Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 1118038

Shown: posts 1 to 17 of 17. This is the beginning of the thread.

 

Another good Ketamine experience

Posted by beckett2 on January 5, 2022, at 17:30:15

Another IV of ketamine at the oral surgeon's, and I feel like what I imagine a normie might feels.

Two years ago I had an accidental and successful ketamine experience. This is my second.

I have BPll with prominent apathy and anhedonia. Little anxiety at this point, just never feel like doing anything.

We'll see how long this lasts, and if anyone is interested, I will update.

 

Re: Another good Ketamine experience

Posted by Lamdage22 on January 6, 2022, at 3:35:43

In reply to Another good Ketamine experience, posted by beckett2 on January 5, 2022, at 17:30:15

Congratulations. You are the first I heard of for whom it works, although I don't think it means anything.

 

Re: Another good Ketamine experience

Posted by Lamdage22 on January 6, 2022, at 5:13:48

In reply to Re: Another good Ketamine experience, posted by Lamdage22 on January 6, 2022, at 3:35:43

Was it "trippy"?

 

Re: Another good Ketamine experience

Posted by linkadge on January 6, 2022, at 16:30:37

In reply to Re: Another good Ketamine experience, posted by Lamdage22 on January 6, 2022, at 3:35:43

>Congratulations. You are the first I heard of for >whom it works, although I don't think it means >anything.

I've encountered about 5 people who have used ketamine successfully. Two of these people were not medication refractory per-se, but had a terrible benefit : side effect ratio.

Linkadge

 

Re: Another good Ketamine experience Lamdage22

Posted by beckett2 on January 6, 2022, at 16:59:51

In reply to Re: Another good Ketamine experience, posted by Lamdage22 on January 6, 2022, at 5:13:48

> Was it "trippy"?

This time, no because she put me under first. I have no memory of anything, just woke up feeling refreshed.

The first time was more than trippy. I hated it and it only added to my dentist phobia. But he was a savage and I don't see him any longer.

 

Re: Another good Ketamine experience linkadge

Posted by beckett2 on January 6, 2022, at 17:01:22

In reply to Re: Another good Ketamine experience, posted by linkadge on January 6, 2022, at 16:30:37

> >Congratulations. You are the first I heard of for >whom it works, although I don't think it means >anything.
>
> I've encountered about 5 people who have used ketamine successfully. Two of these people were not medication refractory per-se, but had a terrible benefit : side effect ratio.
>
> Linkadge

What side effects did they experience?

 

Re: Another good Ketamine experience

Posted by Lamdage22 on January 7, 2022, at 4:34:38

In reply to Re: Another good Ketamine experience Lamdage22, posted by beckett2 on January 6, 2022, at 16:59:51

Oh ok, that is why I'll never do it. It is not indicated for anyone prone to psychosis. I have seen it utilized in a bipolar patient because the doctors where at their witts end. But usually only for unipolar. It didn't work.

> The first time was more than trippy. I hated it and it only added to my dentist phobia. But he was a savage and I don't see him any longer.
>

 

Re: Another good Ketamine experience Lamdage22

Posted by Beckett2 on January 7, 2022, at 11:26:23

In reply to Re: Another good Ketamine experience, posted by Lamdage22 on January 7, 2022, at 4:34:38

> Oh ok, that is why I'll never do it. It is not indicated for anyone prone to psychosis. I have seen it utilized in a bipolar patient because the doctors where at their witts end. But usually only for unipolar. It didn't work.
>
>
>

One would think ketamine would be risky or detrimental for patients with a history of psychosis. A quick google search showed studies that suggest it is safe. Psychosis is a side effect of ketamine abuse, but not medical treatment. Interesting. Heres an 2021 abstract https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34255943/

Is ketamine used in Germany?

 

Re: Another good Ketamine experience Lamdage22

Posted by Beckett2 on January 7, 2022, at 11:34:32

In reply to Re: Another good Ketamine experience, posted by Lamdage22 on January 7, 2022, at 4:34:38

Another abstract on treatment of patient with schizophrenia. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30041987/

I will say, with my first experience, I had no warning about the effects, nor did I know I was receiving ketamine, so there was no frame of reference to contextualize my experience. When I came to after surgery, there was no residual psychotic effect.

Not trying to sell you on this. I just find it fascinating because its counterintuitive to my own assumptions.

 

Re: Another good Ketamine experience Lamdage22

Posted by Beckett2 on January 7, 2022, at 11:51:20

In reply to Re: Another good Ketamine experience, posted by Lamdage22 on January 7, 2022, at 4:34:38

Ok, heres a full article. It includes some discussion of benzodiazepine for patient comfort and to reduce hallucinatory side effects.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8024210/

Apologies for pummeling you with links :D

 

Re: Another good Ketamine experience

Posted by Lamdage22 on January 7, 2022, at 14:19:03

In reply to Re: Another good Ketamine experience Lamdage22, posted by Beckett2 on January 7, 2022, at 11:51:20

Hmm. I don't know. Things could be gained, things could be destroyed. I am not much of a gambler with my health.

