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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 23 of 23. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by ace on October 17, 2005, at 3:35:00
Dr. Dent, an eminent Australian psychiatrist who created a very successful medico-legal practice was struck off the register after being found to have intercourse with two patients.
Within the year he committed suicide.
There is a LOT of psychiatrists who kill themselves. Lets not fool ourselves.Me myself, going into psychiatry, am very prepared for the strains of the practice. And I have a love for nature/God/Love that will protect me always. The strong must battle on...we can't be another victim.....
So, most of you: if you have plans of being a shrink, unless you have a will of iron like me, forget it!!!
Ace
Posted by Declan on October 17, 2005, at 4:05:25
In reply to Another psychiatrist suicides....................., posted by ace on October 17, 2005, at 3:35:00
There was a shrink here who gained my respect by using the appointment time to smoke cigarettes with my brother-in-law who's brain damaged. Smoking is his main pleasure.
Anyway this psychiatrist killed himself. I wonder if the nicest ones are the first to go.
Declan
Posted by zenhussy on October 17, 2005, at 5:39:22
In reply to Another psychiatrist suicides....................., posted by ace on October 17, 2005, at 3:35:00
what is it with the profession? our first psychiatriat/psychopharmacologist took his own life several years after we had stopped seeing him for our meds management....we found out about his death from our current psychiatrist who had attended the same medical school as the first.
something to the effect of a fall from grace (in whose eyes? dunno) appeared to be the reasons behind his taking his life.
very disturbing when someone who manages treatment when one is most ill ends up doing the very thing they spend years on(and you spend thousands of dollars on)keeping you from doing...taking your own life! do as I say not as I do? :(
weird.
tc nardil champ!
__zh
Posted by lynn971 on October 17, 2005, at 6:29:43
In reply to Re: Another psychiatrist suicides..................... » ace, posted by zenhussy on October 17, 2005, at 5:39:22
I was never a psychiatrist by any stretch of the imagination, but I did work as a counselor at an alcohol and drug abuse center.
Needless to say, I lasted 6 months. I lived in a constant state of depression. As you know, I cant reveal any of the stories, but some were horrible. I am still affected by them today. I quit working there 12 years ago.
If all you hear all day long are the tragedies that has happened in peoples' lives, I imagine it could get to you.
Posted by Dinah on October 17, 2005, at 6:58:52
In reply to Another psychiatrist suicides....................., posted by ace on October 17, 2005, at 3:35:00
Well, if he really had intercourse with two patients, and was publicly shamed and had his livelihood taken away as a result, I doubt that his actual profession had much to do with it.
Posted by Phillipa on October 17, 2005, at 20:22:23
In reply to Re: Another psychiatrist suicides................., posted by Dinah on October 17, 2005, at 6:58:52
Psychiatrists have the highest suicide rate. I worked for one once and was seeing him as a patient. Even his colleagues didn't know how depressed he was. He was newly married. And he drank a lot. Used to get up on top of bars and dance. He drove his car into his garage and left it running. Carbon monoxide killed him. And I had noticed the last time I saw him how disorganized he was. He was a really nice guy. Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by Phillipa on October 17, 2005, at 20:25:33
In reply to Re: Another psychiatrist suicides....................., posted by lynn971 on October 17, 2005, at 6:29:43
Lynn, I just heard about a job while in Charlotte from a nurse. It's in Chemical dependency and substance abuse. I really like this field it's the last psych job I had. Please tell me why you were effected like you were. Med/Surg, Oncology, ER, ICU, are the ones that get to me. You can Babblemail me. I really need to know . Thanks Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by ace on October 18, 2005, at 2:29:42
In reply to Another psychiatrist suicides....................., posted by ace on October 17, 2005, at 3:35:00
It's all about common sense. I am prepared to here the most horrid depraved stories and see the most sickest unwell folk out there. But there is two sides of the coin. With despair, pain, anguish, we must see a tremendous opportunity for growth and seize that.
