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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 24 to 48 of 82. Go back in thread:
Posted by Larry Hoover on May 28, 2005, at 18:56:35
In reply to Re: Stereotypes » Larry Hoover, posted by AdaGrace on May 27, 2005, at 7:51:23
> I realize that my post is very stereotypical.
> I do not mean to say that ALL men are like this.Ya, and I knew you weren't talking about me. You don't know anything about me.
> However, having said that, I find it typical of the men I have known or now know. Perhaps it is location. Perhaps it is only my situation. I don't know. I just know my own experiences and those of my friends and aquaintances. I find it disturbing and wanted to vent.
I hope I didn't disturb that. I'm not offended by that at all. Your experience is your experience. It is very hard, though, to discuss me in the context of a stereotype, no matter how I try to do it.....I end up being very careful about language and meaning. And it ends up sounding defensive or protective.
> I realize that there are men out there, like you, who aren't like my descriptions.
Thanks. I like to think that's true.
> I just didn't meet you in my formative years, therefore I have gained a somewhat negative outlook on the male species I guess. It's sad really. I feel as if I have so much to offer intelectually, physically, emotionally, etc., but challenged for trying to do that. Anyway.
That makes me sad.
> I know stereotypes are bad to express. I need a new way to vent maybe.
>
> AdaGraceI'm struggling with making what I want to say clear and concise. I find it hard, as an individual, one who happens to have a penis, to join into a discussion which involves male stereotypes. Stereotypes exist for good reason. They have a basis in fact. The difficulty is in making the discussion personal and individual, without addressing the stereotypical stuff too heavily. The upside of stereotypes is they save a lot of words. They're symbolic. The downside is that they are symbolic. Highly symbolic words carry a lot of emotional baggage.
I agree that the stereotypical male you were speaking of is not one who promotes a high-quality emotionally interactive supportive and non-judgmental relationship.
It does make me wonder, though, and as you seemed to wonder too.....just how much location and situation affect the observations you and your friends have made.
Lar
Posted by Susan47 on June 1, 2005, at 13:40:17
In reply to Re: Maybe So, But, posted by AdaGrace on May 21, 2005, at 17:03:12
If that's your life, that's hell. I never could succumb to all of that but I spent my time trying, and it cost me dearly. It's costing you as well. Heed your bitterness, sweetie, and get those internal changes broiling. You're the boss of your life. There's no bandmaster out here making sure you're marching in time to the beat. The beat you follow is your own, you have to be your own bandmaster, maybe it's time to start just marching without the beat, see how soon it joins you. Because it will, when you're marching on your own, the beat will come.
Posted by Susan47 on June 1, 2005, at 14:51:33
In reply to Re: Stereotypes » AdaGrace, posted by Larry Hoover on May 28, 2005, at 18:56:35
Oh, Larry, I do wish you hadn't brought up your penis.
Oh, dear. You're such a lovely man.
Posted by 10derHeart on June 1, 2005, at 16:07:52
In reply to Re: Stereotypes » Larry Hoover, posted by Susan47 on June 1, 2005, at 14:51:33
> Oh, Larry, I do wish you hadn't brought up your penis.
> Oh, dear. You're such a lovely man.Okay, I'm curious. I admit. Umm...I mean about what you wrote, Susan.
So...I'm sure you don't mean now because he mentioned his penis that he's NOT a lovely man, obviously.
So, what's distressing? If you feel like saying, Susan. Sounds like somehow that changed something in your mind...unless you were just joking around.....
Or just tell me to go jump in a lake...I probably should, it's hot as Hades here, anyway.
But I am curious on what you meant.
Posted by Susan47 on June 2, 2005, at 8:44:24
In reply to Re: Stereotypes » Susan47, posted by 10derHeart on June 1, 2005, at 16:07:52
Larry's just said a lot of nice things to me. He shouldn't bring up his maleness, I mean, of course he should, but I shouldn't have read that because it makes me hot. That's all. Men just hurt me. I get involved in their sexiness, in wanting them, but I can't handle the something about them. There's something about them that scares me. So I'm attracted/frightened, I guess. Moth to the flame. It doesn't take much, y'know, the light of a man's sexuality is enough to burn me.
Posted by Larry Hoover on June 3, 2005, at 16:56:39
In reply to Re: Stereotypes » Larry Hoover, posted by Susan47 on June 1, 2005, at 14:51:33
> Oh, Larry, I do wish you hadn't brought up your penis.
> Oh, dear. You're such a lovely man.?????
I'm smiling, but...??????
