Posted by Larry Hoover on November 28, 2004, at 10:45:21
In reply to Unfortunatley -Larry Hoover, posted by MCK on November 27, 2004, at 17:18:09
> As the daughter of a poultry farmer, (and now a vegetarian) I'm quite surprised that you could make such an assertion, unless you've worked on a poultry farm very recently for a good long time!
Broiler farming, where I come from, is a very automated process. Efficiencies are measured in tenths of a percent of feed conversion. The birds are not confined until being trasported, having been held in open sheds on deep litter. There is no opportunity for gavage. Poor converters of feed are culled, not force-fed. That's too labour intensive, with diminished return for an already poor converter of feed. I hate to make it look like an economics issue, but that's the nature of the game. The birds are only kept for 6-8 weeks, the shed is cleaned, and a new batch of chicks is brought in.
> Sadly, force feeding is used, not always, (with Turkeys it is usually) but you bet it is! When those chickens and turkeys need to be fattened up in a hurry for market there is no other way. Stomach injuries ocurr but more common are tears to the neck and throat.
I did not mean to imply that it never happened. I can only imagine what economic pressures might make such a labour-intensive process worthwhile when carcass weight/lipid content is the issue. Foie gras is a high-value product, but even those producers take cost-cutting measures to an extreme (the whole animal welfare argument, well-founded), to maintain profitability. I want to reiterate. I do not support the practise. It is abhorrent.
> My father doesn't like to do this, and neither do most of the "farmers" he knows, but in order to keep the price down and make a living he feels he has no other choice, drastic changes have happened in farming even in the last few years.
I cannot imagine the process is commonplace. That's where we are going to have to accept our differences. The age-old practise of gavage or force-feeding was developed to mimic a natural process in migratory waterfowl. Just before initiating the migratory flight, the birds would habitually gorge themselves, increasing the fat content of the breast (in particular), and the liver. This was a genetic adaptation which permitted extended flight periods. This adaptation is seen in ducks and geese, the same birds still used for foie gras production.
Chickens and turkeys and other domestic fowl are non-migratory. They are susceptible to fatty infiltration of the liver, as are all animals (including ourselves), but they do not have the same magnitude of response as do migratory waterfowl.
> Even chicken catching as you referred to is not the same in most places. The chickens are usually just grabbed by their feet straight out of a crate and don't need to be caught, they didn't have anywhere to go!
The birds I'm talking about are not confined in any respect (other than by the shed walls), except for transport to slaughter.
> Some have been forced in one place so long their feet have grown over the wire at the bottom of the cage--they "can't" eat out of a trough.
Are you talking about laying hens?
> Groups like P.E.T.A don't haveto exaggerate the abuses that happen in farming unfortunately, I wish they did. I've learned that one can always assume the worst is true.Oh dear. Some people are murderers. Because I'm a people, am I a murderer?
There are farmers who ought not to be farmers. The exceptional cases ought not to be used to taint the reputations of the remainder.
I'm on a first name basis with my butcher. I've been on the kill floor. I know what he does for me, and I eat the meat he processes, in full knowledge of what he has contracted to do on my behalf. I have no illusions about what I am consuming.
> I'm not criticizing all farmers, I believe they are victims too,
I think you are doing so.
> and many times it's the hired workers who through carelessness or cruelty cause much needless suffering.
I don't recommend chicken catching as a career move. Have you ever tried holding seven chickens at one time, and trying to get them into a plastic crate without any getting away? You can only manage it by not exciting the birds, strange as that may seem. That's how we do it hereabouts, based on my personal knowledge.
> You mentioned no matter how many Peta articles say so it's not true that poultry is force fed.
Our divergence in belief is an issue of frequency, not of absolute existence of the practise. I believe it is far less common than it is alleged to be.
> Well maybe you won't believe this farmers daughter either, but it doesn't change the unfortunate facts.
I believe you.
> I'm not speaking for all farms or all farmers. I'm speaking about poultry factory farms,
> which may at one time resembled a friendly family farm, but do so no more.The factory farms I've been to don't resemble what you describe, in any respect.
Lar
poster:Larry Hoover
thread:420601
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/social/20041122/msgs/421254.html