Dr. Malcom Dent was very depressed at the time of the intercourse incidents. He was using both psychotropics and psychotherapy. He was under extreme pressure. But what about common sense? First, take a break from the practice. Second, sort one thing slowly at a time etc etc....of course this is a lot easier once the AD has kicked in (esp if it is Nardil!!) He was also implicated in defrauding the courts....again...common-sense...Don't lie.....you learn that in Kindy!!!
But may he rest in peace.
I am not scared in the least of being a psychiatrist. I would never ever have sex with any patient or have any intimate relationship. Strictly professional, but still warm and gentle.
To one person who responded (sorry! forgot who!)- it wasn't just public disgrace that prompted the suicide, it was depression and pressure induce by the job.....
Ace
Posted by ace on October 18, 2005, at 2:31:58
In reply to Re: Another psychiatrist suicides....................., posted by ace on October 18, 2005, at 2:29:42
and PUBLIC disgrace in addition to depression and pressures.......the intercourse incidents took place while Dr. Dent was under great pressure and very depressed.
Posted by Susan47 on October 18, 2005, at 20:26:00
In reply to Re: Another psychiatrist suicides..................... » ace, posted by Declan on October 17, 2005, at 4:05:25
That's heartbreaking. I love the nice men, we need more of them and there aren't enough of them, which is true, and I wish he'd had a wife who showed him how Great he really was, because as many bad ones as there are, there're really caring wonderful psychs as well and what this guy showed was so beautiful.
Posted by Susan47 on October 18, 2005, at 20:32:12
In reply to Re: Another psychiatrist suicides..................... » ace, posted by zenhussy on October 17, 2005, at 5:39:22
I don't know, maybe it really isn't so weird after all. They're people just like you and me and their training won't necessarily help them with their own problems with depression, sadness, anxiety, guilt, counter-transference, you name it. Why should they be any different from anybody else really? I do't believe their own frailties make them ineffectual, necessarily, in their practice of their profession .. only when their clients bring up their own issues, then it definitely is a bugger. I think any responsible therapist would seek outside third-party help for EVERYONE involved in the therapy.
IMO that's part of what went wrong in my own therapy. And stuff like that can hurt not just the client but also the therapist, and if the therapist is already depressed or going through terrible times of his own or Whatever ... god.
Posted by Susan47 on October 18, 2005, at 20:39:08
In reply to Re: Another psychiatrist suicides....................., posted by lynn971 on October 17, 2005, at 6:29:43
It does. But there really are some people who seem to be immune to the particular stresses of a profession, I saw that in police work. They're the crazy ones. The ones who seem the most stable seem to be the ones you can rely on when your life depends on it, but are mentally twisted in other ways. But there's the immune ones too who just are really well-balanced individuals. I thought my last therapist was one of those, I thought I unbalanced him. That was pretty horrible. Lynn971 I'm thinking if those stories still bother you after twelve years then you're an exceptionally well-balanced and caring individual, I'll bet you're a good friend to others ;) Maybe I'm just saying that because some of the stuff I came across in my years with a national police force really do still haunt me today, and it feels like they'll never be gone. Sometimes the knowledge of that stuff makes me feel I have an advantage over people who don't know stuff that happens, in details that most people couldn't stomach, and the advantage I have is that I know just exactly how precious my own life is, and how it can't be wasted. Because there's a kind of responsibility that seems to come from the knowledge you gain, that other people's lives were sacrificed on an altar of cruelty, and you have this responsibility to live your own life to the fullest, to the best, to the happiest, because theirs is destroyed and you're part of a sacred circle of Knowing .. you can respect what's happened to these people, you respect their memories by living well, living mindfully, and living lovingly too.
Oops, I'm off the soapbox, I hope box.
Posted by Susan47 on October 18, 2005, at 20:42:57
In reply to Re: Another psychiatrist suicides................., posted by Phillipa on October 17, 2005, at 20:22:23
He actually sounds like a wonderful, sensitive guy who couldn't deal with stuff he had to keep to himself. I wonder if he was seeing someone professionally, himself, because that's why I think it would be nearly impossible to live happily in that profession unless your city was big enough, you need space, room to vent, someone to vent to, a place to go where peers can be serious and kind and supportive of each other.