Posted by Larry Hoover on June 3, 2005, at 17:00:56
In reply to Re: Stereotypes, posted by Susan47 on June 2, 2005, at 8:44:24
> Larry's just said a lot of nice things to me. He shouldn't bring up his maleness, I mean, of course he should, but I shouldn't have read that because it makes me hot. That's all. Men just hurt me. I get involved in their sexiness, in wanting them, but I can't handle the something about them. There's something about them that scares me. So I'm attracted/frightened, I guess. Moth to the flame. It doesn't take much, y'know, the light of a man's sexuality is enough to burn me.
Susan, that's a pretty bittersweet confession. Very touching. <sigh>
I truly hope that you are to be drawn towards a flame that illuminates your heart, without burning you in any way.
Lar
Posted by Susan47 on June 3, 2005, at 17:46:05
In reply to Re: Stereotypes » Susan47, posted by Larry Hoover on June 3, 2005, at 17:00:56
Mmm. Me, too. I wonder how the babble party's going. Has anyone heard from Sunny? I need to call her today, this afternoon, she's three hours different.
Posted by Susan47 on June 3, 2005, at 17:55:47
In reply to Re: Stereotypes, posted by Susan47 on June 3, 2005, at 17:46:05
Posted by damos on June 3, 2005, at 22:02:06
In reply to Called Sunny, left a message in her mailbox. (nm), posted by Susan47 on June 3, 2005, at 17:55:47
Thanks Susan, I know that took a lot to do. You're a truly special person. Love you dearly. Sending all my gooderest thoughts to Sunny and all my babble friends who are doin' it tough right now.
Posted by 10derHeart on June 3, 2005, at 22:18:21
In reply to Re: Stereotypes, posted by Susan47 on June 2, 2005, at 8:44:24
Thanks for being willing to answer. I thought my question maybe was a little thoughtless and unnecessary after I posted it. But then, I hardly control whether you respond or not, right?
My intention was purely a desire to understand your reaction better.I just think differently about maleness and sexuality and mentioning certain aspects of people, I guess. It's all pretty beautiful to me, and exciting, but doesn't trigger too much fear - well, not yet. We shall see one day IRL :-)
But I understand a little about what you wrote, and how that is for you. We have different backgrounds, and so the fear part for me is seldom there. With what you've been through, I think you are incredibly brave to even want to deal with men at all. You really are.
Sorry if I stirred the pot....my curiosty does tend to get the better of me, but Susan, you write such amazingly interesting things, you know...
Posted by Larry Hoover on June 4, 2005, at 10:13:03
In reply to Called Sunny, left a message in her mailbox. (nm), posted by Susan47 on June 3, 2005, at 17:55:47
Posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 12:02:36
In reply to Re: Called Sunny, left a message in her mailbox. » Susan47, posted by damos on June 3, 2005, at 22:02:06
Thank-you Damos. How lovely, how beautiful your sentiments are to everyone. Mmmmm, huge hug, cheek to cheek.
She hasn't called back.
That isn't like her.
Not in her good state.
Yes.
Now I'm worried, too.
I didn't take it too seriously, at first, because I know she has her ups and downs, and they're fierce, but she's a cat, you know, when you hear her talk you know she's a fighter. And I have a lot of faith in Sunny. I do. She's a clever woman.
But I hope she's making some good choices.
Because I am worried about her.
And I don't know how much any of us can do to really help.
Should I call again?
Posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 12:24:21
In reply to Re: Stereotypes » Susan47, posted by 10derHeart on June 3, 2005, at 22:18:21
No, my first reaction to what you're writing now is no, I'm not fearful, but then I make a big chain, you know, a heavy chain with huge, heavy steel links, it's a link from the dock to the ship ... when I was three we "came to America" ... I remember a huge ocean liner, with big anchors in front, and a huge wooden dock, empty but for some few tiny humans ... I remember the solidity of the dock beneath my feet, I remember some huge emotion, my father's excitement ... a smell of ocean .. it was Hamburg ...
Whew.
Don't know why I just went there. I haven't remembered this incident so clearly, so freely, in my life. I remember this.
Oh yes, penises. Lovely, lovely hard and soft hot and mellow things .. attached to a mind, attached to strength, attached to me ... hmh. No, not attached to me, but inside me, somewhere ...
Okay.
Yes, I suppose somewhere inside me is a fear of men's sexuality. I want to find it beautiful, I want to find my own beautiful. Maybe the fear is that it's not acceptable? I think my parents were really really sexual, even in front of us, Well, I think about the way they were and yes, they really were in some ways.. they were sometimes pretty disgusting about it, in my little mind .. but I don't know why I think that, except when I think they didn't like to see anything sexual about us, or maybe it was that they did, you know, and they laughed at it.