 

Re: Another good Ketamine experience beckett2

Posted by linkadge on January 7, 2022, at 16:00:23

In reply to Re: Another good Ketamine experience linkadge, posted by beckett2 on January 6, 2022, at 17:01:22

>but had a terrible benefit : side effect ratio.

Sorry, that was very poorly worded on my part. They had a good response to ketamine with relatively few side effects. I meant to say, that ketamine was better for them because they had a poor response to traditional antidepressants (lots of side effects).

Linkadge

 

Re: Another good Ketamine experience

Posted by beckett2 on January 8, 2022, at 18:37:59

In reply to Re: Another good Ketamine experience, posted by Lamdage22 on January 7, 2022, at 14:19:03

> Hmm. I don't know. Things could be gained, things could be destroyed. I am not much of a gambler with my health.

I understand completely. Just wanted you to have the latest.

 

Re: Another good Ketamine experience

Posted by porkpiehat on February 18, 2022, at 12:26:43

In reply to Re: Another good Ketamine experience, posted by beckett2 on January 8, 2022, at 18:37:59

ketamine was suggested to me by a psychiatrist, mostly because I have tried everything and had the same benefit/SE ratio to other drugs. Also suicidality has been increasing.

I used to do ketamine as a club drug in the 90's. It was fun mixed with ecstacy but alone it increased my anxiety etc. Going into a full-on K hole was kind of terrifying.

Anywhooo...I would need to completely come off lamictal and probably lexapro and klonopin to even try it. Maybe it's a last resort

 

Re: Another good Ketamine experience porkpiehat

Posted by beckett2 on February 18, 2022, at 19:09:57

In reply to Re: Another good Ketamine experience, posted by porkpiehat on February 18, 2022, at 12:26:43

> ketamine was suggested to me by a psychiatrist, mostly because I have tried everything and had the same benefit/SE ratio to other drugs. Also suicidality has been increasing.
>
> I used to do ketamine as a club drug in the 90's. It was fun mixed with ecstacy but alone it increased my anxiety etc. Going into a full-on K hole was kind of terrifying.
>
> Anywhooo...I would need to completely come off lamictal and probably lexapro and klonopin to even try it. Maybe it's a last resort

I don't believe you need to come off any of those medications.

 

Re: Another good Ketamine experience

Posted by SLS on February 27, 2022, at 13:48:42

In reply to Re: Another good Ketamine experience Lamdage22, posted by Beckett2 on January 7, 2022, at 11:26:23

Hi.

Previous studies indicated that there is a "sweet-spot" of ketamine dosage that works best to treat depression. Taking a dosage that doesn't produce any dissociation at all is too low. A dosage that produces only a mild amount of dissociation works best. A dosage that is high enough to produce pronounced dissociation or unconsciousness is too high and demonstrated to be ineffective for treating depression.


- Scott

 

Re: Another good Ketamine experience

Posted by PeterMartin on March 24, 2022, at 11:14:29

In reply to Re: Another good Ketamine experience, posted by SLS on February 27, 2022, at 13:48:42

Saw this 2021 study today and figured it was worth mentioning here for anyone who takes Metformin:

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34850372/

Abstract
Background: Metformin is the most widely used drug for treating type 2 diabetes mellitus (DM), which frequently co-occurs with depressive disorders. Thus, patients with depression are likely to receive metformin. Metformin activates AMP-activated kinase (AMPK), which inhibits mechanistic target of rapamycin complex 1 (mTORC1) signaling. mTORC1 activation is essential for the antidepressant effects of ketamine and scopolamine. Thus, we hypothesized that metformin may attenuate ketamine- or scopolamine-induced antidepressant efficacies by blocking their mTORC1 activation.

Methods: We assessed the acute and sustained antidepressant-like actions of ketamine and scopolamine in male Sprague-Dawley rats subjected to the forced swim test with or without metformin pretreatment. The expressions of AMPK, mTORC1, and brain-derived neurotrophic factor (BDNF) in their prefrontal cortex were assessed.

Results: Metformin (50 mg/kg) attenuated the sustained, but not acute, antidepressant-like effects of ketamine (10 mg/kg) and scopolamine (25 μg/kg). Although metformin reduced mTORC1 downstream activated P70S6K, it did not significantly alter mTORser2448 activation and even increased BDNF expression. Notably, ketamine, scopolamine, and metformin all exerted significant antidepressant-like actions, as evidenced by increased AMPK phosphorylation and BDNF expression.

Conclusions: Metformin-induced attenuation of sustained antidepressant-like effects are not directly dependent on AMPK-deactivated mTORC1. Our results indicate the complexity of interactions between AMPK, BDNF, and mTORC1. Further research, including mechanistic studies, is warranted to comprehensively evaluate the application of metformin in patients receiving mTORC1-based antidepressants.


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