Posted by bleauberry on November 7, 2009, at 5:54:59
In reply to Re: Mercury, posted by Montag on November 6, 2009, at 3:15:42
> Im fairly certain I have mercury toxicity. Ive had brain fog for years, Ive eaten a ton of seafood, and a recent hair analysis showed somewhat elevated levels of the metal. Plus I managed recently to aggravate the brain fog in two abortive attemps at chelation. In the first, I took a mere ten drops of cilantro tincture (one time) along with large doses of chlorella. In the second, I took about 30 mg. of DMSA three times a day for two days (with no regard for the 4-hour rule). In each case the brain fog spiked so alarmingly that I lost my nerve and quit the process. My reaction to these substances tells me that I must be carrying excessive mercury.
I think you have done some amazing detective work. Your experience is 100% accurate with anyone else who has been mercury toxic and/or lead toxic.
The fact that it is in your hair is actually a plus...it means the toxicity has not advanced so badly that it is no longer in your hair...long story...with chronic high level longterm toxicity, mercury displaces even itself from getting into the hair...and thus accidental negative lab results...and many other good metals in the hair are either nonexistent or widely skewed in strange abnormal patterns. Your toxicity does not appear to have advanced that far, but regardless, appears serious based on your DMSA challenge.
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> The recommendations in your posting make good sense, and Im going to try the DMSA again in the way that you outline. Here are my questions:Recommendations come from the excellent book Amalgam Illness by Phd Andrew Cutler. Archives of his writings can also be found in google searches, autism forums, and omnibasu files.
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> 1. My DMSA experiment was only a few days ago, and the brain-fog spike has not yet completely subsided. Do you think I should wait until I feel normal before starting in again? In general, how long did you wait after becoming ill on a too-large dose before starting again on a smaller one?My own experience is that I had to wait until I knew I had returned to my baseline again. If I jumped in too soon, it just got bad again real fast.
People find their own schedule. Some 3 days on, 11 days off; 4 days on, 3 days off; 7 days on, 7 days off; one guy just went everyday for 3 months straight. My pattern goes like this...I feel a little worse the first day, not much change from that on the second day, third day I feel better than I have felt in a long time, 4th day also good but not as good as the 3rd, 5th starting to feel I'm slipping, and by day 6 I am ready to call it quits. Then I wait...maybe a week, maybe 2 weeks, maybe a month, and then do it again. Everyone will find their own comfort zone schedule.
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> 2. You say that once the right DMSA dose has been hit upon, the length of the rounds and the time between rounds should vary according to how one feels. What sorts of reactions should I be looking for? If the dose is appropriately small, and if one is taking steps (as I will) to prevent candida growth, will the metals still accumulate and start making me feel terrible, and is this the sign to take a break? And then is it just a matter of waiting until the symptoms clear before starting up again? (I notice that some doctors recommend a three-days-on, eleven-days-off approach, but then theyre always assuming much higher doses of DMSA.)The lower the dose, the longer you can tolerate rounds. It is not unusual in chelation forums for people to be at 3mg, 6mg, or 12.5mg for starters. Any more is just too hard and they can feel it. As the toxic burden gently comes down with the low doses, higher doses can be tolerated. Me, I started at 25mg. Way too much. 12.5mg, still too much but do-able. 6mg, better. 3mg, not enough. I think my best results came with 12.5mg.
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> 3. How many rounds had you done before you finally started noticing an improvement in your longstanding symptoms? (And was brain fog ever a part of your picture?)I've done only 12 rounds. I never did experience improvement, except during the middle of rounds when I had dramatic stunning improvement. I loved DMSA in the middle of a round. What I didn't know is that I was dealing with Lyme disease and Candida...both major brain fog causers. Removing metals was only part of what needed to be done. A very important crucial part, but by itself was not going to do the job. Most people experience improvement somewhere in the round 20 to round 60 area.
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> 4. I'm going to be taking garlic, MSM, chlorella, minerals, milk thistle, vitamin C, psyllium husk, apple pectin, and N-acetyl cysteine, and an anti-fungal formula as my support protocol. Was there anything else that you found to be indispensable?I think you might find Olive Leaf extract helpful. Though I haven't tried it yet, HuperzineA is supposed to be good for brain fog according to my Lyme MD.
It would be wise to start each supplement one at a time so you know what is doing what. Too much sulfur (garlic, NAC) could be either a good thing or a bad thing...everyone responds differently to sulfur.
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> 5. You mentioned Dr. Cutlers book, and Im aware of his claim that DMSA cannot chelate mercury from the brain. Does your experience support this? If DMSA really cannot cross the blood-brain barrier, its hard to see how it could alleviate depression or aggravate brain-fog symptoms. (Surely those results indicate that it's doing SOMETHING inside the brain.) Anyway, if it doesnt cross the BBB, does that mean I should expect no relief from brain fog on DMSA alone?My experience tells me that DMSA definitely without any doubt does something in the brain. It "feels" like it takes mercury/lead out of the brain, if you ask me. I can't describe it. I disagree with Cutler on that issue. Also, he is assuming that the blood brain barrier is healthy and intact...which in the case of Lyme disease and/or mercury damage, it may not be healthy or intact. Maybe DMSA cannot get through a healthy BBB, but can get through a compromised one? That's my feeling.
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> 6. What approach did you take with cilantro, and what kind of experience did you have?I ate it raw by a mouthful once a day, while on DMSA. I was fearful of stirring up too much. I really didn't feel anything from it. I did like Chlorella and DMSA combination. It felt better than DMSA alone.
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> I dont know how much of all that you can answer, but Id appreciate anything you can tell me. I live in Japan, so unfortunately I have to do this on my own without the help of a physician. Reading posts like yours makes me feel its possible to pull it off, but of course the whole thing makes a little nervous. Id love to get Cutlers book, but my god, that thing is expensive. Anyway, Im sorry for the length of this posting; I really didnt mean to go on that long. Thanks very much for your time.Most people are like you...they have to do it alone. Not by choice, but forced into. The medical profession can only do so much. What they know is only a sliver of what needs to be known. Things that actually work are being discovered by real people like you and me, and mothers of Autistic children. They are the ones making the groundbreaking discoveries, not the researchers. In actuality, it is us giving the researchers the right stuff to research. And it's not just mercury. It's Lyme disease, Irritable Bowel Syndrome, Fibromyalgia, Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Alzheimers, Cancer...many of the most profound discoveries and cures are coming not from the labs, but from the people.
When you are backed into a corner with disease, and there is no one that can help you, there is no other choice. That actually is a good thing...it makes us stronger, smarter, wiser, and years from now will advance the entire medical profession as these things trickle into researcher's offices and medical journals.
As a final note, I would bet yeast/Candida is a bigger problem for you right now than you are aware. I would tackle that with the same aggressiveness you do mercury.
I mentioned Olive Leaf. It is broadly microbial. A good thing, but not the reason I mentioned it. Some of the "side" benefits people commonly experience are decrease in brain fog, more energy, less pain, and less depression. It is doing a good job for many people with Fibromyalgia or Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, both of which have brain fog and depression as co-symptoms. It is not a stimulant or an upper, but somehow has a way of uplifting and clearing. Starting dose would be standardized capsules 500mg one three times per day.
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> -- Montag.
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poster:bleauberry
thread:924677
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/alter/20090727/msgs/924824.html