![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by fires on August 29, 2005, at 21:54:31
When my neurologist first suggested the dx of BP - hypomania, I told him that I felt like I was having "problems with adrenaline" (too much). He said that BP can feel like that.
I've recently experienced the following:
• mild hypomania starting right after I get out of bed. None while I'm still in bed. (maybe the same as immediately below?)
• mild hypomania triggered by physical activity. I don't feel hypomanic at all, until I begin mild to moderate physical activity. Then it subsides when I stop the activity.
• I've had mild hypomania triggered by watching something exciting on TV. I can tolerate the hypomania when the "adrenaline flows", but I end up mild to moderately depressed and/or exhausted later.
• I've noticed that I don't have too many problems with racing thoughts, but I have a problem with my mind singing songs -- no kidding. I don't hear songs -- this is like singing a song to oneself (silently). The problem is that the songs can last a very long time and one song tends to get repeated over and over. It's something like having tinnitus. It's extremely annoying, even if I like the song. Sometimes I can change the song, by consciously "singing" a different one. They often persist while I'm reading. The only time they seem to stop (when they are present) is when I'm talking.The song (usually only a small portion of a song)is often one that I just heard on TV or elsewhere, or something I heard several hours ago. The songs can suddenly leave, as quickly as they appeared.
Has anyone with hypomania experienced anything like what I've just described? (I haven't seen my neuro.,pdoc, or GP since the above became so obvious. There's no way that I'll mention any of the above to my cardio. or gastroent.)
Thanks
Posted by gardenergirl on August 29, 2005, at 23:59:34
In reply to Hypomania???, posted by fires on August 29, 2005, at 21:54:31
Hi fires,
I do not have hypomania (well, unless I happen to have taken Biaxin XL!), but I do get that singing in my head. It's kind of annoying at times when it reaches earworm level. I usually try to get rid of it by singing the song aloud or (evil grin) passing the "earworm" on to my dear friend, Racer.What you describe about your adrenaline increase feelings kind of reminds me of how I feel when I get overstimulated. I'm highly sensitive to all kinds of stimuli, and when there's too much in my environment: noise, restrictive clothing, busy visual images, smells, temperature changes, etc., I tend to feel a bit hyped up. My natural reaction is to want to reduce my exposure to stimuli as soon as I can. Sometimes I am just desparate to take off my shoes and socks or my watch, etc. Or just yell out, "Will everybody please shut up for five minutes?!?" when it's chaotic around me. Or feels chaotic.
I also react with adrenaline surges when watching scary movies or dramas with a lot of tension. If the rest of the environment is not too stimulating, it's usually okay, but I generally avoid scary or violent movies.
Could you just be highly sensitive, too? If you decrease stimulation do your symptoms recede?
gg
Posted by linkadge on August 30, 2005, at 7:03:54
In reply to Re: Hypomania??? » fires, posted by gardenergirl on August 29, 2005, at 23:59:34
Some antidepressants worked for my depression but not my anxiety, as a result, when put under when under extreme stress, I would have all the physical symptoms of anxiety (mind racing, adrenaline rushes, activation, etc) but my mood would not be depresessed so the "state" would never click in to me as anxiety.
I don't beleive I was ever hypomanic, but rather in a state that was the product of a high anxiety situation, and inappropriate meds.
Linkadge
Posted by fires on August 30, 2005, at 11:19:17
In reply to Re: Hypomania???, posted by linkadge on August 30, 2005, at 7:03:54
> Some antidepressants worked for my depression but not my anxiety, as a result, when put under when under extreme stress, I would have all the physical symptoms of anxiety (mind racing, adrenaline rushes, activation, etc) but my mood would not be depresessed so the "state" would never click in to me as anxiety.
>
> I don't beleive I was ever hypomanic, but rather in a state that was the product of a high anxiety situation, and inappropriate meds.
