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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 7 to 31 of 31. Go back in thread:
Posted by ed_uk on May 31, 2005, at 13:41:33
In reply to Re: Klonopin, posted by lushkins on May 31, 2005, at 4:13:58
Hi,
Ambien is available as a generic in the UK: zolpidem. The brand name is Stilnoct.
Zopiclone (Zimovane) is used more commonly than zolpidem (Stilnoct) in the UK. Rivotril isn't often used for sleep here. Temazepam and nitrazepam are the most commonly used benzodiazepine night sedatives.
Kind regards,
Ed.
Posted by lushkins on May 31, 2005, at 14:55:10
In reply to Re: Klonopin » lushkins, posted by ed_uk on May 31, 2005, at 13:41:33
Thanks for the info, I think I will just take it for a few nights, so one night on one night off sort of thing, until my exams are over. By which time I will hopefully be adjusted to the new remeron(zispen) dose so that the insomnia is more managable. I hope this insomnia is not the first signs of the depression hitting back. I have been quite happy today, although a bit irritable which is understandable with the lack of sleep. I will report back in the morning, hopefully feeling somewhat refreshed.
Lushkins
Posted by ed_uk on May 31, 2005, at 15:43:59
In reply to Re: Klonopin, posted by lushkins on May 31, 2005, at 14:55:10
Sleep well Lushkins!
/Ed
Posted by SLS on May 31, 2005, at 16:25:23
In reply to Re: Klonopin, posted by med_empowered on May 31, 2005, at 4:02:45
Regarding Halcion, when used for sleep only, it almost doesn't have a chance to induce a physiological dependency as one goes through a sort of withdrawal each day when it leaves the system. Sort of.
I think it is a reasonable course of action to take a benzodiazepine in this circumstance. I'm not sure I like the idea of using Klonopin, though. It hangs around too long and might compromise cognitive acuity. I think Ativan or Restoril might be better choices as they are intermediate with regard to half-life.
I think Ed_UK is a better source than I am of information as to the plethora of benzos available and what each is best suited for treating.
- Scott
Posted by Phillipa on May 31, 2005, at 17:46:15
In reply to Re: Klonopin, posted by SLS on May 31, 2005, at 16:25:23
Ed, didn't you once say lunesta has been in Europe for a long time marketed under a different name. That might be a choice. Fondly, PJ O
Posted by sleepygirl on May 31, 2005, at 22:08:06
In reply to Klonopin, posted by lushkins on May 31, 2005, at 3:05:34
Careful, careful, I take it daily and will start to feel the withdrawal the next day after I skip an evening dose, the agitation, restlessness, sucks. Good luck.
Posted by sleepygirl on June 1, 2005, at 0:17:20
In reply to Re: Klonopin, posted by sleepygirl on May 31, 2005, at 22:08:06
I do, however, take it long term, so at this point my body is very used to it, dare I say dependent? I am also wondering why your doc chose a benzo with a long half life for your insomnia, there's others that are out of your body quicker, do their job, get you to sleep, and then get out. Regardless, I hope it works well for you, take care.
Posted by ed_uk on June 1, 2005, at 3:36:09
In reply to Re: Klonopin, posted by Phillipa on May 31, 2005, at 17:46:15
Hi PJ,
>Ed, didn't you once say lunesta has been in Europe for a long time marketed under a different name.
We've got zopiclone- which is similar to Lunesta.
Ed xxx
Posted by lushkins on June 1, 2005, at 6:45:38
In reply to Re: Klonopin » Phillipa, posted by ed_uk on June 1, 2005, at 3:36:09
Well despite the klonopin I didn't sleep well, maybe 4 hrs didn't really feel any sedative effects until the morning and now I feel more depressed than before. I am not taking this again when taking with my Dr yesterday he also talked about temazepam, I said I wanted something to knock me out (along those lines so he gave me klonopin (provitril or wehatever it is). Is it usual to feel more depressed after just one day on this. It could of course be the decrease in remeron kicking in which I am more afraid off. I really want to get off that stuff as it does more harm to me than good. I thought/hoped that the higher dose of lamictal that I am now on compared to the last time I tried to come of the remeron would of kept my head above water so to speak. But I am not the klonopin tonight I just feel so miserable and I remember last night being able to laugh at things on the TV and when watching a film I was really into it now I feel miserable/nothing. I am not really liking this I also feel dumb.