Man, what a lousy way to earn a living, I think that sometimes, y'know. Then you hear about the ones who makes jokes about their patients, and my sympathy just runs cold. Which isn't fair to the nice ones.
Posted by ace on October 19, 2005, at 3:52:26
In reply to Re: Another psychiatrist suicides..................... » zenhussy, posted by Susan47 on October 18, 2005, at 20:32:12
> I don't know, maybe it really isn't so weird after all. They're people just like you and me and their training won't necessarily help them with their own problems with depression, sadness, anxiety, guilt, counter-transference, you name it. Why should they be any different from anybody else really?
Because of their extensive training. They should be honest, proffesional and treat patients with the utmost repect. They make the choice, like I have, to be a psychiatrist, so they should walk the walk. When under enormous stress, take a break...Simple.
I do't believe their own frailties make them ineffectual, necessarily, in their practice of their profession .. only when their clients bring up their own issues, then it definitely is a bugger.
I have no problem with psychiatrists having psychiatric histories...my GP has qouted that a good 70% do. But they must have transcended, overcome, or reached a certain equanimity with their own issues, before treating others.
Ace
I think any responsible therapist would seek outside third-party help for EVERYONE involved in the therapy.
> IMO that's part of what went wrong in my own therapy. And stuff like that can hurt not just the client but also the therapist, and if the therapist is already depressed or going through terrible times of his own or Whatever ... god.
Posted by Susan47 on October 19, 2005, at 20:41:17
In reply to Re: Another psychiatrist suicides..................... » Susan47, posted by ace on October 19, 2005, at 3:52:26
You sound determined and strong. Not that this has anything to do with it necessarily, but how old are you? What's your life experience?
Posted by ace on October 19, 2005, at 23:30:51
In reply to Re: Another psychiatrist suicides..................... » ace, posted by Susan47 on October 19, 2005, at 20:41:17
> You sound determined and strong. Not that this has anything to do with it necessarily, but how old are you? What's your life experience?
26. A horrid history of anxiety/depression/OCD (psychotic features). But, in spite of this, I have NEVER given in, and will never. I used my tremendous pain as a source of growth -- this was not easy but. When I was in agony in the past I used to say "Andrew, be strong, be a trooper, this is part of my existence and I MUST endure, it will make me stronger in the end" I believe persistence and endurance makes a person God-Like. If you go to my band website and read my interviews will see how strong my will is. Everything I suffer, I try to turn it to my advantage in any way possible. I am very dynamic and flaymboyant, but that's me! Every situation, even the most terrible, can be used to our advantage.Also, around 18, I read the great philosophers: Schopenhauer, Hume, Kant....the guys had a huge effect on me. But, like my father and in my family, I am inherently a strong creature who can endure.
I have a will made so elite, and iron pumping through my veins....
I urge all you guys to take the same stance, cause you ALL have that potential. When you cry in pain and suffer, SUFFER!!!! But realise it teaches you just as much as happiness sometimes.
All you guys and gals are very close to me, even though we are in cyber land here. But I urge EVERYONE of you, that in your darkest days....."NEVER GIVE IN- YOU ARE BRAVE TROOPERS!"
Ace
Posted by ace on October 19, 2005, at 23:33:09
In reply to Re: This soon-to-be shrink will NEVER suicide! » Susan47, posted by ace on October 19, 2005, at 23:30:51
> > You sound determined and strong. Not that this has anything to do with it necessarily, but how old are you? What's your life experience?
26. A horrid history of anxiety/depression/OCD (psychotic features). But, in spite of this, I have NEVER given in, and will never. I used my tremendous pain as a source of growth -- this was not easy but. When I was in agony in the past I used to say "Andrew, be strong, be a trooper, this is part of my existence and I MUST endure, it will make me stronger in the end" I believe persistence and endurance makes a person God-Like. If you go to my band website and read my interviews will see how strong my will is. Everything I suffer, I try to turn it to my advantage in any way possible. I am very dynamic and flaymboyant, but that's me! Every situation, even the most terrible, can be used to our advantage.