Or something.
Something.
Wish I knew, think it might not be important to dissect, you know but I have this feeling that my subconscious isn't going to let it rest.
It never does.
I try, but I have this really strong subconscious mind.
Whew.
Posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 12:25:10
In reply to If you hear, let us know? (nm) » Susan47, posted by Larry Hoover on June 4, 2005, at 10:13:03
Thanks for reminding me, I don't think I'd forget but I never know, these days. My short-term memory's getting worse.
Posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 14:49:51
In reply to Re: If you hear, let us know? » Larry Hoover, posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 12:25:10
Talked to her a little while ago and she's in hospital, sounds like as long as she's there she's getting what she needs. She's going to try to come online as soon as she can, she's sorry she didn't respond to people who Babbled her, she had no access to her email but she's planning on getting back to everybody as soon as she can. Thanks to everybody, it's so nice for her to be cared for.
Posted by TamaraJ on June 4, 2005, at 15:38:52
In reply to I heard., posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 14:49:51
Thanks, Susan, for letting us know. I am glad she is getting what she needs and is safe. If you talk to her again before she can get on-line, please tell her she has nothing, absolutely nothing, to be sorry for. Her safety and well-being are the most important things right now. I think everyone here just wants her to know that she is in our thoughts and we are hoping she is feeling better soon.
You take care, Susan.
Tamara
> Talked to her a little while ago and she's in hospital, sounds like as long as she's there she's getting what she needs. She's going to try to come online as soon as she can, she's sorry she didn't respond to people who Babbled her, she had no access to her email but she's planning on getting back to everybody as soon as she can. Thanks to everybody, it's so nice for her to be cared for.
Posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 17:13:25
In reply to Sigh of Relief » Susan47, posted by TamaraJ on June 4, 2005, at 15:38:52
I'm going to call her unit and get an address there. Because she can only use the phone a couple of more days, apparently. I'm thinking it might be a week or more, maybe a couple of weeks till she gets out and I may print off your posts for her and mail them.
Posted by TamaraJ on June 4, 2005, at 17:24:49
In reply to Re: Sigh of Relief, posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 17:13:25
That's a wonderful idea, Susan. You are a good friend, and are really nice to do that. It helps to know that others care and are thinking good thoughts and sending well-wishes. Too bad we couldn't do one of those e-cards or something to send along with all the posts.
Tamara
> I'm going to call her unit and get an address there. Because she can only use the phone a couple of more days, apparently. I'm thinking it might be a week or more, maybe a couple of weeks till she gets out and I may print off your posts for her and mail them.
Posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 18:11:48
In reply to Re: Sigh of Relief » Susan47, posted by TamaraJ on June 4, 2005, at 17:24:49
I've saved some posts from another board, I'm compiling them into one document, I think it might be nice for her to hear your voices.
Posted by TamaraJ on June 4, 2005, at 18:14:30
In reply to Re: Sigh of Relief » TamaraJ, posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 18:11:48
That's lovely. I am going to go through the poems and other things that I have gathered over time and try to post something here that can be sent along to her. Stupid idea?
> I've saved some posts from another board, I'm compiling them into one document, I think it might be nice for her to hear your voices.
Posted by Tamar on June 4, 2005, at 19:37:02
In reply to Re: Sigh of Relief » TamaraJ, posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 18:11:48
> I've saved some posts from another board, I'm compiling them into one document, I think it might be nice for her to hear your voices.
That's a great idea. Please pass on my best wishes. I'll be thinking of her.
Tamar
Posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 22:26:59
In reply to Re: Sigh of Relief » Susan47, posted by TamaraJ on June 4, 2005, at 18:14:30
No, it's a good one. A couple would be good.
Posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 22:28:33
In reply to Re: Sigh of Relief » Susan47, posted by Tamar on June 4, 2005, at 19:37:02
It would be better if post something yourself, maybe .. because, only because I will probably forget. I'm not that organized. Look at the bottom of Social, I think that's where I put it. The request for messages for Sunny.
Posted by Larry Hoover on June 5, 2005, at 15:23:49
In reply to I heard., posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 14:49:51
> Talked to her a little while ago and she's in hospital, sounds like as long as she's there she's getting what she needs. She's going to try to come online as soon as she can, she's sorry she didn't respond to people who Babbled her, she had no access to her email but she's planning on getting back to everybody as soon as she can. Thanks to everybody, it's so nice for her to be cared for.
I am such a worrier. I feel a lot better knowing she's in the hospital, strange as that may sound.
Lar
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