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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by zenhussy on October 12, 2006, at 15:54:14
In reply to My T Got Bad News, posted by mair on October 12, 2006, at 13:32:50
oh mair! so sorry to hear this. keep in touch as you're able to lean on the ppl here who care and are invested in keeping you around and upright.
kindly,
--zh
Posted by annierose on October 12, 2006, at 16:29:45
In reply to My T Got Bad News, posted by mair on October 12, 2006, at 13:32:50
(((((((((((mair))))))))) and your t -
please be gentle on yourself. this is incredibly difficult for both of you. although it is her job to be there for you, she will probably not be her 100% best. i can't imagine what she is facing, but keep in mind, more and more woman have successful treatment. she will get through this. i think it was brave of her to share this news with her clients. i would want to know if my t was sick too.
Posted by Dinah on October 12, 2006, at 19:38:27
In reply to My T Got Bad News, posted by mair on October 12, 2006, at 13:32:50
Mair, I'm so sorry.
I have every confidence that the two of you will get through this. But I know that the process will not be an easy one.
((((Mair))))
Posted by Poet on October 12, 2006, at 21:01:00
In reply to My T Got Bad News, posted by mair on October 12, 2006, at 13:32:50
Hi Mair,
I can understand why your T is trying to put up that brave front, but she has to be afraid. I would be afraid in her situation and can't imagine anyone not being so. Cancer is scary.
I'll surround her with the white light of healing.
((((Mair)))))
Poet
Posted by Jost on October 12, 2006, at 21:51:11
In reply to My T Got Bad News, posted by mair on October 12, 2006, at 13:32:50
That's hard news to get.
Has she given you any idea of what to expect? how much she'll be able to see, communicate with you about how she is?
That would break my heart if it happened to my T. I'd need to be as aware of possible of what he was going through.
Were you able to tell her how you felt? feel relatively clear about what the immediate future holds? When do you see her next?
Jost
Posted by mair on October 12, 2006, at 22:40:51
In reply to Re: My T Got Bad News, posted by Jost on October 12, 2006, at 21:51:11
It is horrible. I have this very heavy heart, and it's impossible for me not to look at things from her perspective. She says that work is a relief to her, that she can compartmentalize and that it's good for her to focus on other people's issues. I understand that but I think it will be very difficult for her to keep her patients focused on themselves, particularly as she gets sicker. It is courageous of her to talk to all of her patients about this, but she sort of has no choice since her schedule is so up in the air. I imagine her going home, at the end of a day like today when she probably had to cover the same ground with everyone she saw, and just feeling such a relief that she got through the day.
She's a single mother and is not in a position where she can afford not to work, so I'm sure that on top of everything else, she's worried about going through periods when she can't work, either because she physically isn't up to it, or mentally can't be there for her patients.
I'm not at all at a place where I can talk to her about what I'm feeling, and I don't really want to, because frankly, I don't want her to have to talk about herself anymore than she has to. Other than being very worried about her, I'm not in a bad place right now. She expressed some concern about having to miss alot of sessions with me because I'm used to seeing her so frequently. I don't have to be seeing her alot right now to stay sane - it's just been our experience that I have a lot of trouble maintaining a sense of connection and continuity when too much time transpires between sessions. I've been seeing her at least twice a week for years, and during some extended low periods, I saw her 3x a week.
Historically, I tend to regress at the end of every year. The holidays are stressful, recurring issues I have at work always loom larger at the end of the year, and winter is a tough time all around. Hopefully I can hold things together enough that I won't feel like I need to lean on her as much.
mair
Posted by Daisym on October 12, 2006, at 23:46:39
In reply to Thank you everyone, posted by mair on October 12, 2006, at 22:40:51
Perhaps what you will see is that she really can compartmentalize most of what happens for her. My guess is that she has a disability insurance plan, so there will be less worry about finances.
I'm glad you are in a good place right now. Perhaps this is the time to add in some other supports to your routine - exercise, yoga, meditation, dancing, --- anything that allows you to feel taken care of, in addition to your therapist. And you will get to see her. So maybe that will be enough for a little while.
I'm so sorry all this is happening. It is very scary stuff and touches so many people. I'll keep you both in my prayers.