>
> LinkadgeI had been dxed with dep. and anxiety, but I recently had a consult with another pdoc, and he ruled out anxiety and ruled in hypomania (BP NOS). My neurologist also leaned heavily towards hypomania.
I guess I'll just have to see how Lamictal works out. When on Effexor, I had some clear cut hypomanic episodes.
Thanks
Posted by fires on August 30, 2005, at 11:30:21
In reply to Re: Hypomania??? » fires, posted by gardenergirl on August 29, 2005, at 23:59:34
> Hi fires,
> I do not have hypomania (well, unless I happen to have taken Biaxin XL!), but I do get that singing in my head. It's kind of annoying at times when it reaches earworm level. I usually try to get rid of it by singing the song aloud or (evil grin) passing the "earworm" on to my dear friend, Racer.
>The term earworm rings a bell I'm going to have to google it.
> What you describe about your adrenaline increase feelings kind of reminds me of how I feel when I get overstimulated. I'm highly sensitive to all kinds of stimuli, and when there's too much in my environment: noise, restrictive clothing, busy visual images, smells, temperature changes, etc., I tend to feel a bit hyped up. My natural reaction is to want to reduce my exposure to stimuli as soon as I can. Sometimes I am just desparate to take off my shoes and socks or my watch, etc. Or just yell out, "Will everybody please shut up for five minutes?!?" when it's chaotic around me. Or feels chaotic.
>
> I also react with adrenaline surges when watching scary movies or dramas with a lot of tension. If the rest of the environment is not too stimulating, it's usually okay, but I generally avoid scary or violent movies.
>
> Could you just be highly sensitive, too? If you decrease stimulation do your symptoms recede?
>I appear to be overly sensitive to adrenaline, yet when I don't have enough "stimulation", I sometimes find that my daydreams are about emergencies and other adrenaline producing events.
It's like I have to have adrenaline, one way or another.
Thanks
> gg
Posted by Racer on August 30, 2005, at 12:57:09
In reply to Re: Hypomania??? » gardenergirl, posted by fires on August 30, 2005, at 11:30:21
She really does call and pass them on to me...
I can forgive her for almost anything, but "Seasons in the Sun" was stretching the bounds of friendship...
Honestly, fires, it doesn't sound like hypomania to me -- it sounds like anxiety spectrum. I associate hypomania with things like thinking, "Today I will cook six gourmet dishes, do all the laundry, all the ironing, design a new sweater, AND recover that shabby sofa cushion..." You know, kinda over-ambitious, but believing that the energy you feel really can allow you to do all those things in one day. Not so much just having energy.
For what it's worth, I went through a couple of periods when I was examined for mania or hypomania. The first time I was ever put on anti-depressants, the results were so unexpected and extreme that the doctor went through everything she could think of to see if I was BP rather than unipolar. After extensive questioning, her conclusion was that my depression had been masking a high-energy, cheerful, kinda silly personality. Over the years, a couple of other doctors have had a similar reaction to the non-depressed me, and have also tried to find clear-cut signs of bipolar -- and all have come to the same conclusion. I'm unipolar, but I have a very bubbly personality with a lot of energy that sometimes looks like some level of mania if you're not expecting it. And they don't expect it when they see me in my depressed state.
Twenty some years into all this, I was diagnosed with an anxiety disorder -- AD-NOS -- which explained a lot to me about my symptoms. Including a fair amount of the energy that can look kinda manic.
Anyway, while I understand that a new doctor has changed your dx, it still sounds more anxiety spectrum to me. Remember, the doctors don't have a magic device for figuring out dx. They just have to use their judgement, which is always fallible. What do you think? Are you manic? Or are you just someone who lives off a lot of anxiety? (One way to check might be to try a low dose of beta blocker for a while, see if lowering the adrenaline might reduce the "hypomania" for you.)
Oh, yeah, and I've discussed "earworms" with Dr CattleProd. He says he gets them, too, so I don't think they're pathological...
