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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 22 of 22. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by munificentexegete on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:30
In reply to Re: Seroquel in low vs high doses » munificentexegete, posted by blueberry1 on February 14, 2007, at 20:46:38
> I bet if I mentioned these tests, or ones that look at receptor function, to any psychiatrist in my area they would give me a blank stare.
exactly. however, I am sure they could run them if they wanted to or if you insisted. I see no reason to distinguish a neurologist from a psychiatrist they are both supposed to deal with mental illness.
Posted by Phillipa on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:30
In reply to Re: Seroquel in low vs high doses, posted by munificentexegete on February 16, 2007, at 21:18:35
Wooo I think their medical degree would determine it as their training is completely different. And so are the amount of years in school. And some neurologists are also surgeons pdocs aren't. I hope you don't consider ECT surgery? Or are you referring to the almost nonexistent lobotomy which any good pdoc would have no part of. Love Phillipa
Posted by Phillipa on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:31
In reply to Re: Seroquel in low vs high doses, posted by munificentexegete on February 16, 2007, at 21:18:35
I think not sure there is a difference in the definition of neurologist and pdoc. Not good at posting threads so google them everyone. Love Phillipa ps I don't mind being wrong BTW
Posted by Phillipa on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:31
In reply to Re: Seroquel in low vs high doses, posted by munificentexegete on February 16, 2007, at 21:18:35
Definitions of neurologist on the Web:
A physician who diagnoses and treats disorders of the nervous system.
www.alz.org/Resources/Glossary.aspA physician who specializes in the nervous system and its disorders.
www.als.net/als101/glossary.aspA doctor who specializes in the diagnosis and treatment of disorders of the nervous system.
www.memorydisorder.org/glossaryterms.htmAn expert in the treatment of disorders of the nerves and nervous system including the central nervous system (brain and spinal cord) and the peripheral nervous system (sensory and motor nerves throughout the body).
www.personal-injury-help-center.org/Glossary_of_Terms.htmlA medical specialist with advanced training in the diagnosis and treatment of diseases of the brain, spinal cord, nerves and muscles.
my.webmd.com/content/article/57/66235.htmA physician specializing in diseases and disorders of the brain, spinal cord, nerves, and muscles, including stroke, Parkinson's disease, epilepsy, Alzheimer's disease, and muscular dystrophy
www.michaeljfox.org/parkinsons/glossary.phpA physician who specializes in the physiologic functions of the brain and nervous system, la. this doctor may run tests if seizures are suspected.
www.azspinabifida.org/gloss.htmlA specialist in disorders of the central nervous system
www.ehealthmd.com/library/carpaltunnel/CT_glossary.htmlA neurologist is a special type of physician who diagnoses and treats disorders of the nervous system. This includes diseases of the brain, spinal cord, nerves, and muscles. A neurologist is trained to perform a detailed examination of all the important neurological structures in the body. This includes the nerves of the head and neck, the muscular strength and movement, sensation, balance testing, ambulation and reflex testing. ...
virtualtrials.com/dictionary.cfmA doctor who sees and treats people with problems of the nervous s
www.monitordodiabetes.com.br/n.htma medical specialist in the nervous system and the disorders affecting it
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwnNeurology is the branch of medicine dealing with the nervous system and its disorders. Physicians specializing in the field of neurology are called neurologists. Surgical operations on the nervous system are performed by physicians with specialized training - neurosurgeons, and in some cases, interventional neuroradiologists.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neurologist
Posted by Phillipa on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:31
In reply to Re: Definition of a Neurologist, posted by Phillipa on February 16, 2007, at 22:22:00
Definitions of psychiatrist on the Web:
a medical doctor who specializes in the diagnosis and treatment of mental disorders.
www.uihealthcare.com/depts/uibehavioralhealth/patiented/glossary.htmllicensed physicians (MD or DO) who specialize in the evaluation, diagnosis, and treatment of mental disorders. Their medical and psychiatric training prepares them to treat adults and children either individually, as part of and involving the family unit, and/or in a group setting. Psychiatrists can prescribe medications, if needed.