Hugs,
Daisy
Posted by mair on October 13, 2006, at 12:34:11
In reply to Re: Thank you everyone » mair, posted by Daisym on October 12, 2006, at 23:46:39
Thanks Daisy
I think I posted last night with a false sense of confidence. I've been able to get very little work done today, because I keep getting overwelmed by these waves of anxiety or just general unease.
My most immediate worry is that I'll start slipping, at least in part as a reaction to what is happening to her, and I won't be able to process that with her and I'll also feel awful (and guilty) if I get worse and become more needy at a time when she can't be as available.
And what if this all becomes just a self-fulfilling prophesy.
Shoot
mair
Posted by TherapyGirl on October 13, 2006, at 16:15:52
In reply to My T Got Bad News, posted by mair on October 12, 2006, at 13:32:50
I'm so very sorry. I was off the board for a couple of days, so just seeing this now.
You're both in my thoughts and prayers. I don't know what else to say, but I am really sorry.
((((Mair))))
Posted by Daisym on October 13, 2006, at 18:18:06
In reply to Re: Thank you everyone » Daisym, posted by mair on October 13, 2006, at 12:34:11
I'm embarrassed to write this, I almost babblemailed it to you but maybe it will help?
This summer my therapist told me something really sad that is going on in his private life. He felt so distant and unavailable, I thought he was pushing me away and wanting me to stand on my own two feet. So I had a melt down and kind of forced him to tell me.
For the next week I went back and forth between being flipped out and yet trying to be understanding, supportive and adult. It is hard not to think, "but what about me?" and yet it feels so awful to have that thought pop in. After the first week, I put it away. The third week I got really mad about the whole thing and pulled inside myself for a little while. Then I decided I should cut back on therapy - and then I was going to just talk about easy stuff -- and then I decided I should terminate. I had tantrums during sessions, I took it all back, and I apologized for being selfish about a million times. I was so ashamed of myself. But I couldn't help it. I even told him I felt "tricked" into trusting him and believing that he really could be there for me. Even though it wasn't his fault, the universe was conspiring against me and taking him away. *sigh*
It has been a really hard few months. I'm still not sure how to get a handle on everything I'm feeling. And sometimes my therapist has been defensive but mostly he just lets me talk it out and he agrees that it really sucks that this has happened. Both for him and for me. And then we get back to work on my stuff.
It isn't him who is sick - and I think that adds a whole different layer. But I wanted you to know that you certainly aren't alone in worrying about falling apart at the absolute worst time. I think you can expect to slip, after all, someone you care about is sick and this is scary stuff. But you have so much awareness around your triggers I think you will find ways to support yourself even if your therapy changes for awhile.
Hang in there.
Daisy
Posted by mair on October 17, 2006, at 17:56:23
In reply to Re: Thank you everyone » mair, posted by Daisym on October 13, 2006, at 18:18:06
I'm sorry I didn't respond to your last post, which I loved and did find helpful. I contracted one of those head colds that made it difficult for me to string two cogent thoughts together. Also my son showed up for the weekend from college, largely, I think, to transfer all the stress he feels about finding a job for next year (he's a senior), onto his easily stressed parents. Don't you have a son who's a senior also? I seem to recall that you were taking him to college 3 years ago at around the same time I was.
I probably know lots more about my T, and her life, than do many people. Sometime I think I might be better off knowing less, and other times I find myself getting annoyed when some significant piece of information is given me or discovered long after the fact - like it reinforces that feeling that I'm unimportant to her. I'm not sure there is a happy medium at all. She's always been pretty okay about answering personal questions, but I try not to abuse that. And when we have gotten involved in a discussion about some event in her life and how that might affect me, it's always amazing, and actually a little horrifying, how easily I can put her stuff in the background in favor of just talking about my stuff. But regardless, to my detriment, I'm constantly censoring those feelings I have which I deem to be immature; I'm always the adult who wishes that I could let myself be the selfish needy little kid - I never really saw what a valuable therapeutic tool that kind of regression could be until I started hanging around this board.
