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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by sunny10 on October 30, 2004, at 10:26:01
Is anyone out there??? I need some help.
I am scared of "recreational" drugs. I come from a background of psychological abuse from alcoholic ex-husband, have always had a fear of drugs- any type of substance abuse.
I have been living with my significant other since August. He has a history of drug abuse, but "has adopted a healthier outlook on life", complete with exercise three times a week, eating only healthy foods, taking vitamins/ supplements, et cetera. He knows that I am scared to death of susbstance abuse- drug use of any kind. Even my own AD's.
At first he was drinking more than usual, but we had some stress involving my son who, as of two weeks ago, is no longer living with us but with my ex-husband.
Two Thursdays ago, my SI came home from work and I could tell right away that he was not himself. He was completely hyper, pupils all the way dilated, didn't fall asleep until about 1 am (usually conks out at 9!). I thought it was isolated- he told me it was too much Red Bull during the day...
Last night, he was acting the same way. And, last night, in the basement, I found one of his CD cases hidden in the basement rafters (the light bulb hit the plastic case, making it shine, so it drew my eye).
The CD case had white powder on it and faint images of lines. He was a "rather sophisticated" drug user, so I can't immediately assume it was cocaine- it could be some other snort-able drug.
How would I know, they've always scared the hell out of me.I couldn't sleep- dozed a little in my son's now ex-room- now I am at work. It was the only place I could think to come after "escaping" my home. Confrontation scares me just as much as illegal drugs.
What do I do now- please,please,please, can someone offer some advice???
-sunny10
Posted by dazedandconfused on October 30, 2004, at 17:31:46
In reply to Just discovered my SI is using illegal drugs-HELP, posted by sunny10 on October 30, 2004, at 10:26:01
Sunny,
I am really sorry you are in such a tough situation. I am not sure what to tell you but wanted to respond to your post. Do you have a therapist you can talk to? If not, some type of 12 step meeting like Naranon would probably be helpful. Many moons ago I was in a similar situation, however the relationship was effectively over before he relapsed so it wasn't much of an issue. I think I would get support for yourself before you confront him about it. If he is using, he will probably just lie as users can be very manipulative. Anyway, that's my experience. Sending you good thoughts!dazed
Posted by corafree on October 30, 2004, at 23:39:48
In reply to Re: Just discovered my SI is using illegal drugs-HELP, posted by dazedandconfused on October 30, 2004, at 17:31:46
Help...it's Sat eve mountain time - almost 10p. I am so lonely; sick and tired of being alone. I could call one of the 'bad' guys, and am on my way to doing it. Can someone stop me? cf
Posted by sunny10 on November 1, 2004, at 9:15:44
In reply to Re: Just discovered my SI is using illegal drugs-HELP, posted by dazedandconfused on October 30, 2004, at 17:31:46
I wandered around town all day Sat.- realized that I couldn't sleep at the office anyway...
Wound up at a friend's apt...she was at her weekend house(yeah, I know- must be nice, hunh?!).I wandered around all day Sun. after not really sleeping since Thurs. By Sun. eve I had to go home- I couldn't sleep in my car (they call that vagrancy here, which is against the law).
He didn't deny it- he knew he was caught. He said he was really sorry that he had destroyed our trust that way, that he thought he was done with that stuff, that he really wanted a life with me and not a life with drugs- that he needed my support and my love.
How do I believe him? He had promised not to ever do them around me, at the very least. He had told me when we went on vacation that he had never brought a woman to his favorite New Orleans hotel until me- he lied about that, too, I found out. He was just with someone there in May of 2002. I found the hotel paperwork in his things when I went looking for his stash to flush it down the toilet on Friday night when I found the CD case and couldn't sleep.
I told him all of this- I'm not the one hiding things.
He told me he'll do anything to win back my trust.
I've been stupid with men every time. Every time I wind up with someone who hurts me. How do I trust him or myself? I felt so hurt by him, yet at the same time, so hurt by me- that I'd "messed up yet again", is there any chance I will ever NOT be stupid? I just wanted to die- literally.
How do I "give him another chance"? Or me??
