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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 14 of 14. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Dinah on September 1, 2003, at 20:35:44
I just read a really silly article by a couple of marriage counselors who do short term therapy. And their whole idea is based on pointing out to couples that what they're doing is not getting them what they want. And I think they do some work into figuring out why they do it anyway.
And I was wondering. Does anyone go into a therapist complaining, say, of not being their ideal weight. And the therapist says "Well, you're eating too much and not exercising enough. If you eat less and exercise more, you'll lose weight. Here's a 1200 calorie diet plan, and a list of activities. And you say your mother also weighed more than she would have liked to weigh? Well, there you go. That'll be $150." And the client goes out and eats less and exercises more?
Why do we keep doing self destructive things? Or more to the point, why is it so hard to stop even if we know they're self destructive. Even if we know how to change. Even if we know why we're doing them.
All of the self destructive things I do fulfill some need. Admittedly I haven't figured out what that need is for some of them, but I'm sure there is one. And until that need is met some other way, I'm pretty sure I'm not going to give them up. Why are some people able to give them up more easily with some not so subtle prompting?
Posted by underthecs on September 1, 2003, at 20:39:46
In reply to Do you ever wonder?, posted by Dinah on September 1, 2003, at 20:35:44
I don't know... I'm definitely NOT one of those people. If you ever figure it out, please let me know!
Posted by Dinah on September 1, 2003, at 20:54:24
In reply to Re: Do you ever wonder? » Dinah, posted by underthecs on September 1, 2003, at 20:39:46
Posted by Dinah on September 1, 2003, at 20:55:24
In reply to Re: Do you ever wonder? » Dinah, posted by underthecs on September 1, 2003, at 20:39:46
Posted by justyourlaugh on September 1, 2003, at 21:19:38
In reply to Re: Do you ever wonder? » Dinah, posted by underthecs on September 1, 2003, at 20:39:46
wow,
an issue that follows...i was told i was never taught to handle "stress"...
i think i rotate self destruction..into many forms..
nothing to do with anyone else...
i feel so selfish..
sorry..i thought i could help..
j
Posted by fallsfall on September 1, 2003, at 21:35:38
In reply to Do you ever wonder?, posted by Dinah on September 1, 2003, at 20:35:44
I think you are exactly correct about the behaviors meeting a need. Maybe the people who can give them up have another way to meet that need, so it isn't a problem.
It was really easy for me to give up cigarettes. I had a great reason: I wanted to get pregnant and give my baby the best chance. The reasons I smoked were: an old boyfriend told me that he could smoke and I couldn't, and my husband smoked. So I had great reasons for stopping and lousy reasons for smoking. It was really easy.
Other people with different reasons can't give up cigarettes at all.
So we have to figure out what needs are being filled, and then come up with another way to fill them. I was trying to do this about my dependency in therapy, and we were making progress, but we didn't get far enough fast enough.
Posted by justyourlaugh on September 1, 2003, at 21:47:04
In reply to Re: Do you ever wonder? » Dinah, posted by fallsfall on September 1, 2003, at 21:35:38
fall,,totally can relate..
but..what about the feelings of self indulgents..that will not effect others..
is it possible to be mentally illl and keep it hidden?
is it possible to be human and be different and keep it from getting one from being labled "mentally ill"
i want to be me..with out the attachment of mentaL?
WILL THAT ever happen?
j
Posted by underthecs on September 1, 2003, at 22:39:41
In reply to And you'll do the same? If you ever figure it out? (nm) » underthecs, posted by Dinah on September 1, 2003, at 20:55:24
of course! but please don't hold your breath! :-)
Posted by underthecs on September 1, 2003, at 22:43:47
In reply to Re: Do you ever wonder? » Dinah, posted by fallsfall on September 1, 2003, at 21:35:38
>I had great reasons for stopping and lousy reasons for smoking. It was really easy.But some people (me) just have addictive personalities. I can't stop doing any of the "bad" things... no matter how much I intellectualize it. I assume that this is true for lots of people. maybe that's why i'm in therapy :-)
Posted by justyourlaugh on September 1, 2003, at 23:00:59
In reply to Re: Do you ever wonder?, posted by underthecs on September 1, 2003, at 22:43:47
under..
i totally understand..
even if we give up the "sins",.,
they will be replaced..slowly at first...suddenly another addiction....