I'm pretty sure normalcy is what my T wants right now - I think she wants her patients bringing to her problems that aren't related to her. I hope that will be fine, although I'm also sure, when her illness is more demonstrable, that it will be really difficult for me not to feel pretty upset, and not to ask her a whole bunch of questions that she probably won't want to answer.
I guess I'll just have to come running here for that kind of processing. (-;
Thanks again
mair
Posted by zenhussy on December 16, 2006, at 21:17:55
In reply to Daisy, posted by mair on October 17, 2006, at 17:56:23
>>>I guess I'll just have to come running here for that kind of processing. (-;
Thanks again
mair<<<
Mair....jes checkin' in. Hoping things are going as well as is possible.
There's always open eyes and ears to listen and read when you're ready.
fondly,
--zh
Posted by mair on December 30, 2006, at 14:34:18
In reply to Re: My T Got Bad News » mair, posted by zenhussy on December 16, 2006, at 21:17:55
Thanks Zen
Dealing with a T's major health crisis is not an experience I'd wish on anyone. In the last couple of months, my T has had 4 surgical procedures including a partial mastectomy - something the first 3 procedures was supposed to avoid. With the recuperation time between each one, there have been alot of therapy gaps, of varying degrees of length. I'm in the middle of an almost 3 week gap now necessitated by the holidays and by my T's first go-around of chemo. Yesterday she started chemo and I felt this low level of anxiety for most of the day.
When I have had therapy there seems to have been alot of idle chit chat like friends having coffee, or something. I hate it; it feels worthless to me, but I guess it does have some worth because it helps me hold onto a sense of connection which for me is hard to achieve and hard to maintain.Traditionally this is the hardest time of year for me. In my office, it's a time when things are tallied - revenues attributable to each person mostly. The whole process highlights for me (and everyone else in the office) how unproductive i am in comparison to my colleagues, even when I'm working longer hours. In looking at the year end numbers, I also get to face up to the fact that for someone of my background and experience, I'm paid an embarrassingly meager amount. In 2006 we switched to a medical plan which offered me no mental health benefits if I stayed with my current T. My colleagues more or less agreed to pick up the difference between what i paid in T costs for 2006 and what I would have paid had we kept the old policy. When push came to shove, some of my colleagues balked at picking up the whole difference (because it was pretty damn high) which, of course, made me feel uncomfortable - and it was pretty awful to me even that I had to let them know how much my T costs were anyway.
They eventually ended up picking up the whole difference, but not before letting me know that they wouldn't do it in 2007 because the old wonderful indemnity policy we had before 2006 (with totally unmanaged mental health coverage) doesn't even exist anymore. So during this little interval, I've also been considering whether I should cut way back on Therapy. Of course, I can't think about doing that without considering that if I reduce the number of session, I'll be reducing my T's income at a time when her ability to work is severely compromised. If I admitted this to her, she'd tell me that it's not my responsibility to guarantee her a certain level of income. But since I have to keep the records which tell me exactly how much therapy costs me, I have the numbers to know how much income she'd lose if i cut back.
And then there's the issue of new year's resolutions. I always feel that I should make resolutions, but I can never decide on just one because there are just too many things about myself that I have to fix. It seems too difficult to just focus on one. I need to eat better and lose some weight. I need to exercise more (this shouldn't be as difficult as it seems since I'm not exercising at all now), I need to be much better about not spending money foolishly. I need to be better organized in so many different ways. I need to be much better about returning phone calls promptly, and getting work done more quickly. I need to be much more efficient about billing for what i've done. (My T correctly surmised once that billing people for work I've done for them is an agonizing process for me. So rarely do I feel "worth" what I'm supposed to charge so I find a ton of ways to reduce my bill or not send it at all). I need to be infinitely better about nurturing friendships and staying in touch with people.
When the list is so long, it's so hard to know where to begin.
Thanks so much for thinking of me.
fondly
mair
Posted by TherapyGirl on December 30, 2006, at 17:32:12
In reply to Re: My T Got Bad News (too long) » zenhussy, posted by mair on December 30, 2006, at 14:34:18
I'm sorry it's been so hard, both for you and your T, Mair.
You've been in my thoughts and prayers.