Posted by fires on August 30, 2005, at 14:51:43
In reply to GG's right about earworms..., posted by Racer on August 30, 2005, at 12:57:09
> She really does call and pass them on to me...
>
> I can forgive her for almost anything, but "Seasons in the Sun" was stretching the bounds of friendship...
>
> Honestly, fires, it doesn't sound like hypomania to me -- it sounds like anxiety spectrum. I associate hypomania with things like thinking, "Today I will cook six gourmet dishes, do all the laundry, all the ironing, design a new sweater, AND recover that shabby sofa cushion..." You know, kinda over-ambitious, but believing that the energy you feel really can allow you to do all those things in one day. Not so much just having energy.
>
> For what it's worth, I went through a couple of periods when I was examined for mania or hypomania. The first time I was ever put on anti-depressants, the results were so unexpected and extreme that the doctor went through everything she could think of to see if I was BP rather than unipolar. After extensive questioning, her conclusion was that my depression had been masking a high-energy, cheerful, kinda silly personality. Over the years, a couple of other doctors have had a similar reaction to the non-depressed me, and have also tried to find clear-cut signs of bipolar -- and all have come to the same conclusion. I'm unipolar, but I have a very bubbly personality with a lot of energy that sometimes looks like some level of mania if you're not expecting it. And they don't expect it when they see me in my depressed state.
>
> Twenty some years into all this, I was diagnosed with an anxiety disorder -- AD-NOS -- which explained a lot to me about my symptoms. Including a fair amount of the energy that can look kinda manic.
>
> Anyway, while I understand that a new doctor has changed your dx, it still sounds more anxiety spectrum to me. Remember, the doctors don't have a magic device for figuring out dx. They just have to use their judgement, which is always fallible. What do you think? Are you manic? Or are you just someone who lives off a lot of anxiety? (One way to check might be to try a low dose of beta blocker for a while, see if lowering the adrenaline might reduce the "hypomania" for you.)
>
> Oh, yeah, and I've discussed "earworms" with Dr CattleProd. He says he gets them, too, so I don't think they're pathological...
Here's what made the pdoc dx hypomania:Talking way too much and too fast. Being "hyperpsychomotor" -- literally bumping into wall corners. Being "driven" to do things. Thinking of 2 inventions while in bed one morning (they turned out to be impractical, but I didn't exactly realize it at the time).
Irritabilty. The fact that 3 mg of clonazepam didn't begin to take care of my "anxiety". Bad reactions to SSRIs and Cymbalta. Also, when I was acutely depressed, I was extremely anxious (who wouldn't be?) -- and it was very different from what appears to be hypomania.
I seem to be somewhat better on 100 mg of Lamictal added on to 300 mg of Wellbutrin.
Earworms: Maybe if I were in a better mood they wouldn't be so problematic. Yet I don't seem to get them when I'm in a better mood.
I already take atenolol, 25 mg x 2 /day for a neurocardiac problem.
Thanks
Posted by linkadge on August 30, 2005, at 14:57:39
In reply to Re: Hypomania??? » linkadge, posted by fires on August 30, 2005, at 11:19:17
How much effexor are/were you taking?
Give the lamictal a fair trial.If it doesn't help you might try oral magnesium in the magnitude of 100-400mg about 1/2 hour before the effexor dosing.
Linkadge
Posted by linkadge on August 30, 2005, at 15:01:51
In reply to Re: Hypomania??? » gardenergirl, posted by fires on August 30, 2005, at 11:30:21
Normally I have those surges of adrenaline, but when I was taking effexor it seemed like the surges were greatly intensified. (the heart would speed up much more, sweating, alertness etc)
The reason I recomend mangesium is because (as Larry pointed out) it can directly lower excess adrenaline.
Linkadge
Posted by linkadge on August 30, 2005, at 15:10:50
In reply to GG's right about earworms..., posted by Racer on August 30, 2005, at 12:57:09
Thats exactly what I was about to recomend was a beta blocker. I took atenolol and magnesium while on effexor which seemed to normalize a lot of things.
