Posted by wendy b. on April 18, 2003, at 22:50:15
In reply to Re: The Best (or The Better?) of Both Worlds?, posted by ayuda on April 18, 2003, at 11:37:45
Dear Grammarians:
Today's Lesson: Plural forms of nouns and their verbs ----
I have been a teacher of all sorts of people, of all ages. Presently, I teach in the public school system. I have taught writing and rhetoric to college students, and graded a ton of essay-type papers over the years. I now do some grant-writing and editing jobs part-time, when I'm not teaching.
I will only tackle the "There's a bunch of other boards here, too" conundrum, because, like Tabitha, that one has always stuck in my craw, and I'm glad it's finally being brought out into the open.
:-]The reason it should be: "There ARE a bunch of other boards..." is because the word "bunch" is standing in for the word "number," or "many," at least in terms of what the word connotes. What is meant is that there are several, so using the substitute - "There are several board here..." - is the way to figure out what kind of verb the noun takes. For example: "Many people ARE commenting on this..." It's relatively common for a word like bunch to take a plural verb.
Taken from a web site on grammar used by students at a community college in Hartford, CT:
______________"... the so called collective nouns, which are singular when we think of them as groups and plural when we think of the individuals acting within the whole (which happens sometimes, but not often).
audience
band
class
committee
crowd
dozen
family
flock
group
heap
herd
jury
kind
lot
[the] number
public
staff
teamThus, if we're talking about eggs, we could say "A dozen is probably not enough." But if we're talking partying with our friends, we could say, "A dozen are coming over this afternoon." The jury delivers its verdict. [But] The jury came in and took their seats. We could say the Tokyo String Quartet is one of the best string ensembles in the world, but we could say the Beatles were some of the most famous singers in history. Generally, band names and musical groups take singular or plural verbs depending on the form of their names: "The Mamas and the Papas were one of the best groups of the 70s" and "Metallica is my favorite band."
Note that "the number" is a singular collective noun. "The number of applicants is steadily increasing." "A number," on the other hand, is a plural form: "There are several students in the lobby. A number are here to see the president."
Collective nouns are count nouns which means they, themselves, can be pluralized: a university has several athletic teams and classes..." [end of quote]
_______________I especially like the example using the word "number," above, which helps explain why Dr Bob's choice of the verb "is," is incorrect.
However, Bob's use of the word "bunch" is fine; it may be colloquial when it's used in reference to people, but not to objects, as in "a bunch of flowers."
Now, it's too bad Beardy isn't here, but we still have a few hacks in the language business on this board...
:-]
Wendy
poster:wendy b.
thread:220096
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20030404/msgs/220510.html