Lushkins
Posted by lushkins on June 1, 2005, at 7:13:39
In reply to Re: Klonopin, posted by lushkins on June 1, 2005, at 6:45:38
Does anyone else get depressed after taking klonopin or any other Benzo for that matter? It does feel strangly like the hangover that I have after binge drinking but without the anxiety that comes with the after effect of drink. I really hope this is not the decrease in the remeron, it took me ages to recover from that last time. I always seem to mess with my meds around exam times, but it is the only time I have felt ready to do so, as I have been OK for a month or so. Stuipid me!!1
Posted by Phillipa on June 1, 2005, at 16:34:20
In reply to Re: Klonopin, posted by lushkins on June 1, 2005, at 7:13:39
Yes, I thought klonopin made me feel stupid and dulled my senses. I used to feel a calm come over me from valium, ativan, xanax but no more. Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by sleepygirl on June 1, 2005, at 19:21:10
In reply to Re: Klonopin, posted by lushkins on June 1, 2005, at 7:13:39
My doc seems to think that klonopin has at times caused the reappearance of my depressive symptoms, so I guess, yes.
Posted by 4WD on June 2, 2005, at 22:21:26
In reply to Re: Klonopin, posted by lushkins on June 1, 2005, at 6:45:38
> Well despite the klonopin I didn't sleep well, maybe 4 hrs didn't really feel any sedative effects until the morning and now I feel more depressed than before. I am not taking this again when taking with my Dr yesterday he also talked about temazepam, I said I wanted something to knock me out (along those lines so he gave me klonopin (provitril or wehatever it is). Is it usual to feel more depressed after just one day on this. It could of course be the decrease in remeron kicking in which I am more afraid off. I really want to get off that stuff as it does more harm to me than good. I thought/hoped that the higher dose of lamictal that I am now on compared to the last time I tried to come of the remeron would of kept my head above water so to speak. But I am not the klonopin tonight I just feel so miserable and I remember last night being able to laugh at things on the TV and when watching a film I was really into it now I feel miserable/nothing. I am not really liking this I also feel dumb.
>
> LushkinsHi. Klonopin does indeed make me feel depressed. Kind of bland and flat and dull and apathetic. I think it depends a lot on dosage. It also depends on how scared I am when I take it. If I'm really terrified it seems to go to the anxiety and not make me depressed. If I'm just anxious and nervous, it makes me blue instead. It really doesn't work very well for sleep for me - but that's not what I take it for.
Posted by darkhorse on June 3, 2005, at 8:34:05
In reply to Re: Klonopin » lushkins, posted by 4WD on June 2, 2005, at 22:21:26
Hi,
>
> Hi. Klonopin does indeed make me feel depressed. Kind of bland and flat and dull and apathetic. >Same here,except that I tried it in different doses (0.5/1/1.5/2) and all had the same effect.
Darkhorse.
Posted by Mr.Scott on June 3, 2005, at 20:47:10
In reply to Re: Klonopin, posted by darkhorse on June 3, 2005, at 8:34:05
Have you found a benzo that does not cause/worsen depression? If so...I must know at once my friend!
Scott
Posted by darkhorse on June 6, 2005, at 3:42:43
In reply to Re: Klonopin » darkhorse, posted by Mr.Scott on June 3, 2005, at 20:47:10
> Have you found a benzo that does not cause/worsen depression? If so...I must know at once my friend!
>
> ScottHello Scott,
Nearly all BZ gave depressive syndroms while withdawing from long term- use,but I keep telling myself that it is a side effect and will end.
Clonazepam is the only BZ that produces depression while I'm on it.Tranxene also but to a milder degree.
If I take large doses of diazepam or prazepam I get depressed because of the heavy sedation and the accumelatrion of the drug in the body.
The least depressive ones for me which never gave depressive symptoms are bromazepam,lorazepam,bentazepam,chlordiazepoxide.
All the best!
Darkhorse.
Posted by lushkins on June 6, 2005, at 6:40:51
In reply to Re: Klonopin » Mr.Scott, posted by darkhorse on June 6, 2005, at 3:42:43
hI,
I have since been on a stag weekend, and I have spent over 200 quid on drink, and I feel CRAP. I still can't sleep despite consiumiong lots and losts of alchol, I am NOT really super depressed at the moment, but I am sure that will come big time, I can not focuss. I know I shouldn't of gone but it was my best Mate getting married and it would off been wrong not to of. I have my exam on Tuesday and cannot focuss at all to read and spell. Its not just my life I am messing up but my Mums as well who has supported me through thick and thin, which I am starting to hate myself because of it. Sucks really
Posted by honey on June 6, 2005, at 20:00:54
In reply to Re: Klonopin, posted by lushkins on June 6, 2005, at 6:40:51
(hi everyone, i'm new)
Lushkins, did you try ambien/zolpidem yet? I tried klonopin/clonazepam for to help with sleep, and although I know it helps a lot, for me it did nothing: I'm also on benzos for anxiety disorder, and have just (slowly) quit clonazepam and gone back to valium/diazepam. But none of the benzos send me to sleep.
Zolpidem on the other hand worked very well for me when I was going through insomnia: even 5mg just knocked me out. I'm in the UK too, and although doctors will warn you not to take it for long, to be honest I'm surprised they aren't prescribing it first - they're even more paranoid about benzos usually.