How do I "love and support him; to help him stay away from the coke"? (Yes, it was coke- in OUR house !!!!!)
Anything you can say will be helpful- I realize that this issue is, at this point, as much about ME and my fears, major depression, anxiety, et cetera as it is about him. That's why I'm not sure the Naranon would help me.
Many thanks,
sunny10
Posted by octopusprime on November 1, 2004, at 10:21:48
In reply to Re: Just discovered my SI is using illegal drugs-HELP » dazedandconfused, posted by sunny10 on November 1, 2004, at 9:15:44
sunny,
so sorry you are feeling so down.
i know if i had slept as poorly as you have, i would feel confused and irrational. do you have something to help you sleep? a t or a pdoc for support?
if i was in your shoes i would try not to make any major decisions until YOU are feeling more like yourself.
you ask a lot of very difficult questions in your posts. it sounds like your SO is asking a lot of you - love him, support him, keep him away from drugs. since your SO is a functioning adult (i assume), it is HIS responsibility to love himself, support himself, and keep himself away from drugs FIRST. i don't think it's fair of him to push that responsibility on to you.
so you have to ask yourself a very tough question ... what do you want from this relationship FOR YOURSELF? are YOUR needs being met? what kinds of things do you want to do with your life? can you picture your SO realistically being by your side while you bring positive change into your life?
i hate to recommend this book, lest i sound condescending, but i know i really benefitted from reading "codependent no more" when i was dealing with addiction and drug use in somebody i loved.
all the best of luck. please put YOU first.
Posted by sunny10 on November 1, 2004, at 10:36:33
In reply to Re: Just discovered my SI is using illegal drugs-HELP » sunny10, posted by octopusprime on November 1, 2004, at 10:21:48
Well, those are the big questions, aren't they???
First of all, AM I being rational about ANY of it??
I know that there are TONS of people out there (and, as a matter of fact, on these boards), who think nothing of "dabbling" with recreational drugs. To them, it is not a big deal. But to ME it is. Am I being irrationally afraid of them to begin with? Am I really the problem, not him?
In terms of "what am I looking for out of a relationship? We have been planning to "retire" from the corporate world and run away together to go work at a Club Med or something, live poor in Hawaii or Belize, instead of living poor in the US. If you're going to be poor, it may as well be in the sun...
This is all why I am so shattered by the whole thing... I don't know whether I am being totally "square" or whether he is "truly addicted"; thus there would be no future to plan on. I don't know ANYTHING about drugs- they have always scared me too much to do much research into the phenomena.
But "people in the know", ie; Larry Hoover, and a research doctor that I know personally have/do "dabble in" this stuff. They are chemists and they don't seem afraid.
I am so confused, I don't know what to think...and I know it's not caused by meds- this is REAL stuff happening here- not stuff I've made up in my head...so my pdoc couln't help.
Of course, my T is out of town, and by the time she catches up with her patients, it'll be a month 'til I see her...
In the meantime, I don't know how to "act", how to "react", how to "be".
-sunny10
Posted by octopusprime on November 1, 2004, at 11:12:12
In reply to Re: Just discovered my SI is using illegal drugs-HELP » octopusprime, posted by sunny10 on November 1, 2004, at 10:36:33
sunny - i think i understand where you're coming from a bit more clearly now. i was ambiguous and lacked detail in the first post i made to you. let me add some more details.
i am a recreational drug user now, i was a very heavy user before. i have been in relationships with casual users, heavy users, former users. and this is the experience i come to the table with.
it seems like the issue is about the drugs. the drugs are the just the catalyst, though ... it seems to me that this is about TRUST.
i think you are being totally rational to be scared of drugs. if you have issues with depression and anxiety, surely you understand how fragile the brain chemistry is and how dangerous it can be to muck with it.
these are your core values and beliefs. can you live with your SO if he does not share them? you sound very shaken at your core. and having your usual support network away (your T) does not help. can you put yourself on the top of her priority list when she returns? you need support.