www.frankfordhospitals.org/healthinfo/adult/mentalhealth/glossary.htmlAn individual who treats people through counseling to overcome emotional and psychological reactions to an injury or disease. One difference between a psychiatrist and psychologist is that the psychiatrist is a licensed medical doctor can prescribe medication.
www.personal-injury-help-center.org/Glossary_of_Terms.htmlMental health professionals who have had undergone residency and have earned the MD degree. Psychiatrists can prescribe medication.
add.about.com/library/blglossaryp.htmPerson with a degree in medicine (MD) with additional training in psychiatry; the study of mental disorders.
www.addiction-rehabilitation.com/glossary.htmlA specialist in psychiatry, specifically a graduate of a medical school, licensed to practice and to prescribe medications, with postgraduate training in the detection, diagnosis, and treatment of mental and emotional disturbances. The disturbances may be of physical or emotional origin or result from a situational crisis.
www.cmpmhmr.cog.pa.us/glossary.htmSpecialist in the branch of medicine that deals with the diagnosis, treatment, and prevention of mental and emotional disorders
www.singaporemirror.com.sg/ps_medical_def.htmMedical doctor whose specialty is the study and treatment of mental disorders. After receiving the MD degree, a physician spends 4 years as a resident in a hospital setting. When he or she passes the written and oral examinations of the American Board of Psychiatry and Neurology, he or she becomes a diplomate in psychiatry and is said to be Board certified.
depression.about.com/library/glossary/blglossaryindexp.htmProfessional worker who analyses and treats mental disorders and illnesses. Has the same training as a medical doctor then specialises at a hospital. Works in either a private practice or on hospital or clinical staff. [GWD]
www.embassy.org.nz/encycl/p9encyc.htmmeans a physician who by years of study, training and experience has achieved professional recognition and standing in the field of clinical psychiatry.
members.aol.com/StatutesP8/50PA4102.htmlThe term "Psychiatrist" means a person who is legally qualified and licensed to practice psychiatry at the time and place services are rendered to a Covered Person, other than an individual who ordinarily resides in that Covered Person’s home, or who is a member of the Immediate Family.
www.wwcta.org/ins7-def.htmA psychiatrist is a physician who is trained to prescribe medicine and provide counseling to help people deal with psychological and emotional issues.
blackmanlegal.com/CM/CarAccidents/CarAccidents32.aspA fully trained and licensed physician (Medical doctor) who has then completed four (4) years of specialty training and supervision in general psychiatry. General psychiatrists may be certified in psychiatry by the American Board of Psychiatry and Neurology.
www.mhacv.org/Glossary/providers_glossary.htmA physician that specializes in treating mental and emotional disorders.
schizophrenia.atspace.org/glossary/a physician who specializes in psychiatry
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwnPsychiatry is a branch of medicine that studies and treats mental and emotional disorders (see mental illness). While any physician may prescribe the medications used to treat various forms of mental illness, psychiatrists are more extensively trained in differential diagnosis of mental illness and keep up to date on the newest treatment modalities for mental illness. ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychiatrist
Posted by Phillipa on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:31
In reply to Re: Seroquel in low vs high doses, posted by munificentexegete on February 16, 2007, at 21:18:35
Big difference in qualifications wouldn't ya think? Love Phillipa
Posted by munificentexegete on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:31
In reply to Re: Seroquel in low vs high doses » munificentexegete, posted by Phillipa on February 16, 2007, at 23:06:20
> Big difference in qualifications wouldn't ya think? Love Phillipa
Hi Phillipa
Not sure they are all that different...
neurologist:
A physician specializing in diseases and disorders of the brain, spinal cord, nerves, and musclespsychiatrist:
licensed physicians (MD or DO) who specialize in the evaluation, diagnosis, and treatment of mental disorders.a neurologist may treat Parkinson's, epilepsy, and Alzheimer's and so may a psychiatrist.
a neurologist and a psychiatrist can both prescribe a complete range of medication.
a neurologist is also an md and can treat any illness or disease that a psychiatrist can.