Posted by mair on December 31, 2006, at 9:31:13
In reply to Re: My T Got Bad News (too long) » mair, posted by TherapyGirl on December 30, 2006, at 17:32:12
Just now - to let me know that she weathered the first chemo treatment well and that she feels much better than she thought she would. She said she knew that I would be worried about her so she wanted me to have an update and to alert me that she might decide to come back to work sooner than anticipated.
I'm sorry that she felt that she should call me, but I'm touched that she did.
Posted by 10derHeart on December 31, 2006, at 10:22:50
In reply to My T just called me, posted by mair on December 31, 2006, at 9:31:13
Sounds like some of the best news possible, under these sort of circumstances. She seems like a really strong woman.
Keep hanging in there, mair. Hopefully her words from that call will be something to hold on to - a gift she freely wanted to give you, I think.
Posted by Dinah on December 31, 2006, at 10:52:22
In reply to My T just called me, posted by mair on December 31, 2006, at 9:31:13
I'm not sorry she called you! Don't think of it as feeling she had to. Think of it as wanting to touch base with someone she cares about, and has seen several times a week for years. I'm sure she *hopes* you care how she's doing, and wants to let you know.
I'm glad she's doing better than she expected. I hope things go well for her and for you.
In the meantime, how are you weathering the separation under the circumstances?
Posted by Dinah on December 31, 2006, at 10:59:07
In reply to Re: My T Got Bad News (too long) » zenhussy, posted by mair on December 30, 2006, at 14:34:18
Sorry, I hadn't seen this message.
I know you know that her income isn't your responsibility. But I totally understand how you feel. It's really hard for me to put aside my tendency to want to take care of people I care about.
Money... Boy, it's a huge issue for me. On both ends. I'm working tons right now until the end of the year to keep my medical benefits, and they reduced them a few years ago to two thirds of what it used to be. They swore it had nothing to do with me, but...
I think I'll adopt all of your resolutions, if you don't mind. :)
I want so badly to catch up at work. I keep thinking if I just catch up, I'll be ok. But I haven't been caught up for five years. :(
Hang in there, and try not to make any major decisions until things are a bit back more to normal. It shouldn't be an issue until then anyway, should it?
Posted by zenhussy on December 31, 2006, at 11:31:43
In reply to Re: My T Got Bad News (too long) » zenhussy, posted by mair on December 30, 2006, at 14:34:18
mair mair mair......whoa lady take a breath! that's a lotta life going on around you. it is so good you are checking in and sharing all of this.....goodness that's a whammo of a post. you're putting yourself under a lot of undue pressure, and you know this, so it is only pointed out lovingly and gently.
please continue to know how much you're thought of, prayed for and kept in the hearts of many.
wish there was more this little hussy could do for you. for now prayer, hope and love.
with as much understanding as possible,
--zh
Posted by mair on December 31, 2006, at 14:20:05
In reply to Re: My T just called me » mair, posted by Dinah on December 31, 2006, at 10:52:22
There's a little history here. She was supposed to have her mastectomy right after Thanksgiving. I saw her on the Thursday before that and was supposed to see her again on Tuesday. When I left her office on that Thursday I felt good about things; she seemed upbeat and I felt that maybe with 3 sessions in a row, we were getting back on track. I got home from work Friday night and she had left a message on my answering machine informing me that her surgery had been suddenly moved up to Monday (before T-giving) and that she wouldn't then see me for a few weeks.
This was definitely my lowest period throughout this whole ordeal. I was concerned that her surgery had been moved up because it had suddenly become necessary to operate quickly; I felt so awful about what was happening to her because I assumed that she had just gotten bad news just when she had seemed so positive the day before. And I didn't feel that I could call her over the weekend and certainly not once she had her surgery. I was pretty much of a mess for days and I had no where to go with that worry.
Once we met again, I found out that her surgery was changed simply because the surgeon had a cancellation. It made tons of sense for her to change the date. She was able to reach most of her patients so she could have a conversation with them about why the date was changed. Her whole focus was just letting people know as soon as possible. Unfortunately it never occurred to her that someone (me) might read so much more into her voice mail message. Once she saw things from my perspective, she also could see why I didn't feel I could call her (what if it really was bad news?).
