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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 5 of 5. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Lamdage22 on July 3, 2020, at 3:23:54
Hey guys,
which antioxidants have no interactions with meds? I am not talking Vitamins or Minerals. More herbs. I am thinking of adding something, because I take a high dose of fish oil and I don't want it to become rancid in my body.
Posted by Mtom on July 12, 2020, at 13:31:27
In reply to Which Antioxidants do not have CYP interactions?, posted by Lamdage22 on July 3, 2020, at 3:23:54
I've had the same question and have done some research. Here's one paper on Curcumin interacting with meds including antidepressants and others:
Pharmacokinetic interactions of curcuminoids with conventional drugs: A review
RoodabehBahramsoltaniabRojaRahimiabMohammad HoseinFarzaeicdPublished in Journal of Ethnopharmacology Volume 209, 14 September 2017.
I've read similar cautions about curcumin in other articles.
Making it complicated, there are a lot of foods with potential for interactions. Grapefruit has been well known for many years, but I've seen articles suggesting a number of other foods including fruits and vegetables may interact (mostly in vivo and some animal studies). Also that CBD Oil could interact as it influences some of the same liver P450 CYP enzymes that meds interact with (I think mostly in vitro studies, and I don't remember ever seeing a dosage at which this might happen).
I've thought about taking some Vitamin E with my Fish Oil, but most single supplements tend to be mega-doses compared to the RDI. And this could be problematic with Vitamin E. Also Vitamin E can also thin blood (as can, hypothetically, large doses of omega-3's).
I have squeezed the contents of a few high dose Vitamin E gel caps into my bottled Omega-3 supplement, goal to help protect again oxidation during storage (although in dark bottle stored in fridge - but I open it daily....).
Here's an article that states Fish Oil can lower levels of Vitamin E - but it refers to a an old 1991 study: https://healthyeating.sfgate.com/fish-oil-deplete-vitamin-e-body-10857.html
I'll try doing more research, and please post if you find something relevant. Thanks!
Posted by Mtom on July 12, 2020, at 14:29:18
In reply to Which Antioxidants do not have CYP interactions?, posted by Lamdage22 on July 3, 2020, at 3:23:54
Doing some research I came across a link to this article from 2015:
https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/0141076815599673 From alga to omega; have we reached peak (fish) oil?And here is a short excerpt (but worth reading the whole article):
Supplementing the diet with purified omega 3 fatty acids can increase lipid peroxidation, as measured by plasma MDA release and lipid peroxide products, and this is not suppressed by vitamin E supplementation.
Promising alternative antioxidants include lipophilic polyphenols such as the secoiridoids and phlorotannins. Unlike many of the hydrophilic polyphenols, the olive compounds have excellent bioavailability.39 This was recognised by an EFSA-approved health claim that that a mere 5 mg/day of secoiridoids was sufficient to protect LDL cholesterol from oxidative damage.
Once olive polyphenols enter the blood they become integrated into the lipoproteins which carry cholesterol and other lipids round the body and protect the lipoproteins including their lipid components from oxidation. At the same time, they target the artery walls where they exert anti-inflammatory effects including the inhibition of the tissue-destructive MMP group of enzymes. This is a powerfully cardio-protective strategy, and when combined with omega 3 highly unsaturated fatty acids, the two sets of actives provide a potent anti-inflammatory, anti-atherogenic and cardio-protective environment.
The olive polyphenols are now regarded as playing a key role in the health-promoting benefits of the Mediterranean diet."On the other hand, if you start searching the literature, you can find papers describing how just about all the good compounds in plants (e.g. various polyphenols etc.) can potentially affect P450 CYP enzymes in different ways (enhance, inhibit, etc).
"Personalized Medicine" taking all things into account is on the (perhaps somewhat distant) horizon. In the meantime, all I can think of is a mixture of experimentation and consistency in eating an anti-inflammatory diet perhaps supplemented with small to moderate doses of supplements. A change in dose of medications might be necessary to offset any CYP effects, and that will be the difficult part as no Docs I've encountered know much (if anything) about these interactions.
I have however read several papers that have speculated that such interactions - herb-supplements-foods-medications may be responsible for some proportion of therapeutic failures....
Posted by Lamdage22 on January 3, 2021, at 1:02:02
In reply to Olives! Re: Which Antioxidants do not have CYP..., posted by Mtom on July 12, 2020, at 14:29:18
Thanks for your posts. I take between two and four tablespoons of Extra Virgin Olive oil to boost my fat consumption. Is it enough to get those compounds? I think fat has a bad reputaion, fats are very healthy. Even some saturated fat. Just trans fats are bad for you.
Posted by Lamdage22 on January 3, 2021, at 1:06:21
In reply to Re: Olives! Re: Which Antioxidants do not have CYP..., posted by Lamdage22 on January 3, 2021, at 1:02:02
The bodybuilders say to consume 0.35 g of fat per Lbs of body weight.
0.8 g per kg. It helps with a lot of things including hormone production. I will add some evening primrose oil to the mix to get that GLA.
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