anyway the reason why i asked what you want from the relationship, and why i asked you to focus on you, is because people that are involved with drug users tend to take on inappropriate responsibility for their loved ones, frequently to the detriment of their own selves and their own core. i don't know if this is you or not, but it might be something to think about.
as somebody that has struggled with my own mental health, i am often thrilled when somebody will put up with my sh*t and will overlook behaviour that is inappropriate or otherwise not good for me.
lying is the kind of behaviour that is never acceptable to me. and i don't know how you can overcome that. you may need the assistance of a counselor for the two of you.
i don't know if you can separate the issues of the drugs and the lying ... but i think it might be a good place to start? if one of your fundamental needs is trust, you will both have to work very very hard to regain that trust.
also if you need a safe drug-free space in your own home, that is reasonable. however, you have to state this to your SO and negotiate or take this space for yourself. you might want to think up an action plan about what to do if your safe space is violated. write down your action plan, and be prepared to execute it. it's not about empty threats, it's about preserving your sanity.
ps - i mentioned visiting a pdoc if you are having trouble sleeping ... i know you are not making this up. a good night's sleep does help, and i would not be ashamed to ask for my favourite sleep aid to help me through what must be a difficult and stressful time.
pps - from your posts i get the impression that you are very confused ... this is why i was thinking that you might want avoid major decisions about staying together or breaking up before you have found some rest and clarity
ppps - good luck
Posted by sunny10 on November 1, 2004, at 11:35:58
In reply to to clarify a bit » sunny10, posted by octopusprime on November 1, 2004, at 11:12:12
Yes, that clarification really does help A LOT !
I may be way out of line demanding that "MY SAFE PLACE" be the entire house- but I need to be safe at home- the whole home, not sneaking around, et cetera, in another room. He SAYS this is "fine", he "understands that", but...
As you said, at this point it is MOSTLY about the trust. BECAUSE we HAD this conversation before, where I said that if he wanted to do drugs- go out with friends and do it; not in our house and not around me. He is a different person when he did coke those two times- just talking to him I felt like I was cheating on him! And we had sex once- it was thoroughly degrading to me... I wanted to make love, but the person in the bed was a stranger. THAT's why I said, "not around me at all".
Maybe your most helpful comment was couples therapy. I don't know why I didn't think of it. If he is for real, and not handing me a junkie line, the "he I know" would definitely see the benefit in it. If the person I talk to after work says yes, then I think it'll really be HIM and worth pursuing. If he says, no, than I think it'll always the the other "him" and I should do as you say and protect myself by walking away.
Does this sound reasonable?
-sunny10
Posted by octopusprime on November 1, 2004, at 21:27:19
In reply to Re: to clarify a bit » octopusprime, posted by sunny10 on November 1, 2004, at 11:35:58
> Maybe your most helpful comment was couples therapy. I don't know why I didn't think of it. If he is for real, and not handing me a junkie line, the "he I know" would definitely see the benefit in it. If the person I talk to after work says yes, then I think it'll really be HIM and worth pursuing. If he says, no, than I think it'll always the the other "him" and I should do as you say and protect myself by walking away.
>
> Does this sound reasonable?
hi sunny,i think i suggested an action plan if you felt unsafe - it could just be a couple of weeks of staying with family or friends, or it could be finding other avenues of support if you decide you want to learn to live with his behaviour. of course, if you want to walk out, that's totally up to you.
but it's about empowering yourself to decide for yourself what you can and cannot live with. and it's about trusting yourself to make tough decisions that are for your best interests and promote your mental health.
i am concerned about you sweetie, you are in a tough spot. i wish you all the best and hope a third party can help you work thru it.
Posted by corafree on November 1, 2004, at 21:36:43
In reply to Re: Just discovered my SI is using illegal drugs-HELP » dazedandconfused, posted by sunny10 on November 1, 2004, at 9:15:44
Sunny10
Think you really need to put your foot down.
I don't see how possible for you do what you need for you, w/ mistrust with him.
But, look at me, I'm so lonely (because I kick their rear-ends to the road when they pull this stuff.)
I am considering letting a man in recovery, proclaiming he is a changed man, back into my life, as I am critically $ depleted and overwhelmingly lonely.