Generally speaking the difference seems to be practical, a psychiatrist seems to focus on mental diseases without any pathology, while neurologists tend to focus on mental diseases with a pathology.
However i see no reason why a neurologist could not practice in an almost identical manner to a psychiatrist and vice versa. I guess they are not identical, however, they are closer than most people think.
Posted by Phillipa on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:31
In reply to Re: Seroquel in low vs high doses, posted by munificentexegete on February 17, 2007, at 5:05:48
Except neurologists deal a lot in surgery with severed nerves and repair, discs, MS, Parinsons. I think the neurologist has the advantage of being up on the meds of his speciality and then if a pdoc is needed he can take over with the meds with the patient going to the neurologist periodially for physical symptoms. It's the physical that is the most different.Love Phillipa
Posted by munificentexegete on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:31
In reply to Re: Seroquel in low vs high doses » munificentexegete, posted by Phillipa on February 17, 2007, at 19:41:15
> Except neurologists deal a lot in surgery with severed nerves and repair, discs, MS, Parinsons. I think the neurologist has the advantage of being up on the meds of his speciality and then if a pdoc is needed he can take over with the meds with the patient going to the neurologist periodially for physical symptoms. It's the physical that is the most different.Love Phillipa
point taken, but don't the psychiatrists do surgery (bit of a touchy subject though!) and give meds that have a physical impact too? so aren't psychiatrists also purely physical in the treatments they offer?
Posted by Phillipa on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:31
In reply to Re: Seroquel in low vs high doses, posted by munificentexegete on February 17, 2007, at 5:05:48
The biggest problem as I see it is that medicine has become too specialized or why would my neurologist send me to a surgical neurologist for a disc that could cause paralysis, or them sending me to a pdoc for med to treat anxiety or depression? I once had been put in withdrawal seriously in the hospital by a pdoc. I was sent home and went to my neurologist who temporarily prescribed a benzo til I could find a pdoc who is not benzo phobic here in the problem lies. Love Phillipa
Posted by Declan on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:32
In reply to Re: Seroquel in low vs high doses » Phillipa, posted by munificentexegete on February 17, 2007, at 20:36:19
In the future, nutritional/metabolic medicine will have something useful to say about this stuff.
You wouldn't want to hold your breath waiting though.
Posted by munificentexegete on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:32
In reply to Science etc » munificentexegete, posted by Declan on February 18, 2007, at 2:12:06
> In the future, nutritional/metabolic medicine will have something useful to say about this stuff.
>
> You wouldn't want to hold your breath waiting though.why not now? would you be justified in injecting insulin if you didn't have an insulin deficiency? are you justified in increasing your serotonin if your serotonin system is functioning normally? do psychiatrists have access to tests to see if our serotonin systems are normal?
Posted by Larry Hoover on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:32
In reply to Re: Seroquel in low vs high doses, posted by munificentexegete on February 16, 2007, at 21:18:35
> I see no reason to distinguish a neurologist from a psychiatrist they are both supposed to deal with mental illness.
So is a nurse on a psych ward. Unfortunately, so are the courts.
The etymology of the words are clearly quite distinct. One is concerned with physical condition and function of specific tissues, and the other is concerned with behaviour. Can you suggest which is which?
Lar
Posted by Phillipa on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:32
In reply to Re: definitions » munificentexegete, posted by Larry Hoover on February 18, 2007, at 10:39:33
Lar glad to see you. Love Phillipa
Posted by munificentexegete on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:32
In reply to Re: definitions » munificentexegete, posted by Larry Hoover on February 18, 2007, at 10:39:33
> > I see no reason to distinguish a neurologist from a psychiatrist they are both supposed to deal with mental illness.
>
> So is a nurse on a psych ward. Unfortunately, so are the courts.
>
> The etymology of the words are clearly quite distinct. One is concerned with physical condition and function of specific tissues, and the other is concerned with behaviour. Can you suggest which is which?
