low-dose phenytoin may enhance GABA » Lamdage22, posted by Hugh on October 11, 2019, at 15:04:53
Thanks. This board sure is quiet nowadays. It's a pity. I guess we are a TRD forum more so than a social anxiety forum. Is that why no one is responding?
Posted by Ruuudy on October 28, 2019, at 14:36:13
In reply to Re: Ultra-low-dose phenytoin may enhance GABA, posted by Lamdage22 on October 12, 2019, at 10:33:33
Did anyone ever give low-dose phenytoin a try?
Really curious.Rudy
Posted by Lamdage22 on October 28, 2019, at 14:57:43
In reply to Re: Ultra-low-dose phenytoin may enhance GABA, posted by Ruuudy on October 28, 2019, at 14:36:13
No, I did not. I didn't have a chance to speak to my doctor yet. I have a feeling he won't be thrilled. Something happens and he is the bad guy because I don't have Epilepsy
Posted by Lamdage22 on February 12, 2020, at 6:40:45
In reply to Re: Ultra-low-dose phenytoin may enhance GABA, posted by Ruuudy on October 28, 2019, at 14:36:13
So i met with a doctor yesterday. He sounds like he is absolutely willing to prescribe off-label meds. He drew alot of blood and had some exiting ideas about possible biological causes of my psychological problems and how to fix them.
I will keep you posted.
Posted by Hugh on February 19, 2020, at 10:32:07
In reply to I think i have a source of Phenytoin, posted by Lamdage22 on February 12, 2020, at 6:40:45
It will be interesting to hear about your experiences with phenytoin. Good luck.
This is the end of the thread.
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