He was court-ordered. He is 6+ months clean. But, he is still on probation, and still has to be drug-tested. But worry what may happen when he is not under the state's thumb?
When my father/best friend/mentor passed away in Feb., I lost some finances. He would help me financially, not a lot, now and then.
My mother and rest of fam' dis'd me after Dad died, just washed their hands of me.
The man I talk about above is the only person who will drop everything to come to me, help me by staying w/ me when I am having panic attacks or talking with me.
Could he really be changed?
I am praying for a financial and emotional partner. I just keep praying.
What does SI stand for?
(0> I wandered around town all day Sat.- realized that I couldn't sleep at the office anyway...
> Wound up at a friend's apt...she was at her weekend house(yeah, I know- must be nice, hunh?!).
>
> I wandered around all day Sun. after not really sleeping since Thurs. By Sun. eve I had to go home- I couldn't sleep in my car (they call that vagrancy here, which is against the law).
>
> He didn't deny it- he knew he was caught. He said he was really sorry that he had destroyed our trust that way, that he thought he was done with that stuff, that he really wanted a life with me and not a life with drugs- that he needed my support and my love.
>
> How do I believe him? He had promised not to ever do them around me, at the very least. He had told me when we went on vacation that he had never brought a woman to his favorite New Orleans hotel until me- he lied about that, too, I found out. He was just with someone there in May of 2002. I found the hotel paperwork in his things when I went looking for his stash to flush it down the toilet on Friday night when I found the CD case and couldn't sleep.
>
> I told him all of this- I'm not the one hiding things.
>
> He told me he'll do anything to win back my trust.
>
> I've been stupid with men every time. Every time I wind up with someone who hurts me. How do I trust him or myself? I felt so hurt by him, yet at the same time, so hurt by me- that I'd "messed up yet again", is there any chance I will ever NOT be stupid? I just wanted to die- literally.
>
> How do I "give him another chance"? Or me??
>
> How do I "love and support him; to help him stay away from the coke"? (Yes, it was coke- in OUR house !!!!!)
>
> Anything you can say will be helpful- I realize that this issue is, at this point, as much about ME and my fears, major depression, anxiety, et cetera as it is about him. That's why I'm not sure the Naranon would help me.
>
> Many thanks,
> sunny10
Posted by sunny10 on November 2, 2004, at 11:13:48
In reply to Re: Just discovered my SI is using illegal drugs-HELP » sunny10, posted by corafree on November 1, 2004, at 21:36:43
Wow- we are in "similar" situations,both poor, wanting love... up to a point- I actually didn't knowingly attach myself to an abuser who'd actually been through the system (gee, I THINK I didn't.... so many secrets he holds- maybe that's one of them).
Mine managed to stay away from the drugs for six months on his own- no treatment centers, no nothing- just cold turkey. I think it's a fear of commitment and "loss of identity" crap that caused him to do the opposite of what I would want him to do. Man's equivalent of cold feet, maybe? He used to live in CO, USA. In CO you are legally married if you co-habitate for over 6 months...We are at three months now... I think that's part of it. Who knows, I could be wrong and he's just a user/abuser... G*d, I don't know WHAT to think anymore...
I know what you mean about wanting to love them, wanting to believe that because they have helped you, (nurtured you, supported you,) in the past that they might be rehabilitated?? Maybe, "dear G*d, please, please, please just let me have this one??"
That's what I am feeling right now.
I was freaking out to the point of irrationality when I started this post... "SI" should really be SO, of course...D**'d keyboard keys too close together- typing stutter...