?j
Posted by galkeepinon on September 1, 2003, at 23:35:15
In reply to Do you ever wonder?, posted by Dinah on September 1, 2003, at 20:35:44
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhh Dinah dear-you hit it on the head!!!! Yep-I know what to do aight but I suck when it comes to doing it. There is some unfullfilled need for the reason I don't eat healthy and exercise-like I feel I don't deserve to be healthy or thin. Or is it the media's portrayal of what we *should* all look like?
Or is it Hollywood? Who knows..............
I wonder too why are some people able to give their self-destructive behaviors up more easily with some not so subtle prompting-I have a few friends who are able to do it no problem-maybe self-esteem comes into play? What do you think?> I just read a really silly article by a couple of marriage counselors who do short term therapy. And their whole idea is based on pointing out to couples that what they're doing is not getting them what they want. And I think they do some work into figuring out why they do it anyway.
>
> And I was wondering. Does anyone go into a therapist complaining, say, of not being their ideal weight. And the therapist says "Well, you're eating too much and not exercising enough. If you eat less and exercise more, you'll lose weight. Here's a 1200 calorie diet plan, and a list of activities. And you say your mother also weighed more than she would have liked to weigh? Well, there you go. That'll be $150." And the client goes out and eats less and exercises more?
>
> Why do we keep doing self destructive things? Or more to the point, why is it so hard to stop even if we know they're self destructive. Even if we know how to change. Even if we know why we're doing them.
>
> All of the self destructive things I do fulfill some need. Admittedly I haven't figured out what that need is for some of them, but I'm sure there is one. And until that need is met some other way, I'm pretty sure I'm not going to give them up. Why are some people able to give them up more easily with some not so subtle prompting?
Posted by galkeepinon on September 1, 2003, at 23:37:49
In reply to Re: Do you ever wonder?, posted by underthecs on September 1, 2003, at 22:43:47
Posted by Penny on September 2, 2003, at 7:50:03
In reply to Do you ever wonder?, posted by Dinah on September 1, 2003, at 20:35:44
Ya' know - the weight example reminds me of how it was in the hospital - I guess they were so concerned with everyone being stable, they didn't like to delve too much into the painful stuff, so they focused on things that had a clear-cut way of being fixed - "if you aren't in good shape, here are some exercises to do" or "eat a healthy, balanced diet each day." Even right down to the imposed bed and wake times. Exercise time, socialization time, therapy time, doctor time, medication regimen - as though the structure was just going to fix the problem.
Certainly, if we look at the answers being as easy as "Eat only 1200 calories a day and exercise at least 30 minutes a day and you'll eventually get to a healthy weight" it makes it harder for us to understand why that's so friggin' hard to do. For me - it's not that I don't KNOW how to lose weight, but I just can't seem to.
Another part of it, though - do you ever find yourself doing pretty well and then becoming so stressed or overwhelmed by doing well that you're sent spiraling downhill again? My most recent thing - had lost 35 lbs., was dating a new guy, was finally starting to make some headway into some of my issues - then I started slipping and next thing I knew, I wasn't losing weight anymore because I was eating everything I could get my hands on, I was feeling really bad about myself again, I stopped seeing the guy, and I then ended up in the hospital.
And I, too, recognize that many/all of my self-destructive behaviors are filling some need I have, but just KNOWING that doesn't fix things...
Wish I had the answers. Boy, I'd be rich if I did.
Your marriage counseling example makes me think of Dr. Phil - if it's not working, change it! If ONLY it was that easy...
Simple, yes, but not easy...
P
Posted by allisonf on September 2, 2003, at 20:24:11
In reply to Do you ever wonder?, posted by Dinah on September 1, 2003, at 20:35:44
Maybe I am just making excuses here, but I do think that there is some biological/hormonal componant to why it is tough to beat some of our self destructive behaviors. Some of my vices are staying up too late and eating too many sugars & carbs, and it's so hard for me to give them up in part b/c they must have a positive effect on my depressive tendencies.
This is the end of the thread.
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