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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 22 of 22. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 8:29:17
I want to make sure my T knows how I'm feeling when I see her this Wednesday so I've typed up notes I want her to read. I'm very scared though that this might alarm her enough to send me back to the hospital. Please, I need to know from others if this is too *much* and I need to hold some back. This is what I wrote:
With the 1-year anniversary approaching of my overdose and hospitalization, I’m afraid that it could happen again. The memories haunt me and keep me depressed. It’s awful that I attempted suicide, and I still feel guilty I put my family and friends through that. But it’s scary that I don’t feel any differently about the reasons I did it; I just don’t feel desperate to do it like I did then. Sometimes I’m afraid it’s just a matter of time before I get that desperate again. The only thing that stops me is knowing the pain it would cause my husband and children.
I feel worthless and useless; that my life has no purpose and that it might as well be over. Even when I try hard to be normal, I feel like I’m acting. I know that most people would never know from looking at me that I’m feeling the way I do; I’m very good at covering over my feelings. Even at the hospital, I was very neat and presentable, and didn’t let on to the ones in charge how I was really feeling. I’m tired of putting on the act.
I wish I knew if this was all because of menopause. I might have some hope if I thought this would pass in time. But this has been going on for too long. Just when I think I can get to an okay place, I slip down again. Sometimes I wonder if I’m choosing to be depressed. Could it be that my life is so boring that I’m creating my own melodrama? But this doesn’t ring true because I WANT to laugh and get enjoyment out of doing things, and I WANT to have hope for the future.
Sometimes I want to be invisible. Other times I feel I AM invisible. I make people uncomfortable; I don’t know how to interact with them. I want to feel like I fit in somewhere.
I once trusted life because I believed life would treat me kindly. I don’t trust life anymore. I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop.
I know how good I’ve got it, but knowing that only makes me feel terribly guilty.
Posted by fallsfall on September 12, 2005, at 9:05:52
In reply to Will this land me in the hospital again? *TRIGGER*, posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 8:29:17
Excellent writing.
I don't think that it would make her want to put you back in the hospital. You have the feelings, but no intent to act on them. It is when you start to act on them that things get dangerous.
You are opening up a very important topic.
Best of luck
Posted by muffled on September 12, 2005, at 11:08:25
In reply to Will this land me in the hospital again? *TRIGGER*, posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 8:29:17
Wow, i could have written alot of that. Its well written. Can I copy some of it for my T? I won't unless you say it is ok.They don't usu. put you in the hospital unless they think you are going to harm yourself or others. Thats what my T. said when I asked her about it regarding myself. Keep posting to let us know how it goes. I bet I could learn alot from you if you would write stuff. Things seem to get better with time. Hope all goes ok for you.Thanks. muffled.
Posted by fairywings on September 12, 2005, at 11:22:10
In reply to Re: Will this land me in the hospital again? *TRIGGER* » Sonya, posted by muffled on September 12, 2005, at 11:08:25
i agree with falls and muffled, you have the feelings, and i know you feel horrible, but you aren't threatening to act on them. one thing that struck me though sonya, is that you said you needed just short term therapy to get through the anniversary. i think that there might be things going on that you need to work through that could take some time, and giving yourself all the time you need to work through them is important. sounds like you have so much pain and you said the reasons are still there. it also sounds like you like your T and that you feel safe enough to open things up, which is so important. maybe, because you're feeling so depressed right now, you could talk to your T about a short course of antidepressants, or more frequent therapy, just to work these really tough issues out enough to get you feeling better. don't feel alone, like muffled said, i could have written a lot of that, it WAS very well written and i think your T will appreciate that you had the strength to say it.
let us know how it goes,
fw
Posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 11:30:15
In reply to Re: Will this land me in the hospital again? *TRIGGER*, posted by fairywings on September 12, 2005, at 11:22:10
I'm very surprised and flattered that you all think my notes are well written. I suppose my self esteem is pretty much as low as it can get right now because to me my writing sounds stupid and I was even embarrassed about posting it. So many of you are SO eloquent, I pale in comparison.
Muffled, you're more than welcome to use my words for your therapy. Again, I'm flattered.
Posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 11:46:10
In reply to Re: Will this land me in the hospital again? *TRIGGER*, posted by fairywings on September 12, 2005, at 11:22:10
I did just restart my Depakote and a new rx for Wellbutrin so hopefully that'll help. As far as more long term therapy, I know you're probably right but I've already had quite alot of therapy and these thoughts and feelings don't stay away. I've become resigned to the fact that therapy works for me for specific problems (like this anniversary thing), but I don't know how to navigate therapy for the long haul. Maybe I haven't had the right therapist asking me the right questions...I don't know.
Posted by fallsfall on September 12, 2005, at 12:27:49
In reply to brief vs. long term therapy » fairywings, posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 11:46:10
If you have been doing Cognitive Behavioral Therapy, you might want to try Psychodynamic therapy instead.
In my opinion, CBT helps you to cope with the pain, while Psychodynamic therapy can help stop the pain. For those of us who find that the pain keeps coming back, Psychodynamic therapy can be helpful.
I had 8 1/2 years of CBT. And have had 2 1/2 years of Psychodynamic, and I think that this will help me more in the long term.
Posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 12:37:04
In reply to Re: brief vs. long term therapy, posted by fallsfall on September 12, 2005, at 12:27:49
I've had only CBT. Can you describe what psychodynamic therapy is like...I'm very interested.
> If you have been doing Cognitive Behavioral Therapy, you might want to try Psychodynamic therapy instead.
>
> In my opinion, CBT helps you to cope with the pain, while Psychodynamic therapy can help stop the pain. For those of us who find that the pain keeps coming back, Psychodynamic therapy can be helpful.
>
> I had 8 1/2 years of CBT. And have had 2 1/2 years of Psychodynamic, and I think that this will help me more in the long term.
>
>
Posted by fairywings on September 12, 2005, at 12:42:26
In reply to brief vs. long term therapy » fairywings, posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 11:46:10
I hope the meds kick in and work for you sonya.
as far as therapy, you've proabably read a lot here lately about the right therapist. falls had a good suggestion about the different types. i found cbt good for the "here and now" stuff like my family issues - kids, husband, boredom. Insight oriented therapy good for understanding my issues. and i don't know what kind of therapy it is i'm doing now, but i have very high hopes for this T. i need to work through a lot of pain and anger. i think they need to understand what exactly you want to accomplish in therapy. When i first went in, he asked me what i wanted to accomplish and that's what i told him - i needed to work through the pain and anger. maybe finding the right T, then telling them what you want to work through, then having them ask the right questions, and having the right fit/connection combo is what it takes?
good luck...
fw
Posted by sunny10 on September 12, 2005, at 14:48:33
In reply to Re: brief vs. long term therapy » Sonya, posted by fairywings on September 12, 2005, at 12:42:26
I agree with fw- with one caveat.
For me it's also about working with a T who understand what my issues are better than I do.
Frankly, I don't know WHAT my problem is- why I keep reacting to present situations with past feelings, when I know that is what's happening. I need my T to figure out how to help me STOP doing that...what is the matter with me, anyway? Aren't I smart enough to NOT keep doing that? I know that I am intelligent- but I can't seem to stop.
It's not a matter of time as much as it is substance.
You're worth whatever time you invest in yourself. Don't sell yourself short.
-sunny10
Posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 15:13:22
In reply to Re: brief vs. long term therapy, posted by sunny10 on September 12, 2005, at 14:48:33
>I need my T to figure out how to help me STOP doing that...what is the matter with me, anyway? Aren't I smart enough to NOT keep doing that? I know that I am intelligent- but I can't seem to stop.
THIS IS A VERY GOOD POINT. I know my negativity influences my thoughts, but I can't seem to stop it. I always remember my sister telling me "you don't have to believe everything you think".
Posted by 10derHeart on September 12, 2005, at 15:41:00
In reply to Psychodynamic Therapy » fallsfall, posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 12:37:04
Hi Sonya,
I'm so sorry these thoughts and feelings keep returning. I also think your writing is wonderful. Hmmm, with all these Babblers in agreement, perhaps you were underestimating a talent you have? Possible, right? I know the self-esteem-less-than-zero feeling quite well, too, unfortunately.