-sunny10
Posted by corafree on November 2, 2004, at 15:53:06
In reply to Re: Just discovered my SI is using illegal drugs-HELP » corafree, posted by sunny10 on November 2, 2004, at 11:13:48
Yeah I see the i and the o are close! I have known my SO for 8 yrs. We had both gone through divorces and met in the hospital, both depressed. He had been suicidal. We hit it off right away, well anyone would with him, he is really good at that. He could have you believe anything. He can charm you to the core. He is handsome, yet now clean has gained 'beer gut' that he promises he'll have gone soon. We cohabitated on and off over these years, never three months straight, usually got in an argument about the 3rd day and he'd run home to mom. He told me in the hospital that he was never going to tweak again, but w/ me, at my house, he started, and then I started again too. I quit on my own at least 5 years now. I lost sooooo much to that drug. At one time, before he had stolen or hidden or lied to the max, I just kind of acted like it wasn't happening because I loved him so much, but soon it came to a head and I think it was then that I stopped loving him. Now, after my father's death, and my mother and sisters and bro dissing me, I am so lonely. Dale has been there for me all along. I got him connected for help, he commited a felony (drugs), well to make this shorter, he has been clean 6 months and says he loves me more now than ever, and will do anything he can to win back my trust and love. It is so hard to say no, especially because I don't even have a good man friend, ya' know someone to lift things for me (broken back from ex-husband), someone to run to store for me if I need something. Anyway, no one in my fam of origin or my three children, want me w/ him. But, all of them have someone with them. They have no idea what loneliness can do to you. I have completely losts my social skills. It's just been too long. He is really into his program, but like I said he is still state ordered. I think it best see how he does after out from under state's thumb, BUT I need the comfort, companionship, and $ now. Those were all things I got from my dad (passed away Feb this year). I always felt stronger when he was alive and if I needed $100, he'd send it to me. My mother has just shut me out! My three grown children all live with a companion. I would have to have a premarital agreement, but how can I protect my state services, because I am receiving SSD, when he has the felon status. I don't know who to talk to about this. Felon's cannot vote, cannot participate in Housing programs, and other things. I really am a sweet person who fell for a charmer. I've even felt suicidal some lonely evenings. lets keep in touch; I'll invite you to Yahoo Messenger. cf
Posted by sunny10 on November 3, 2004, at 9:38:24
In reply to Re: Just discovered my SI is using illegal drugs-HELP » sunny10, posted by corafree on November 2, 2004, at 15:53:06
Thanks for the long explanation; it helps me "see" your point of view.
Being dependent on SSD has its own set of ambivilant feelings without even HAVING the rest of the stuff going on, doesn't it?!?
As far as what your fam of origin thinks, IMO I wouldn't pay much attention to people who "shut me out"- how can they be reacting to anything they "know" about you if they have already shut you out?
Do you have a T to talk to about these issues? My biggest problem is someone else's trust issues, which, frankly would only be eased by HIM going to a T (!)and my fear of abandonment which all my T's have told me to "just get over it- you're an adult now". The problems YOU are mentioning here involve federal agencies, et cetera. The T can help you sort out what would be best for you.
You mention a premarital agreement... do you know for sure that it would enable you to still receive your SSD? Make sure you check the www.state.(two letter state code).gov website for whatever concrete info you can find out about this. If the state assigned you to a social worker under SSD, try calling that person. It is a good sign that you are questioning all of this- believe it or not, it's a sign of being rational about your decision-making at this time; show them that! I say that not because I am a T or pdoc or anything, but just from personal experience.... Frankly, I go two ways about it.. 1) I just jump in and make rash decisions without thinking things all the way thru- using wishes and dreams to "make things turn out the way I want" (usually not even a distant relative to reality..sigh) or,
2) Ponder every aspect of every decision (obsessing, usually)until there are so many "options" that I am frozen by indecision. Although my fears (confrontation, abandonment, et cetera) freeze me up- I then have a bunch of options that someone can help me sort through to help me see the right ones.That's where I see you- am I even close???
-sunny10
Posted by corafree on November 3, 2004, at 23:39:46
In reply to Re: Just discovered my SI is using illegal drugs-HELP » corafree, posted by sunny10 on November 3, 2004, at 9:38:24
Yes, I am asking my T, not my awful P, a bit about it. She says 'no in love, no marriage, and also that reconsidering a relationship w/ a former drug abuser, thief, liar, especially one that is still court mandated, should be given a lot of time in order to see if those changes he says have occurred in him, are for real'.
I have no social worker. I worked a bit too long before life took its toll on my mental and physical stability, so am not entitled to 'free' state help.
