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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Rita Wilding on February 5, 2013, at 8:18:07
Hi, I have bi-polar and very recently have been diagnosed with ADD, which did not surprise me at all.
Anyway, about 18 years ago, before I was diagnosed bi-polar, I was first put on prozac which made me want to jump out of my skin and lasted for three days. A complete nervous wreak. Then came all the other SSRI's of the day...Zolof, Effexor, Paxil et al which all made me feel jittery and stoned and tired all at the same time.
Wellbutrin actually caused severe hostility and for the only time in my life thoughts of suicide.
Luckily I stumbled onto the MAOI's. Nardil was wonderful but I became very fat and started to nod off at all hours sometimes when driving (too scary.) Parnate was the wonder drug. I happily took it for 4 years but then some new p-doc got all hot and bothered because I had bi-polar and therefore had to go on an anti-psychotic or lithium. All of them caused MAJOR Dysthymic sp? Mania along with TD.
Then I tried Doxepin. The first week was glorious but I rapidly regressed into hostiliy, anger then a full blown panic attack that lasted 3 days. I could not sit still or sleep. I was terror stricken. I was in hell.
After that I found a new doctor and asked for my parnate back. Guess what? No longer worked. I dutifully took my dosage daily for 4 months while I lay in bed and thought how better off I would be if I just feel asleep and didn't wake up.
Found another very good P-doc who diagnosed the ADD which I have always suspected I'd had. The only stimulant I can reasonably handle is concerta. The others made me anxious, paranoid and depressed. The concerta helps but I feel flat, demotivated, and blah. I believe they call this anhedonia.
I can focus on activities like reading or maybe opening the mail but I have absolue ZERO motivation and nothing brings me pleasure. However I at least get out of bed and do some things unlike before.
When I was in my twenties I experimented with cocaine. While all my friends were riding high I felt so anxious I actually couldn't speak. It was horrible. So I tried it again thinking it had to be a one off but no I had the same nasty experience again.
So I am wondering if there may me some problem in my synapses? Being sensitive to drugs could I have overloaded receptors? Can any kind person make a connection as to what is going on in my brain? Lack of dopamine, NE, or serotonin?
Finally has anyone else experience negative reactions to cocaine and stimulants and is there a connection there?
In closing any suggestions as to what I could augment the concerta with as it seems to help a bit. I tolerated remeron many years ago. Would that be okay? I also was fairly good on moclomobide but that is a no go with concerta as would be nardil, my last hope.
Sorry for this long post. It's just my life should be happy and it is basically miserable. Luckily I am retired as working would be difficult. Leaving the house is a really big deal for me. Just no motivation.
Help............lillabelle
Posted by Rita Wilding on February 5, 2013, at 8:22:40
Why do I get negative reactions to stimulants?
Posted by Rita Wilding on February 4, 2013, at 13:43:31
Hi, I have bi-polar and very recently have been diagnosed with ADD, which did not surprise me at all.Anyway, about 18 years ago I was first put on prozac which made me want to jump out of my skin and lasted for three days. A complete nervous wreak. Then came all the other SSRI's of the day...Zolof, Effexor, Paxil et al which all made me feel jittery and stoned and tired all at the same time.
Wellbutrin actually caused severe hostility and for the only time in my life thoughts of suicide.
Luckily I stumbled onto the MAOI's. Nardil was wonderful but I became very fat and started to nod off at all hours sometimes when driving (too scary.) Parnate was the wonder drug. I happily took it for 4 years but then some new p-doc got all hot and bothered because I had bi-polar and therefore had to go on an anti-psychotic or lithium. All of them caused MAJOR Dysthymic sp? Mania along with TD.
Then I tried Doxepin. The first week was glorious but I rapidly regressed into hostiliy, anger then a full blown panic attack that lasted 3 days. I could not sit still or sleep. I was terror stricken. I was in hell.
After that I found a new doctor and asked for my parnate back. Guess what? No longer worded. I dutifully took my dosage daily for 4 months while I lay in bed and thought how better off I would be if I just feel asleep and didn't wake up.
Found another very good P-doc who diagnosed the ADD which I have always suspected I'd had. The only stimulant I can reasonably handle is concerta. The others made me anxious, paranoid and depressed. The concerta helps but I feel flat, demotivated, and blah. I believe they call this anhedonia.
I can focus on activities like reading or maybe opening the mail but I have absolue ZERO motivation and nothing brings me pleasure. However I at least get out of bed and do some things unlike before.
When I was in my twenties I experimented with cocaine. While all my friends were riding high I felt so anxious I actually couldn't speak. It was horrible. So I tried it again thinking it had to be a one off but no I had the same nasty experience again.