If you do take zolpidem for long, you *will* have trouble sleeping 1 or 2 nights after you quit, but if your general insomnia's cleared, it should be ok after that. At least, that was true for me.
My problem now isn't getting to sleep - it's sleep quality, which is appalling: vivid dreams, not deep/delta/stage 4 sleep, and exhaustion all day. But then I have had ME/CFS for 12 years and am in an acute phase. But ambien/zolpidem fixed the *getting to sleep* problem for me, with no detectable side-effects. Be warned it might only last 4 hours or so though.
Very useful to hear some experienced depression on klonopin - I didn't know this, and have been pretty black while taking it!
Posted by ed_uk on June 6, 2005, at 20:19:48
In reply to Re: Klonopin, posted by honey on June 6, 2005, at 20:00:54
Hi Honey,
Have you tried zopiclone (Zimovane)? It might keep you asleep for longer than zolpidem.
Ed.
Posted by Mr.Scott on June 6, 2005, at 22:44:11
In reply to Re: Klonopin » Mr.Scott, posted by darkhorse on June 6, 2005, at 3:42:43
Thanks!
That makes Lorazepam the most likely one I'll try next, as my doc mentioned it as well. What do you think is the equivalent of .75mg clonazepam? Probably about 1.5mg?
Did you notice any additional memory impairment from the lorazepam over the other benzos? Or likewise any interdose anxiety?
I certainly appreciate your sharing about this.
Scott
Posted by Phillipa on June 6, 2005, at 22:50:03
In reply to Re: Klonopin » darkhorse, posted by Mr.Scott on June 6, 2005, at 22:44:11
When I took ativan I liked it. I felt very relaxed. I went from ,5 to lmg 4-5 times a day. The upping of it was because my TSH was up so they upped my synthroid which made me more nervous. They said I would probably need more. Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by darkhorse on June 7, 2005, at 3:54:00
In reply to Re: Klonopin » darkhorse, posted by Mr.Scott on June 6, 2005, at 22:44:11
I think 1mg Lorazepam roughly equals 0.5mg Clonazepam for me.But some others feel 1mg Lorazepam = 0.25mg Clonazepam.
>
> Did you notice any additional memory impairment from the lorazepam over the other benzos? Or likewise any interdose anxiety?After stopping lorazepam, I tend to forget more what happened than the other BZ, but that is very marginal and not a big deal.
Unlike Xanax, When I take lorazepam 1-2mg every 12 hours (twice a day)I have a stable anti-anxiety effect all day with very good sleep and no interdose anxiety.
To me Ativan is a very potent anxiety killer,without euphoria,and ,paradoxicaly, makes me concentrate on what I do very good,but on the expense of not being bothered with social interaction.
Best of luck!
Darkhorse.
>
> I certainly appreciate your sharing about this.
>
> Scott
>
>
Posted by honey on June 7, 2005, at 6:35:51
In reply to Re: Klonopin » honey, posted by ed_uk on June 6, 2005, at 20:19:48
> Have you tried zopiclone (Zimovane)? It might keep you asleep for longer than zolpidem.
>
> Ed.Two docs told me they were basically the same drug with same lifetime, although I admit I didn't check this. I did take it years ago, yes, but don't remember the effect...
I was told that the only really long lasting one was the dreaded benzo nitrazepam, or mogadon, and asked for some in liquid form so I could try very sdmal doses - I'm v sensitive to meds with M.E. Yet to dare give it a go, because I suspect awful hangover effects.
My problem's not getting to sleep at all, it's getting anything other than wild, wakey, dreamy/nightmares all night and half-waking approx. every 15 mins - no deep sleep. Suspected hyperventilation by one doc, or dysfunction in the hyperthalmus-pituitary access by my M.E. doc she sees in other sufferers.
Tried everything! Zolpidem, valium, klonopin, melatonin, magnesium, passionflower, nytol, 5htp, handfuls of vitamins and minerals. None of these promote delta/stage 4 (non-dreamy) sleep for me, which I need to get at least a bit better. If anyone experienced this longterm grateful for advice.
Posted by ed_uk on June 7, 2005, at 8:31:49
In reply to Re: Klonopin, posted by honey on June 7, 2005, at 6:35:51
Hi!
>Two docs told me they were basically the same drug with same lifetime, although I admit I didn't check this.
Although zopiclone has a short half-life, it does have a longer half-life than zolpidem.
Ed.
Posted by honey on June 8, 2005, at 5:08:09
In reply to Re: Klonopin » honey, posted by ed_uk on June 7, 2005, at 8:31:49
> Although zopiclone has a short half-life, it does have a longer half-life than zolpidem.
>
> Ed.Ah, thanks, useful. My GP didn't know that.
This is the end of the thread.
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