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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 24 of 24. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by ginnie on October 7, 2005, at 14:00:31
Hi is anybody here. Does anybody have any "Men are from Mars and Women are from Venus" problems"
Ginnie
Posted by sunny10 on October 7, 2005, at 14:06:52
In reply to I'm new here, posted by ginnie on October 7, 2005, at 14:00:31
welcome to Babble...
I don't personally know anyone who DOESN'T have those problems from time to time!
We just think differently.
If I had more time I would give lots of examples...
What specifically are you having a problem with?
Posted by AdaGrace on October 7, 2005, at 19:46:42
In reply to I'm new here, posted by ginnie on October 7, 2005, at 14:00:31
Men are from Mars and we just can't ship them back quick enough.
Posted by gardenergirl on October 8, 2005, at 19:22:38
In reply to Re: My Problem is » ginnie, posted by AdaGrace on October 7, 2005, at 19:46:42
Posted by gardenergirl on October 8, 2005, at 19:23:43
In reply to I'm new here, posted by ginnie on October 7, 2005, at 14:00:31
Posted by Damos on October 9, 2005, at 21:38:50
In reply to Re: My Problem is » ginnie, posted by AdaGrace on October 7, 2005, at 19:46:42
> Men are from Mars and we just can't ship them back quick enough.
I heard that :-)
Posted by Gabbix2 on October 9, 2005, at 22:05:59
In reply to ROFL!!!! (nm) » AdaGrace, posted by gardenergirl on October 8, 2005, at 19:22:38
Posted by alexandra_k on October 9, 2005, at 23:56:57
In reply to ? (nm) » gardenergirl, posted by Gabbix2 on October 9, 2005, at 22:05:59
:-P
:-)
Posted by gardenergirl on October 10, 2005, at 0:12:49
In reply to ? (nm) » gardenergirl, posted by Gabbix2 on October 9, 2005, at 22:05:59
"Men are from Mars and we just can't ship them back quick enough."
Hadn't heard it put quite that way before.
Problem?
gg
Posted by Gabbix2 on October 10, 2005, at 3:01:27
In reply to I thought it was funny » Gabbix2, posted by gardenergirl on October 10, 2005, at 0:12:49
> "Men are from Mars and we just can't ship them back quick enough."
>
> Hadn't heard it put quite that way before.
>
> Problem?
>
> gg
>
Well yeah.
I hate thinking of little boys hearing that kind of crap about men all the time.
If men in this case had been replaced with blacks or jews.. it would not have been considered funny or acceptable. I don't think men are fair game for being constantly insulted just because they are men.
I know this will come across as heavy handed about Ada Grace's comment, lots of people make these kinds of comments as for some reason it's okay to do this about men but no one else.
In this case the inconsitancy bothers me too, and as has been mentioned before I think this board should be required to set an example. It's been proven twice that you can't make a joke about r*dnecks, (and being a r*dneck is a choice) without gettin P.B.C'd but a deputy can laugh along at a joke about men not being as good as women..
It makes no sense to me.
Posted by Tamar on October 10, 2005, at 6:50:23
In reply to Re: I thought it was funny » gardenergirl, posted by Gabbix2 on October 10, 2005, at 3:01:27
It’s an interesting subject… I have to say I find racist jokes extremely offensive, but I’m rarely offended by jokes about the difficulties men and women have in getting along. And I’m very feminist. I wouldn’t have been offended if the joke had been told the other way around:
“Women are from Venus and we just can’t ship them back quick enough.”Jokes about the ‘sex war’ usually involve stereotypes that I think are unhelpful. And yet, because there are so many jokes about both men and women, I feel more free to laugh. But some of my friends (who are also feminists) were offended by jokes that I laughed at. I’m always interested in critiquing jokes to explore what the stereotypes are and why people find them funny.
I would give examples but I’m afraid of offending people. However, I think it’s possible to laugh at ‘sex war’ jokes because I believe that men and women will continue to make efforts to get along. There’s something of a biological imperative. At least for heterosexual people, we pretty much *have* to find ways of getting along with the opposite sex. Sometimes there’s relief in using humour to express our frustration with the opposite sex. We laugh at them, but usually we know we’re not going to stop associating with them.
However, I don’t believe that the same applies to race or religion, because there isn’t the same imperative to get along with people who are different from ourselves. I think jokes about race or religion are usually divisive and cruel. I don’t tell racist jokes and I have strong words with people who tell them to me.
But… I’d be interested to hear from people who disagree with me, because my views on these things are always provisional. Maybe there are good reasons for not laughing at ‘sex war’ jokes. I probably haven’t thought of everything. I’d be keen to know what other people think…
Tamar
Posted by AdaGrace on October 10, 2005, at 8:12:42
In reply to Re: My Problem is » AdaGrace, posted by Damos on October 9, 2005, at 21:38:50
This is like being in Jr. High.