>
> Lar
>Hiya Lar!
the point I am making is that we have the medical technology to test for chemical imbalances, receptor dysfunction function, ect. Rather than accepting that we have such physical disease without evidence after a 5 minute consultation without any tests, and potentially needing medication to correct the disease for the rest of our lives as is the case with diabetes, I am merely pointing out that such medical statements can be questioned. The tests exist, they can be used for any purpose not just for testing cancers, and they can be used on a daily basis if required.
I wouldn't trust a diagnosis of diabetes without evidence, nor would I trust a diagnosis of serotonin imbalance or dysfunction without proof.
both a magistrate and a nurse don't have medical degrees, and 50% of the DSM contains definitions of physical disease including Parkinson's and Drug induced disease. like I said they are not identical, however, they are closer than most people think.
Posted by Quintal on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:32
In reply to Re: definitions » Larry Hoover, posted by munificentexegete on February 18, 2007, at 16:20:58
>both a magistrate and a nurse don't have medical degrees, and 50% of the DSM contains definitions of physical disease including Parkinson's and Drug induced disease. like I said they are not identical, however, they are closer than most people think
I've actually found the community psychiatric nurses have greater knowledge and insight than the psychiatrists. Probably from spending so long each day actually listening to people at length in their own homes rather than a hurried appointment centred around med tweaking.
Q
Posted by laima on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:32
In reply to Re: definitions » munificentexegete, posted by Quintal on February 18, 2007, at 16:42:50
> are you justified in increasing your serotonin if your serotonin system is functioning normally? do psychiatrists have access to tests to see if our serotonin systems are normal?
I understand that most experts agree it's not that simple. "Chemical imbalance" is just a theory, and testing blood or urine doesn't give an accurate look at what's going on in the brain anyway.
Posted by Larry Hoover on February 24, 2007, at 11:32:32
In reply to Re: definitions » Larry Hoover, posted by munificentexegete on February 18, 2007, at 16:20:58
> Hiya Lar!
Hey.
> the point I am making is that we have the medical technology to test for chemical imbalances, receptor dysfunction function, ect. Rather than accepting that we have such physical disease without evidence after a 5 minute consultation without any tests, and potentially needing medication to correct the disease for the rest of our lives as is the case with diabetes, I am merely pointing out that such medical statements can be questioned. The tests exist, they can be used for any purpose not just for testing cancers, and they can be used on a daily basis if required.
The tests you reference have not been correlated with anything useful, i.e. they have no meaning. Yet. If they were useful, we'd be using them. You can be darn sure of that, what with the profit to be made from medical testing. A doctor may not know what he's dealing with, but he knows that money can be made from ordering tests.
Lar
Posted by Meri-Tuuli on February 24, 2007, at 13:17:04
In reply to Re: definitions » munificentexegete, posted by Quintal on February 18, 2007, at 16:42:50
CPNs are great, although I only ever saw one - who was a really nice guy and he even gave me his email address and explained that his wife was a CPN too, so I didn't have to worry about other (ie normal) people reading my emails at his home! I mean, I once tried to get my NHS pdocs (in the UK) email address off his secretary - well, she sounded as if I'd asked her to eat her own poo. And all the reception staff and his secretary treated us like we were the sum of the earth. Oh well.
Jo Brand used to be a CPN did you know that??
Kind regards
Meri
Posted by Quintal on February 24, 2007, at 15:38:49
In reply to Re: definitions » Quintal, posted by Meri-Tuuli on February 24, 2007, at 13:17:04
>CPNs are great, although I only ever saw one - who was a really nice guy and he even gave me his email address and explained that his wife was a CPN too, so I didn't have to worry about other (ie normal) people reading my emails at his home!
That's unusual! He must have liked and trusted you to do that. Just think though of the risk they're taking of getting an avalanche of emails from someone having a manic episode or something. One of my ex-pdocs said he once gave a manic-depressive woman his phone number but she kept calling him back every time he got home. It was the last time he did it. My Schizophrenic friend once did the same to me - I spent a whole seven hours talking to her through the night until the sun came up. It can be hard work.
>I once tried to get my NHS pdocs (in the UK) email address off his secretary - well, she sounded as if I'd asked her to eat her own poo.