So I am wondering if there may me some problem in my synapses? Being sensitive to drugs could I have overloaded receptors? Can any kind person make a connection as to what is going on in my brain? Lack of dopamine, NE, or serotonin?
Finally has anyone else experience negative reactions to cocaine and stimulants and is there a connection there?
In closing any suggestions as to what I could augment the concerta with as it seems to help a bit. I tolerated remeron many years ago. Would that be okay? I also was fairly good on moclomobide but that is a no go with concerta as would be nardil, my last hope.
Sorry for this long post. It's just my life should be happy and it is basically miserable. Luckily I am retired as working would be difficult. Leaving the house is a really big deal for me. Just no motivation.
Help............lillabelle
Posted by Phil on February 5, 2013, at 8:52:53
In reply to Link between anxious reactions to stims + cocaine?, posted by Rita Wilding on February 5, 2013, at 8:18:07
lillabelle..I can't help med wise but some of the smartypants here will.
>>>Wellbutrin actually caused severe hostility and for the only time in my life thoughts of suicide.
>I had that. "Listen Mr Smart phone the green light means go and if you keep doing this I'm going to introduce you to my babeball bat." A few minutes later, HEY *******!!! People can't drive, esp Beamer owners. Those pricks(not all) should be shot.
Are you not on any mood stabilizer? Seroquel has antidepressant properties, Lamictal, Lithium? I take those plus Clonazepam and recently added adderall but when I get Medicare I'm going back to Vyvance(to me the gold standard of stims but not to everyone.)
Coke gave me all the answers in life till I woke up the next day. Then I was stupid again. I think my recreational drug use made things worse in the long run. But for a long period it was a lot of fun. Not jitteriness till I landed in ER.
Posted by Phillipa on February 5, 2013, at 9:48:02
In reply to Re: Link between anxious reactions to stims + cocaine? » Rita Wilding, posted by Phil on February 5, 2013, at 8:52:53
Phil seems quite a few on babble have used recreational drugs. Being of an era just at the beginning of their use I didn't. But I do wonder if somehow it causes or triggers mental illness? Phillipa
Posted by Phil on February 5, 2013, at 14:13:10
In reply to Re: Link between anxious reactions to stims + cocaine? » Phil, posted by Phillipa on February 5, 2013, at 9:48:02
Well the high of having a bunch of coke and the despair of running out sure didn't help anything with me.
It may help trigger mental illness but not cause it.
What I liked about it was getting above, way above, depression. Long term not feasible.
Posted by schleprock on February 5, 2013, at 16:03:44
In reply to Link between xtreme panic to stims + cocaine?, posted by Rita Wilding on February 5, 2013, at 8:22:40
> Why do I get negative reactions to stimulants?
>
> Posted by Rita Wilding on February 4, 2013, at 13:43:31
>
>
> Hi, I have bi-polar and very recently have been diagnosed with ADD, which did not surprise me at all.
>
> Anyway, about 18 years ago I was first put on prozac which made me want to jump out of my skin and lasted for three days. A complete nervous wreak. Then came all the other SSRI's of the day...Zolof, Effexor, Paxil et al which all made me feel jittery and stoned and tired all at the same time.
>
> Wellbutrin actually caused severe hostility and for the only time in my life thoughts of suicide.
>
> Luckily I stumbled onto the MAOI's. Nardil was wonderful but I became very fat and started to nod off at all hours sometimes when driving (too scary.) Parnate was the wonder drug. I happily took it for 4 years but then some new p-doc got all hot and bothered because I had bi-polar and therefore had to go on an anti-psychotic or lithium. All of them caused MAJOR Dysthymic sp? Mania along with TD.
>
> Then I tried Doxepin. The first week was glorious but I rapidly regressed into hostiliy, anger then a full blown panic attack that lasted 3 days. I could not sit still or sleep. I was terror stricken. I was in hell.
>
> After that I found a new doctor and asked for my parnate back. Guess what? No longer worded. I dutifully took my dosage daily for 4 months while I lay in bed and thought how better off I would be if I just feel asleep and didn't wake up.
>
> Found another very good P-doc who diagnosed the ADD which I have always suspected I'd had. The only stimulant I can reasonably handle is concerta. The others made me anxious, paranoid and depressed. The concerta helps but I feel flat, demotivated, and blah. I believe they call this anhedonia.
>
> I can focus on activities like reading or maybe opening the mail but I have absolue ZERO motivation and nothing brings me pleasure. However I at least get out of bed and do some things unlike before.
>
> When I was in my twenties I experimented with cocaine. While all my friends were riding high I felt so anxious I actually couldn't speak. It was horrible. So I tried it again thinking it had to be a one off but no I had the same nasty experience again.