My fear of abandonment is way out there. I do not like to be alone. Not sure why, as doesn't seem to run in my 'perfect fam' (who have abandoned me).
I feel I deserve a very honest and trustworthy man. I know I deserve one. But, waiting and being so lonely is so terrible.
I try to do all things as I should. I do see a therapist in dialectical behavioral therapy, a therapy for people whose emotions seem to run there lives. I do not have a chance to 'talk over' anything with any person, caseworker or therapist.
My caseworker, tells me things like 'it's your decision',
and the time spent w/ my T is max 10m per topic, as DBT is very structured on learning skills to handle emotions.
I am not allowed to see another therapist at the same time as seeing a therapist re: conflict of interest.
I need a man who doesn't focus on sex. It seems to have been drilled into my head that 'men only want me for sex' by my ex's. Even now, the father of my son calls and says I can lean on him IF, and another ex-husband did the same thing.
I only have one brother, and he, being a part of my fam of origin, has dis'd me.
My father, when alive, always had my back, and that made 'men relationships' easier to let come and go, always knowing there was a man who loved me, no matter what, neck up, all the time. I feel that is part of the reason my fam of origin has dis'd me, a bit of jealousy on all their parts.
Yes, of course I would research the negatives of being deeply involved w/ a felon, even if felony quashed.
My illness is PTSD, due to a lot of spousal and other relationship violence and abuse.
I grew up ignorant of things so horrible, so swallowed me up; a total lack of ability to know to handle.
Every day I feel I am one step closer to death. On the inside, as my father died, felt that I did also. Losing my father, my grief so high, no fam, children too busy for me, no one to talk w/ over coffee...ya' know, no friend, I become so confused, feeling like I will lose my mind if something good doesn't come to me through prayer and 'just because I do deserve it'.
Have to ask 'you-know-who' for time, a lot more time. He will be much more than upset!
Tks sunny 10 ... be well .. cf
> Thanks for the long explanation; it helps me "see" your point of view.
> Being dependent on SSD has its own set of ambivilant feelings without even HAVING the rest of the stuff going on, doesn't it?!?
> As far as what your fam of origin thinks, IMO I wouldn't pay much attention to people who "shut me out"- how can they be reacting to anything they "know" about you if they have already shut you out?
> Do you have a T to talk to about these issues? My biggest problem is someone else's trust issues, which, frankly would only be eased by HIM going to a T (!)and my fear of abandonment which all my T's have told me to "just get over it- you're an adult now". The problems YOU are mentioning here involve federal agencies, et cetera. The T can help you sort out what would be best for you.
> You mention a premarital agreement... do you know for sure that it would enable you to still receive your SSD? Make sure you check the www.state.(two letter state code).gov website for whatever concrete info you can find out about this. If the state assigned you to a social worker under SSD, try calling that person. It is a good sign that you are questioning all of this- believe it or not, it's a sign of being rational about your decision-making at this time; show them that! I say that not because I am a T or pdoc or anything, but just from personal experience.... Frankly, I go two ways about it.. 1) I just jump in and make rash decisions without thinking things all the way thru- using wishes and dreams to "make things turn out the way I want" (usually not even a distant relative to reality..sigh) or,
> 2) Ponder every aspect of every decision (obsessing, usually)until there are so many "options" that I am frozen by indecision. Although my fears (confrontation, abandonment, et cetera) freeze me up- I then have a bunch of options that someone can help me sort through to help me see the right ones.
>
> That's where I see you- am I even close???
>
> -sunny10
Posted by sunny10 on November 4, 2004, at 13:04:43
In reply to Re: Just discovered my SI is using illegal drugs-HELP » sunny10, posted by corafree on November 3, 2004, at 23:39:46
I have another thread going on the Psychology board.... when someone over there comes up with some type of therapy which is supposed to help ME, I'll ket you know....
Sounds like we react to things in very similar ways and don't seem to know why we can't just be freakin' "normal" enough for someone to love us....whatever normal is anyway...
Hang in there- I have to- ; )
-sunny10
This is the end of the thread.
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