I tend to write them letters that are, lets just say, none too civil, when I'm displeased with their performance. I remember one phrase I wrote in complaint to my pdoc after he bullied me into taking Abilify; "My CPN says that aripiprazole (Abilify) is, and I quote, 'f*cking sh*t'. After my experience with it I'm inclined to agree." This was true as a matter of fact, but he made me regret it later.
>And all the reception staff and his secretary treated us like we were the sum of the earth. Oh well.
I had exactly the same experience. It's almost as if they got off on a power trip by working with vulnerable people. They are the most odious people I've ever met. In fact they were downright abusive at times, so on reflection I feel no guilt about speaking the truth of Abilify. The secretary actually slammed the door against my ankles as I was leaving one day (it had one of those security numberpads on so she had to operate it to let me out). This was when I was suffering the bleeding and cellulitis (I suspect) from the SSRIs, and the blow broke the skin and made a bruise that started another episode. I ended up in hospital because of it, but I didn't bother to complain. I can't imagine it getting anywhere.
>Jo Brand used to be a CPN did you know that??
Yes, I did! The teacher of my health and nutrition class was just like her, and she was an ex-CPN too. She broke her neck doing a charity parachute jump from landing in awkward position and being too 'rotund', and had to retire from the NHS.
I am responding to your request BTW, but I keep getting interrupted.
Q
Posted by Meri-Tuuli on February 24, 2007, at 17:27:05
In reply to Re: definitions » Meri-Tuuli, posted by Quintal on February 24, 2007, at 15:38:49
> That's unusual! He must have liked and trusted you to do that. Just think though of the risk they're taking of getting an avalanche of emails from someone having a manic episode or something.
Well, this was in St Andrews, Scotland... I don't think I ever emailed him AND it was back in 2002 but still. The pdoc I see here in Finland willing gave me her email too. There's even a 'window' of about half an hour each day when you can ring her directly with any questions etc. I've never rung her/emailed her through. I have to say the reception staff are very nice here in Finland. No complaints!
> >And all the reception staff and his secretary treated us like we were the sum of the earth. Oh well
> I had exactly the same experience. It's almost as if they got off on a power trip by working with vulnerable people. They are the most odious people I've ever met. In fact they were downright abusive at times, so on reflection I feel no guilt about speaking the truth of Abilify. The secretary actually slammed the door against my ankles as I was leaving one day (it had one of those security numberpads on so she had to operate it to let me out). This was when I was suffering the bleeding and cellulitis (I suspect) from the SSRIs, and the blow broke the skin and made a bruise that started another episode. I ended up in hospital because of it, but I didn't bother to complain. I can't imagine it getting anywhere.Ouch! Thats really not very nice. Yeah its stuff like this that really annoys me -- we pay our taxes just like everyone else! We're human beings too! I bet the reception staff at a cancer clinic are all smiles and daffodils. I actually once applied for a job as a secretary for a psychiatrist - which would be rather ironic. I never even got a rejection letter, despite being overqualified. Oh well. I had zero luck in finding a job in nottingham! I was unemployed for about a year - it was very soul destroying - do you work? Well, the worst I've ever had (and bearing in mind I only ever have had three appointments!) was when I was ringing the buzzer - and there was a couple of reception staff gossiping away and they plain ignored me for about 5 minutes. Yep its all glass screens and buzzer entry systems (you are totally confined in the waiting room) -there's even a lock thing between you and the rooms where you get seen. Here in Finland, there aren't any locks! They just have lights outside the rooms, I guess indicating if there's a session on or not. And there's no screen things at the reception desk - I could walk right behind there if I wanted to. Its nice here, they seem vaguely respectful.
Anyway.
> I am responding to your request BTW, but I keep getting interrupted.Hey no worries! I thought perhaps you didn't want to humour me :)
Miss M
Posted by Phillipa on February 24, 2007, at 21:32:42
In reply to Re: definitions » Quintal, posted by Meri-Tuuli on February 24, 2007, at 17:27:05
The thread was redirected? Guees I have to post something to stay on it. Hi everyone!!!!!!Love Phillipa
This is the end of the thread.
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