Anyway...I really think this UK web page has an excellent defintion of psychodynamic therapy.
http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/simplepsych/204.htmlI know people's *real* experiences are probably more useful, but as I was struggling with how to put that into words for you, I thought of this site I had saved. To tell you the truth, what's written in this link, is just about exactly what my T. does. I do find it sometimes scary and hard, but definitely helpful.
Hope it helps give you some idea. Hang in there.
Posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 16:40:36
In reply to Re: Psychodynamic Therapy » Sonya, posted by 10derHeart on September 12, 2005, at 15:41:00
Thank you for the link, 10derHeart. I'm going to give psychodynamic therapy some consideration. It sounds intense and a little frightening, but it might worth giving it a try.
With all the compliments about my writing, my self esteem notched up a tad.
Posted by fairywings on September 12, 2005, at 16:41:47
In reply to Re: brief vs. long term therapy, posted by sunny10 on September 12, 2005, at 14:48:33
>
> For me it's also about working with a T who understand what my issues are better than I do.
>
> Frankly, I don't know WHAT my problem is-Oooo, that IS a good point sunny! i have no idea what my "real" problems are either! (And i think maybe i'm afraid to know!) but you're right, a good T WILL know, or will how to manuver therapy in the best way for the client anyway. thurs. i am going to ask what kind of therapy we're doing.
fw
Posted by Damos on September 12, 2005, at 17:48:16
In reply to Will this land me in the hospital again? *TRIGGER*, posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 8:29:17
Hi Sonya,
Sorry I'm a bit late on this thread. I just wanted to say 'Thank You' for sharing your letter with us. It was beautiful. It took a lot of courage to write with such honesty. There is power in awareness Sonya and as they say "The truth will set you free." Being able to say how you truly feel and put that truth out into the world is a big thing, and it allows the universe to start bringing you the help you need.
Oh, and I didn't see anything there that would make me thnk you should be hospitalised. I saw a lot to be hopeful about.
Thanks again,
Damos
Posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 18:17:04
In reply to Re: Will this land me in the hospital again? *TRIGGER* » Sonya, posted by Damos on September 12, 2005, at 17:48:16
Damos, I'm touched by your remarks. It is how I truly feel, but to see it in print is more than a little unsettling. It's one thing to think these thoughts, another to write about them. I'm glad I did it and I feel somewhat unburdened already.
I'm so grateful for this forum and to all of you who responded. What an outpouring of support...thank you.
Sonya
>
> Sorry I'm a bit late on this thread. I just wanted to say 'Thank You' for sharing your letter with us. It was beautiful. It took a lot of courage to write with such honesty. There is power in awareness Sonya and as they say "The truth will set you free." Being able to say how you truly feel and put that truth out into the world is a big thing, and it allows the universe to start bringing you the help you need.
>
> Oh, and I didn't see anything there that would make me thnk you should be hospitalised. I saw a lot to be hopeful about.
>
> Thanks again,
> Damos
Posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 18:19:22
In reply to Re: Will this land me in the hospital again? *TRIGGER*, posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 18:17:04
Damos, I'm touched by your remarks. It is how I truly feel, but to see it in print is more than a little unsettling. It's one thing to think these thoughts, another to write about them. I'm glad I did it and I feel somewhat unburdened already.
I'm so grateful for this forum and to all of you who responded. What an outpouring of support...thank you.
Sonya
> >
> > Sorry I'm a bit late on this thread. I just wanted to say 'Thank You' for sharing your letter with us. It was beautiful. It took a lot of courage to write with such honesty. There is power in awareness Sonya and as they say "The truth will set you free." Being able to say how you truly feel and put that truth out into the world is a big thing, and it allows the universe to start bringing you the help you need.
> >
> > Oh, and I didn't see anything there that would make me thnk you should be hospitalised. I saw a lot to be hopeful about.
> >
> > Thanks again,
> > Damos
>
>
Posted by Damos on September 12, 2005, at 21:23:31
In reply to Re: Will this land me in the hospital again? *TRIGGER*, posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 18:17:04
Hey Sonya,
Yep I know what you mean. I've had the occassional spew on Write, and while it does tend to throw me off a bit it also helps to release the internal pressure. You can also then kind of look at it there in black and beige and think 'where did that come from?'. I don't know, for me it helps to unlock it and get it outside of me where I can work with it.
