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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 5 of 5. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Mistermindmasta on June 20, 2007, at 18:27:47
I don't post here often, so for those of you who aren't familiar with me, here's some background. I'm a full time college student and a manager working 50 hrs a week. 26 yrs old. Never been diagnosed with anything for paranoia of having a "label", and simply because i guess I'm fairly functional. 3.5 GPA, etc. Always thought I had ADD... I self medicate with caffeine and caffeine doesn't last a long time and sucks majorly after 200 mg / day. Too much anxiety, which basically gives me inattention more than I had to begin with. The issue is that, while I appear to be functional, I'm barely functional. My 3.5 GPA is from spending all my time on school. I'm a manager cuz I worked my *ss off for 4 years to get there. I struggle. And I suppose life is a struggle, but my daily life is far from efficient. I often can't focus on schoolwork, I'm tired, I don't feeel like being the manager I know I can be and I, in general, am lazy. But it's not that I WANT to be lazy. I desparetely want to be the person I know I can be and get a 4.0 GPA rather than 3.5 and work through my workday feeling like I'm in control. By the way, everyone on my mom's side of the family takes ADHD drugs pretty much. We're all functional, intelligent, space cadets.
So... I began messing around with adderall from a buddy at work cuz he gives them to me. It works awesome!! It gives me confidence, focus, attention, energy, everything that amphetamines do... and the letdown is mild compared to caffeine! Basically, I'm convinced that my life could be better and without ill effects with daily use of amphetamines or whatever. I have little desire to up the dose (abuse) and it's effects are just amazing. But, I have no health insurance, and therefore don't have money to be going to all these doctors and getting a diagnoses and convincing them to put me on speed. Which brings me to ask, first off, how easy would it be to lay out my story for a doc and just get a prescription for speed, basically, just kind of as a trial? Seems like he might think I'm trying to abuse a medicine and want to take a more conservative approach and put me on atomoxetine which in studies just doesnt seem to give the nice energy, concentration and confidence boost that adderall gives. Do you always have to go through extensive tests for ADD before they can give you a med for ADD? Or can I just walk in a suggest a trial?
Well anyway, since I'm not going to a doc anytime soon, I'd rather try the internet route for buying stimulant-esque drugs.
After much research, three drugs come to mind:
1. L-deprenyl
2. Reboxetine
3. WellbutrinNow, to lay out the pros and cons...
L-deprenyl seems to be quite safe at 5mg / day with regard to MAO-A inhibition / blood pressure / cardiovascular effects. It seems to be effective, from the stories I've read for people with my kind of symptoms ... ADD inattentive or atypical depression. It's $50 for 50 pills, that's not terribly pricey. So deprenyl is probably my #1 choice.
Reboxetine has anticholinergic effects. No good. Possibly not as stimulating as L-deprenyl? But nontheless, studies show it to be effective for ADD.
Wellbutrin seems to have more side effects, in general than the other two. I might be wrong, though. Plus it appears to be more expensive over the internet than the other two.
I think I'm gonna go with deprenyl, 5 mg / day. Thoughts? Advice??
Stimulants don't really make me irritable. They seem to be just right for me (except caffeine). That's why I'm so convinced that I should ALWAYS be on something.
Just as an aside... I've messed around with a bunch of supplements, like 5-htp, tyrosine, tryptophan, acetyl l carnitine, kava, st. john's wort, rhodiola, valerian, etc. Pretty much all of them. For add, 5-htp seems to combat some symptoms, like for example it makes me sit still and I can focus for long periods of time on something, but doesnt give me the supreme confidence and energy that adderall gives me. With adderall, I can put my actions where my thoughts are. 5-HTP tends to make me lazy. Tyrosine makes me p*ssed off after a while, maybe cuz it limits tryp uptake into the brain. It's a decent supplement, but doesnt last all day or isnt nearly as strong as adderall. Kava is nice, and so is rhodiola and kratom, but really I'm searching for an effect that is similar in feel to adderall... the increased confidence, focus, energy, etc.
What do you think?