Being a person with a very positive outlook, she of course told me that my worry was a good thing since it proved I wasn't as detached as I usually think I am. But she also felt very bad that she had played such an active role in my heightened anxiety. I'm sure that's why she called me this morning - and it is nice that she had me in mind.
mair
Posted by mair on December 31, 2006, at 14:32:03
In reply to Re: My T Got Bad News (too long) » mair, posted by Dinah on December 31, 2006, at 10:59:07
Dinah - I think you and I need to win the lottery and kiss our jobs a not-so-fond farewell.
Not seeing her anywhere near as often has made me realize how easy it would be for me to simply fade away from therapy. I'm fine without therapy except when I'm not fine (there's some deep scientific analysis for you!). Right now, I don't need 2x or 3x a week therapy in order to function. On balance, I think I'm more stable than I have been for a long time. But I've decided I need 2x a week therapy (minimally) just to maintain the sense of connection to her which makes it possible for me to lean on her during the inevitable dark periods which seem to come and go at will and with rapidity. When I can't see her as much I just withdraw a bit and start telling myself that I really don't need therapy at all.
Posted by mair on December 31, 2006, at 14:34:58
In reply to Re: year end response to T Got Bad News » mair, posted by zenhussy on December 31, 2006, at 11:31:43
zen - your care and concern means a ton to me. Don't ever think otherwise. I know I probably bite off more than I can chew on the resolution stuff, but all of those things seem so important to me and so necessary to fix.
Posted by mair on December 31, 2006, at 14:39:17
In reply to Re: My T just called me » mair, posted by 10derHeart on December 31, 2006, at 10:22:50
I posted a response which got lost in cyberspace.
The way my T has been dealing with her illness, is pretty inspiring. I think she is very strong.
I think the fact that she was thinking about me - enough to call me means alot, more so than anything she said. And I like your perspective about thinking of it as a gift. I'd have never come up with that one on my own. (-;
Thank you
Posted by Daisym on January 3, 2007, at 1:28:49
In reply to Re: My T just called me » 10derHeart, posted by mair on December 31, 2006, at 14:39:17
Thank you for keeping us updated. I was reading your list of resolutions...sounds similiar to mine. I think I'm putting the exercise thing at the top of mine, too many people I know are sick. And since therapy is more limited for you right now, seems like it would be a good stress reducer. Just my two cents.
You sound strong, like you are coping OK. Don't forget you have friends here too. I'm sending you good thoughts and energy.
Hugs,
Daisy
Posted by mair on January 5, 2007, at 22:30:30
In reply to Re: My T just called me » mair, posted by Daisym on January 3, 2007, at 1:28:49
I don't know whether I'm strong so much as I'm not totally vulnerable, or at least I'm a little more stable. Those feelings that I get of being totally overwelmed and on the verge of falling apart come and go, but at least they do go away.
I saw my T today for the first time since she started chemo. I was supposed to see her again next week, but she called a couple of days ago and left me a message that she was going to start back today and that she had some time for me if I wanted it. It was pretty strange - at another time I would have jumped at the opportunity and I would have felt unsettled until I at least returned her call. She left 3 messages for me over the course of 2 days before I got back to her. I wasn't sure what I wanted and didn't feel this sense of immediacy about seeing her. I'm glad I went ahead and took her up on her offer of a session today. She didn't look quite as awful as I thought she might (which was reassuring) and we talked some about how best to use therapy sessions when therapy is so disrupted, and about my tendency to keep things to myself more when I'm not seeing her as frequently. Something has to be pretty uppermost and very very recent for me to open up easily, which is why more frequent sessions are more helpful. She has 7 more chemo sessions to go, and I got clear in my mind, for the first time, just what sort of a schedule might work for the next several months. If all goes well, I think we'll be able to meet 3 times between chemo breaks which provides me some continuity.
The upshot of my new years resolution dilemma was just to hold onto the vague notion of trying to keep all of the resolutions, without really devoting myself to any one of them. Unfortunately, this probably means that nothing will happen. Exercise is the toughest nut to crack although probably the most important. The last time i joined a club, I never went and the dues proved to be the biggest waste of money. Outdoor exercise is tough in the winter because even though this winter has been more like spring, it's still dark when I leave work.
mair
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