>
> Also, around 18, I read the great philosophers: Schopenhauer, Hume, Kant....the guys had a huge effect on me. But, like my father and in my family, I am inherently a strong creature who can endure.
>
> I have a will made so elite, and iron pumping through my veins....
>
> I urge all you guys to take the same stance, cause you ALL have that potential. When you cry in pain and suffer, SUFFER!!!! But realise it teaches you just as much as happiness sometimes.
>
> All you guys and gals are very close to me, even though we are in cyber land here. But I urge EVERYONE of you, that in your darkest days....."NEVER GIVE IN- YOU ARE BRAVE TROOPERS!"
>
> Ace
FIGHT ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by Phillipa on October 20, 2005, at 0:06:53
In reply to Re: This soon-to-be shrink will NEVER suicide! » Susan47, posted by ace on October 19, 2005, at 23:30:51
Ahhh my ACE! Remember to send me that E-mail address again and the one of your band. Had to have computer fixed today and they deleted it. Love your friend Jan/Phillipa your Queen
Posted by Susan47 on October 20, 2005, at 20:23:44
In reply to Re: This soon-to-be shrink will NEVER suicide! » Susan47, posted by ace on October 19, 2005, at 23:30:51
You sound perfect for the job. Good for you, I do agree with you. What's your website addy?
Posted by Declan on October 20, 2005, at 21:53:54
In reply to Re: This soon-to-be shrink will NEVER suicide! » Susan47, posted by ace on October 19, 2005, at 23:30:51
Thinking of the speeches of Churchill and Lincoln, what comes across to me is their humanity, appreciation of moral complexity, and refusal to be evasive. (I emphasise for my American friends that my knowledge of Lincoln's speeches is very low, but anyway...)
They were both clinically depressed. It is argued they would have been greater leaders if they had not been depressed, but I dunno. I think their humanity is tied up with it somehow.
Declan
Posted by ace on October 24, 2005, at 1:02:40
In reply to Depression » ace, posted by Declan on October 20, 2005, at 21:53:54
> Thinking of the speeches of Churchill and Lincoln, what comes across to me is their humanity, appreciation of moral complexity, and refusal to be evasive. (I emphasise for my American friends that my knowledge of Lincoln's speeches is very low, but anyway...)
> They were both clinically depressed. It is argued they would have been greater leaders if they had not been depressed, but I dunno. I think their humanity is tied up with it somehow.
> DeclanVery true Declan....all works of amazement are intermingled with periods of doubt, great depression and brooding. We must see these somehow as lessons in edification....
"If you are going through hell, keep going"
Churchill
Posted by Deneb on November 14, 2005, at 22:10:33
In reply to Another psychiatrist suicides....................., posted by ace on October 17, 2005, at 3:35:00
> There is a LOT of psychiatrists who kill themselves. Lets not fool ourselves.
>
> Me myself, going into psychiatry, am very prepared for the strains of the practice.Are you going to be a p-doc? It sounds like an interesting profession...you get to meet so many interesting people.
I read this article at Medscape called "Physicians Are Not Invincible".The Painful Truth: Physicians Are Not Invincible
[South Med J 93(10):966-972, 2000. © 2000 Southern Medical Association]I can't post it here because a password is needed, but I believe one can easily get a password.
It talks about how there are idealized expectations for physicians and how physicians struggle with these expectations. When there are emotional problems, they tend to be perceived as professional failings.
Apparently, physicians are 2 times as likely to kill themselves as the general population. P-docs have the highest suicide rate and pediatricians have the lowest. Approximately 73% of p-docs report a history of depression.