>
> So I am wondering if there may me some problem in my synapses? Being sensitive to drugs could I have overloaded receptors? Can any kind person make a connection as to what is going on in my brain? Lack of dopamine, NE, or serotonin?
>
> Finally has anyone else experience negative reactions to cocaine and stimulants and is there a connection there?
>
> In closing any suggestions as to what I could augment the concerta with as it seems to help a bit. I tolerated remeron many years ago. Would that be okay? I also was fairly good on moclomobide but that is a no go with concerta as would be nardil, my last hope.
>
> Sorry for this long post. It's just my life should be happy and it is basically miserable. Luckily I am retired as working would be difficult. Leaving the house is a really big deal for me. Just no motivation.
>
> Help............lillabelle
>I'm not sure if Dr. Bob would approve of us discussing illegal drugs in this forum. We can however discuss Lithium, which is worse than any illegal drug and ought to be banned outright itself.
Posted by Phil on February 5, 2013, at 17:56:02
In reply to Re: Link between xtreme panic to stims + cocaine? » Rita Wilding, posted by schleprock on February 5, 2013, at 16:03:44
I've talked too much about my drug past but 60-80% of bipolars alone abuse something. A big part of my story is being raised by alcoholics then, in the late 60's, starting my own odyssey. Not proud, not ashamed but it all put me where I am today.
If he objects I'll certainly stop but I think it would be naive to ignore our pasts.Anyway, why so down on Lithium with so many other hideous drugs out there?
Posted by Phil on February 5, 2013, at 19:19:18
In reply to Re: Link between xtreme panic to stims + cocaine? » schleprock, posted by Phil on February 5, 2013, at 17:56:02
OK, sorry I read that you had problems with it.
Posted by baseball55 on February 5, 2013, at 19:41:28
In reply to Re: Link between anxious reactions to stims + cocaine? » Phil, posted by Phillipa on February 5, 2013, at 9:48:02
But I do wonder if somehow it causes or triggers mental illness? Phillipa
Given that almost everybody in the US under 60 has used illegal drugs, I don't see why it would trigger mental illness. I think, if anything, the causality runs the other way. People with mental illness are more likely to end up abusing drugs (rather than just using them occasionally, as most people do). By drugs, I would include alcohol, even though it's legal.
Posted by Phillipa on February 5, 2013, at 21:25:58
In reply to Re: Link between anxious reactions to stims + cocaine?, posted by baseball55 on February 5, 2013, at 19:41:28
I'm over the age. So I'm clean. Some others that post here also are. So they say a lot of the original hippies took so many street drugs they ended up institutionalized. I wonder where they are today since they closed? Phillipa
Posted by ChicagoKat on February 6, 2013, at 17:22:51
In reply to Link between anxious reactions to stims + cocaine?, posted by Rita Wilding on February 5, 2013, at 8:18:07
Hi Lillabelle,
I can't offer too much help b/c I really don't know much at all about treating bipolar disorder. I'm straight up unipolar depressed, with lots of anxiety to go along with it.
I just wanted to tell you a couple things that came to mind when I read your post.
I took Nardil once and it was *wonderful*. But then I had to stop it b/c it made me ataxic and I suffered falls. Later my pdoc and I decided to give it a go, but at a lower dose. Just like you, it didn't help me one bit. The magic was gone.
The other thing I thought you might find very interesting is this. You mentioned having a bad reaction to cocaine when you were young. Well, it turns out that Ritalin (Concerta is just a long-acting form of Ritalin) well Ritalin has the very same mechanism of action as cocaine. It's just different in that it lasts longer, and you don't get the intense high you get with cocaine.
Just fyi, I thought you might find that interesting.
Sorry I can't really help, but I wish you the best of luck!
Kat
Posted by brynb on February 6, 2013, at 20:06:17
In reply to Link between anxious reactions to stims + cocaine?, posted by Rita Wilding on February 5, 2013, at 8:18:07
there's a huge connection with bipolar patients using/abusing coke as a drug of choice. (at least at one point in life.) i did.
like coke, stims work on dopamine, too. can you handle a low therapeutic dose of lexapro? it's the cleanest sri in terms of serotonin, which could help balance things out. also, klonopin would be a good benzo to balance out your stim. it could help counteract any irritability/anxiety and act as a mood stabilizer.
good luck...
-b
Posted by Phillipa on February 6, 2013, at 21:44:31
In reply to Re: Link between anxious reactions to stims + cocaine? » Rita Wilding, posted by brynb on February 6, 2013, at 20:06:17
I could have never handled coke. Always downers. Alchohol only drug of abuse and beer or wine. Phillipa
This is the end of the thread.
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