Posted by gardenergirl on October 10, 2005, at 8:22:45
In reply to Re: I thought it was funny » gardenergirl, posted by Gabbix2 on October 10, 2005, at 3:01:27
Sorry if that's upsetting to you. If I thought that by becoming a deputy I had to repress my sense of humor, I never would have accepted.
gg
Posted by AdaGrace on October 10, 2005, at 8:35:11
In reply to Re: For Pete's Sake » Damos, posted by AdaGrace on October 10, 2005, at 8:12:42
I'd appologize, but I'm not sure to whom. You? or all the men in the world?
Obviously you are offended, and for that I appoligize.
However, I am having difficulty with the comment of "little boys hearing this about grown men" comment. I'm raising a "little boy" with virtually no disciplinary help from my husband. I'll have to say, that "little boy" has more respect for me than he has ever shown to have for his father. Albeit, I stress every day how his words and actions are disrespectful to his father, and he is getting better. But I think the problem lies in his observances of his father's lack of initiative and drive. Perhaps "little boys" are underated in regards to their ability to digest information from their physical surroundings. Maybe, just maybe, they already know that there is a "war" so to speak out there between men and women and will be able to bridge the gap.
I do not agree that this comment is similar to a racist comment. It's a gender generalization, I'll admit that. Guess I should have said "Most of the men I have met should be shipped back to Mars." No, if the comment was turned around to state "Women, should be shipped back to Venus" I would not be offended. Because I know that it's a generalization and not specifically about me. It could be about me, especially if stated by one of my ex's. But I wouldn't see it as a personal slam. I do not think that gender generalizations are any comparison to racist comments. Period.
You have the right to your opinion as well as I do. We have the right to disagree.
Growing up and living in Small Town Middle America, i.e., the Midwestern United States, I find it a little slower on the uptake here. Not so many "equal rights for women" marches going on here. Not too many women mayors, doctors, lawyers, etc. Oportunity for advancement still seems to be related to our ability to look good in a skirt and high heels. Pretty barbaric actually. Not your fault I live in a less socially advanced society than some others. However, I must really state that it would appear to me that in my situation, feminism backfired. "I can bring home the bacon, and fry it up in the pan." You see, I have found that getting a degree, getting a high paying job just put more demands on me regarding my "regular" wifely and motherly duties, as well as the pressure of bringing home a paycheck. Also in my case, the more i made, the more I did, the less my husband made, and the less my husband did. Just my situation. Not everybodys. But I hope you will excuse me when I sound a tad bitter.
Posted by Gabbix2 on October 10, 2005, at 9:59:47
In reply to Re: Gabbix2, posted by AdaGrace on October 10, 2005, at 8:35:11
It's the inconsistancy that bothers me more than the comment itself. That's all. I knew I'd open up a can of worms by saying anything at all.
And had I heard that comment in person I'd probably smile. I don't understand though, why the rules are so glaringly inconsistant on Babble..
Posted by Damos on October 10, 2005, at 16:41:38
In reply to Re: For Pete's Sake » Damos, posted by AdaGrace on October 10, 2005, at 8:12:42
Sorry Gracie,
That was one of those posts where the tone didn't come across right. I didn't take offence or anything, actually thought it was pretty damn clever and funny too, and just so you.
Sorry
Posted by AdaGrace on October 10, 2005, at 23:09:20
In reply to Re: Gabbix2 » AdaGrace, posted by Gabbix2 on October 10, 2005, at 9:59:47
I came down pretty hard on you this morning and I appologize.
Posted by crazy teresa on October 10, 2005, at 23:16:59
In reply to Re: My Problem is » ginnie, posted by AdaGrace on October 7, 2005, at 19:46:42
> Men are from Mars and we just can't ship them back quick enough.
You are surely destined for greatness!!! ROFL!!!
Posted by Gabbix2 on October 11, 2005, at 13:35:15
In reply to Re: Gabbix2 » Gabbix2, posted by AdaGrace on October 10, 2005, at 23:09:20
No, you didn't come down to hard on me, I deserved that. I was going to apologize to you last night. I think this is the third post of yours I've commented on recently and it's time I got off your as*. (Though I wasn't intentionally on it)
It wasn't about what you said, which is why I didn't direct the post to you,
I'm not that much of a tight as* really. :)
It was a lighthearted comment, and I don't think there are too many women who haven't said "Women are from venus men are... from hell.."
I just think it's weird that some lighthearted comments (Ie the r*dneck jokes) get p.b.c's and some don't.
But that doesn't mean I have to comment on every one, because it doesn't do anyone any good and it looks personal even when it's not.