Deneb
Posted by allisonross on November 15, 2005, at 10:54:51
In reply to Re: This soon-to-be shrink will NEVER suicide! » ace, posted by ace on October 19, 2005, at 23:33:09
> > > Hi, Andrew (I think i got that right); you must be the brother I never had! My middle name is: NEVER give up. I won't go into long details here, but my story was posted in an on-line psych. journal (to my utter amazement)
www.psychiatricjournal.com, entitled: THe Transcendent Child on Overcoming Verbal and Spiritual Abuse
My own website (courtesy of a church who kicked me out because I got a divorce after 31 years of abuse):
www.churchabusepoetrytherapy.comThe Reader's Digest Version? Grew up abused by a mentally-ill mother (physical and verbal abuse); molested by a drunken neighbor while asleep (didn't know who it was at the time), when "mother" left for the evening...
in the rat-infested, cockroach "estate" (tenement house, which had no foundation, insulation, and snow which came in thru a crack in the wall. Some fun poverty stuff: No phone, bathroom, refrigerator or car.
had my hand held over an open fire by another drunken (woman) neighbor.
Joined the army right out of high school (from Maine to San Francisco---culture shock!)
"Married " my mother and tried to fix the past. Divorced afte 31 (well, 39 really) years of abuse.
Voted out of church membership, with my name up on a big screen, followed by the words: CONDUCT UNBECOMING A CHILD OF GOD.
I counse abused women (verbal abuse being my expertise); it is rampant on our planet, and rarely recognized.
I've written my memoir; Ghost Child to Triumph (from a child with no voice, to someone who speaks up against injustice in the world), and have a publisher interested.
I think perhaps I've never been beaten down (faith, wicked wit and sense of humor have kept me from drooling in a corner, somewhere)
I think in part because of genetics; Captain Sam, my ancestor....in 1776 he was 80 years old. He went out and fought the British singlehandedly! he was beaten, stabbed and bayoneted 16 times, had half of his face shot off.....When the townspeople came to pick up
his "dead" body, he was still full of fight, trying to get off one last shot at the retreating Redcoats.
not only did he live, he lived to be 96 years old! His story is on a website: Captain Sam: America's oldest, bravest soldier'!
He is my hero! Glad I chose him as my ancestor, too!
Love to hear frm you, as I am pretty new here. We sound so much alike, it is scary.
As my therapist (went to him for the church debacle) sez; "Do you know anyone like you?" I said, "no" and he said: "Neither do I!"
He sez I would make a "wonderful" therapist, but I think that I am in the place I am (meeting people on the net and outside), because i am supposed to be on the mission to help abused people....so my lifetime of the same
will not be in vain. That would be a tragedy and such a waste, to NOT do something with my knowledge.
P.S. My son's name Is Andrew, also.
Smiles, and grins, Alice (overcomer and wounded-healer) Keep on keepin' on! I ALWAYS will!
>
>
>
>
> 26. A horrid history of anxiety/depression/OCD (psychotic features). But, in spite of this, I have NEVER given in, and will never. I used my tremendous pain as a source of growth -- this was not easy but. When I was in agony in the past I used to say "Andrew, be strong, be a trooper, this is part of my existence and I MUST endure, it will make me stronger in the end" I believe persistence and endurance makes a person God-Like. If you go to my band website and read my interviews will see how strong my will is. Everything I suffer, I try to turn it to my advantage in any way possible. I am very dynamic and flaymboyant, but that's me! Every situation, even the most terrible, can be used to our advantage.
> >
> > Also, around 18, I read the great philosophers: Schopenhauer, Hume, Kant....the guys had a huge effect on me. But, like my father and in my family, I am inherently a strong creature who can endure.
> >
> > I have a will made so elite, and iron pumping through my veins....
> >
> > I urge all you guys to take the same stance, cause you ALL have that potential. When you cry in pain and suffer, SUFFER!!!! But realise it teaches you just as much as happiness sometimes.
> >
> > All you guys and gals are very close to me, even though we are in cyber land here. But I urge EVERYONE of you, that in your darkest days....."NEVER GIVE IN- YOU ARE BRAVE TROOPERS!"
> >
> > Ace
>
>
> FIGHT ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
>
This is the end of the thread.
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