Posted by Quintal on June 20, 2007, at 19:25:31
In reply to Bunch of questions about ADHD drugs, posted by Mistermindmasta on June 20, 2007, at 18:27:47
>Reboxetine has anticholinergic effects. No good. Possibly not as stimulating as L-deprenyl? But nontheless, studies show it to be effective for ADD.
Reboxetine doesn't really have prominent anticholinergic effects, and I certainly didn't experience any when I took it. It can sometimes cause a dry mouth and rapid heart beat though, as can all noradrenergic drugs due to their effects on the sympathomimetic/parasympatholytic system. It certainly increased my focus, motivation & drive. I don't have ADHD and tend to be hyper-focussed and hyper-alert to begin with so this drug didn't suit me at all, but it definitely had an amphetamine-like effect (I've taken speed too and felt much the same way).
Wellbutrin has more of a dopaminergic effect, so might be more pleasurable/reward enhancing, but personally I didn't find much of that when I took it. Reboxetine seems to be cheaper. L-deprenyl was much less stimulating than reboxetine and didn't feel anywhere near as amphetamine-like - more like tyrosine in fact. It made me feel quite raw and irritable, but not 'speedy'.
So my vote is for reboxetine, but that's mostly based on my own experiences and interpretation of the literature. Obviously you'll probably need to do a bit of experimentation to find what works best for you. Good luck!
Q
Posted by Mistermindmasta on June 20, 2007, at 19:38:42
In reply to Re: Bunch of questions about ADHD drugs » Mistermindmasta, posted by Quintal on June 20, 2007, at 19:25:31
Great! Thanks for your experiences. Indeed it will motivate me to do more research into reboxetine. Much appreciated.
> >Reboxetine has anticholinergic effects. No good. Possibly not as stimulating as L-deprenyl? But nontheless, studies show it to be effective for ADD.
>
> Reboxetine doesn't really have prominent anticholinergic effects, and I certainly didn't experience any when I took it. It can sometimes cause a dry mouth and rapid heart beat though, as can all noradrenergic drugs due to their effects on the sympathomimetic/parasympatholytic system. It certainly increased my focus, motivation & drive. I don't have ADHD and tend to be hyper-focussed and hyper-alert to begin with so this drug didn't suit me at all, but it definitely had an amphetamine-like effect (I've taken speed too and felt much the same way).
>
> Wellbutrin has more of a dopaminergic effect, so might be more pleasurable/reward enhancing, but personally I didn't find much of that when I took it. Reboxetine seems to be cheaper. L-deprenyl was much less stimulating than reboxetine and didn't feel anywhere near as amphetamine-like - more like tyrosine in fact. It made me feel quite raw and irritable, but not 'speedy'.
>
> So my vote is for reboxetine, but that's mostly based on my own experiences and interpretation of the literature. Obviously you'll probably need to do a bit of experimentation to find what works best for you. Good luck!
>
> Q
Posted by med_empowered on June 21, 2007, at 15:43:53
In reply to Re: Bunch of questions about ADHD drugs, posted by Mistermindmasta on June 20, 2007, at 19:38:42
if you think you have ADHD and you've had symptoms that go back to childhood, you may want to ocnsider visiting a doc (I think even family docs are doing adult ADHD testing/treatment these days) and look into your options. If you're in the US, you'd be looking at Straterra, the Ritalin family, dexedrine, or Adderall, although wellbutrin and high-dose effexor are sometimes used also. Usually, the stimulants are better tolerated and have fewer weird side effects than the ADs, so personally I'd just go to a doc if I were you.
If these symptoms haven't been around since childhood--I don't know what the cut-off is, you might want to check a website about ADHD--then you might be dealing with cognitive symptoms of depression or...any number of things. In that instance, antidepressants might be a better call (although I imagine stims could still help).Good luck.
Posted by Racer on June 22, 2007, at 12:52:26
In reply to Re: Bunch of questions about ADHD drugs, posted by med_empowered on June 21, 2007, at 15:43:53
When I read the start of the original post, my first thought was, "A GP would probably be willing to prescribe Ritalin..." My own favorite of the psychostims is methylphenidate, so it makes sense to me to check into that first...
This is the end of the thread.
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