I'm so glad you're finding support here. Babble is a truly amazing place filled with the love and support of so many wonderful people.
Damos
Posted by fallsfall on September 13, 2005, at 6:54:00
In reply to Re: Psychodynamic Therapy » 10derHeart, posted by Sonya on September 12, 2005, at 16:40:36
The article 10derheart mentioned is a pretty good explanation of Psychodynamic Therapy.
One difference I find between CBT and Psychodynamic (is there an abbreviation for this???) is that in Psycho (!?) the therapist works with the transference. A lot of people have impressions of what "transference" is - and usually they aren't good. But I have found that it can be very, very helpful. Transference isn't just falling in love with your therapist (though this *can* be a kind of transference). Transference is when you assume that a current relationship will be like past relationships and you make assumptions about the current relationship. This is a very reasonable thing to do - otherwise we would have to approach each new relationship from ground zero. Instead we can assume that people who look and act like Aunt Jane might actually *be* a bit like Aunt Jane. Most of the time this saves us time. But if Aunt Jane wasn't like most of the rest of the population that resembles her, then we'll make erroneous assumptions.
For instance, my father is very critical (of everybody). He is perfect and always right, and everyone else is a bit stupid and inferior. I was in Psycho therapy with my current therapist for about 6 weeks when I started being very uncomfortable when he would comment on things. Based on the filters of my life, his comments were saying that I had done something wrong (i.e. "and then you said 'no'?" or "why did you do that?" - even now as I try to come up with examples, they feel critical to me!). So I started to get defensive, and we ended up in an intense struggle. He was able to see what I wasn't able to see, and patiently (oh, so patiently) over a number of sessions we talked about how I was hearing his comments and what he meant by his comments. For instance, when he said "Why did you do that?" I heard "You should have done something else" (my father's critical voice), but he meant "What were your reasons for doing that?" - those two interpretations are very different. Because we had built some trust in the previous weeks, I was slowly able to believe that his motivation was different from what I believed (I believed that he was critical). I still have a lot of trouble thinking that people are critical, but because of the experience with my therapist, I can now stop and ask myself if there is another possible interpretation for someone else's comment, and I can actually even ask them about it sometimes to find out what they really mean.
A CBT approach might be to shore up the patient's self esteem so that they realize that the other person has no right to be critical of them - that their opinion is as valid as the other person's.
Transference is very intense - one way you know that there is transference going on is you say to yourself (incredulously) "Why, in the world, am I so upset by this? It doesn't make any sense for this situation to be this painful for me". So Psychodynamic therapy can be intense and painful, but it can also have deep results.
If you have had "a lot of" CBT, but you still seem to have issues, I would recommend Psychodynamic therapy.
Posted by sunny10 on September 13, 2005, at 8:19:46
In reply to Re: Psychodynamic Therapy + Transference » Sonya, posted by fallsfall on September 13, 2005, at 6:54:00
I think you said what I meant soooooo much better, falls!!!
Transerence is a dangerous thing, but the right T makes all the difference!
Thanks!
Posted by Sonya on September 13, 2005, at 8:27:27
In reply to Re: Psychodynamic Therapy + Transference » Sonya, posted by fallsfall on September 13, 2005, at 6:54:00
What a great explanation! I appreciate all the time and thought you put into your response to my question. I particularly liked your description of transference. I don't think I've ever experienced that with a T. I must say I'm still scared by the sounds of P.T. mainly because I am so closed off and a poor communicator. In fact I often find in therapy that the T spends the majority of time talking instead of me. The T I'm now seeing has even admitted she doesn't like gaps in conversation and feels the need to fill them. Today I'm having second thoughts about seeing her tomorrow and giving her my notes...that again it seems pointless. Now I feel stuck between a rock and a hard place; whether to return to her (familiarity) or delve into the unknown with a new T (Psychodynamic therapy). Naturally, being depressed makes decisions like this nearly impossible when what I want to do is nothing at all.
Posted by 10derHeart on September 13, 2005, at 23:02:16
In reply to Re: Psychodynamic Therapy + Transference » Sonya, posted by fallsfall on September 13, 2005, at 6:54:00
This is the end of the thread.
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