Have you been on an SSRi fires ? Did it ever do similar things? Effexor can be a jagged little one.
Linkadge
Posted by linkadge on August 30, 2005, at 15:13:39
In reply to Re: GG's right about earworms... » Racer, posted by linkadge on August 30, 2005, at 15:10:50
Nevermind the beta blocker, I missed the post where you said you alread were taking it.
Linkadge
Posted by fires on August 30, 2005, at 16:32:19
In reply to Re: GG's right about earworms... » Racer, posted by linkadge on August 30, 2005, at 15:10:50
I've taken 500 mg of Mag in the morning for several years, but some say it's worthless because it's magnesium oxide.
I've been told to use a chelated Mg, but I'm not convinced it's any different, except much more expensive.
I was on 225 mg Effexor when I first felt hypomanic, but it persisted even at 75 mg.
SSRIs didn't trigger hypomania, but I was on them (Paxil, Lexapro, and Sert.) for only a brief time.
Posted by linkadge on August 30, 2005, at 16:58:06
In reply to Re: GG's right about earworms... » linkadge, posted by fires on August 30, 2005, at 16:32:19
You can certainly give the lamictal a try.
I just know that effexor did a lot of strange things to me that other AD's did not. For one, it made me very irritable, which is very strange for me, as I almost never get angry at things. It also never gave my mind a rest. It was kind of like part of my mind was *always* on, always thinking about something scarry. It was like there was an evil beast inside of me. It showed me parts of myself that I'd rather never see again.It ended when I changed to zoloft.
Some people have nothing but good to say about it, but in hindsight it made me feel very much out of controll.
Linkadge
Posted by Phillipa on August 30, 2005, at 20:09:36
In reply to Re: GG's right about earworms..., posted by linkadge on August 30, 2005, at 16:58:06
Music in your mind? Singing? I've just always thought it was kind of like a mantra. If this is bipolar than I have it. But I tend to agree it sounds like anxiety with some OCD. Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by Racer on August 31, 2005, at 0:25:41
In reply to Re: GG's right about earworms... » Racer, posted by fires on August 30, 2005, at 14:51:43
> > She really does call and pass them on to me...
> >
> > I can forgive her for almost anything, but "Seasons in the Sun" was stretching the bounds of friendship...
> >
> >
> Earworms: Maybe if I were in a better mood they wouldn't be so problematic. Yet I don't seem to get them when I'm in a better mood.
>Count yourself lucky -- not only do I get songs and jingles stuck in my head, on endless loop, but poetry, too. Often it's OK, since it's something I like and know by heart, but it gets horribly frustrating when it's part of one poem imperfectly remembered, often morphing into another before I realize that I have forgotten...
{shrug} Then again, it beats hell out of "Billy Don't Be A Hero" or "The Night The Lights Went Out In Georgia..."
Posted by fires on August 31, 2005, at 12:11:53
In reply to Re: GG's right about earworms... » fires, posted by Racer on August 31, 2005, at 0:25:41
> Count yourself lucky -- not only do I get songs and jingles stuck in my head, on endless loop, but poetry, too. Often it's OK, since it's something I like and know by heart, but it gets horribly frustrating when it's part of one poem imperfectly remembered, often morphing into another before I realize that I have forgotten...
>
> {shrug} Then again, it beats hell out of "Billy Don't Be A Hero" or "The Night The Lights Went Out In Georgia..."Anything would beat the 2 songs you mention -- right? Some of the Target ad songs are kind of nice and catchy when they aren't repeating.
I read of one woman with a post viral syndrome who complained of phrases from news reports and TV ads repeating, in addition to songs.
I don't recall hearing of poetry before. Do the poems diminish or stop when you are reading?
Interesting, but probably not related to our problem:
My former MD (I've mentioned his book here several times: "Tuning the Brain")wrote about a patient who spoke in rhymes. I can't imagine how the brain could do that, unless she spoke very slowly.
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.