I'm really very sorry.Thanks for the apology though it wasn't necessary. Now you can say something mean to me, and get a free one okay?
Posted by ginnie on October 12, 2005, at 10:03:05
In reply to Re: Ada » AdaGrace, posted by Gabbix2 on October 11, 2005, at 13:35:15
Sorry I started something.
ginnie
Posted by Nickengland on October 12, 2005, at 13:46:12
In reply to Re: My Problem is » ginnie, posted by AdaGrace on October 7, 2005, at 19:46:42
According to relationship counselor John Gray, difficulties in relationships between a man and a woman lie in the lack of understanding and acceptance of the differences between the two sexes. Gray's famous book "Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus" turned out to be a phenomenal best seller. Since its initial print in 1992, over 11 million copies were sold in the U.S. alone. In addition, it was translated into 40 different languages and has readers all over the world. To many, Gray has achieved guru status in the fields of communication and relationships. To some others, however, Gray's Mars-Venus model stereotypes both men and women. In particular, he has been accused of having pushed women's role in marriage back 30 years. To the author, the book "Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus" portrays men or women in neither a good or nor a bad light, but in true light. It may make men or women sound like a good or bad deal to their partners, but according to the book, it is the only deal we get. Therefore, acknowledgment and acceptance is key.
Now, let's take a look at the differences between men (Marsians) and women (Venusians) as they are depicted in Dr. Gray's book.
Men like to help women by fixing problems.
Women like to help men by improving men.
Men do not like women's attempt to improve them. They feel humiliated.
Fixing problems for them is not what women want the most from men.
When men are down, they want women's loving acceptance, not their criticism and unsolicited advice. Men want to be trusted and admired.
When women are down, they like to talk about their problems. They want men to be sympathetic listeners, not necessarily offer solutions to their problems.
Men are goal-oriented problems solvers.
Women have a need to talk about their feelings. They need to be heard and understood. Instead of being busy figuring out how to solve their problems, men should show their acknowledgment vocally or through nodding and brief eye contact.
Men talk to exchange information.
Women talk to express feelings.
Men need to be alone sometimes. Every now and then, especially when under stress, they need to retreat to their "cave" and do not want to be disturbed. Insisting on helping them before they are ready to emerge from the cave can feel like harassment.
Women, under stress and in other times, like to seek out contact and make human connections.
Naturally and cyclically, women's moods go though highs and lows.
Men are often disconcerted by women's emotions.
Women tend to use dramatic expressions such as "you ALWAYS forget" or "you NEVER listen to me". Men should not take those literally but sympathize with the sentiments they convey.
Men and women, even when they speak the same words, may speak different languages.http://psychology.about.com/library/weekly/aa080102a.htm
-------------------------------------------------
Men Are from Mars, Women Are from Venus is a bestselling relationship guide written by John Gray and first published in May 1992. It has been translated into at least 40 different languages and sold more than 15 million copies worldwide.
The book stresses the differences between men and women, and attempts to offer a key to understanding the opposite sex.
An example of the theories it offers is that when women complain about problems, they merely want their problems to be acknowledged, and to feel listened to. When men complain about problems, they are asking for solutions. John Gray suggests that offering solutions to a woman who is complaining will frustrate her, and make her feel as if she's not being listened to. Just sympathising with a man will be similarly frustrating for him, since he's asking for your advice, not your sympathy.
In stressing the differences between men and women, this book was controversial. Many people felt that it was misogynistic and sexist.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Men_Are_From_Mars,_Women_Are_From_Venus
Hope that helps, last time I checked I found I was from Earth ;-)
Kind regards
Nick
Posted by Damos on October 12, 2005, at 17:46:30
In reply to sorry, posted by ginnie on October 12, 2005, at 10:03:05
Oops, forgot to say 'Hi and welcome' before, where are my manners. Hi Ginny! Welcome, glad you're here with us.
There's no need to be sorry, it's nothing you said or did. Sometimes threads just take on a life of there own and go places you never could've expected. You just jump on in any time and any place you feel like it okay.
Hope you keep on posting.
Damos
Posted by Susan47 on October 12, 2005, at 22:47:30
In reply to Re: My Problem is » ginnie, posted by AdaGrace on October 7, 2005, at 19:46:42
Hah! That was really a great laugh, I don't know how you manage it AG.
Posted by AuntieMel on October 18, 2005, at 9:58:24
In reply to Deputies are human too, and we laugh » Gabbix2, posted by gardenergirl on October 10, 2005, at 8:22:45
I just read it and snorted myself.
But I also like r*dneck jokes (I didn't know that was forbidden or I'd have argued it - just because I'm a r*dneck doesn't mean I can't laugh about it)
And I like blonde jokes.
This is the end of the thread.
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