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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by captain on August 26, 2004, at 13:33:45
I need some advice!
I have traveled extensively for business over the past 5 years but ever since 9/11 I have had horrible anxiety about flying. I had nightmares about planecrashes for the longest time and while those have gone away - I just DREAD getting on the plane. I worry about worrying about it!
I have 5 flights in SEPTEMBER ALONE! This is a very busy time for my company so it will only increase. I have xanax but because my doc is so stingy with it, I don't want to use it up for my flights in case I have anxiety attacks and need it for those. I would prefer to feel very loopy and not afraid - but awake on the plane. I don't know if that is possible without just getting drunk which is NOT an option!
My sister suggested printing out my itineraries and taking them to an urgent care type facility and explaining my anxiety over flying and see if they will give me something for each flight.
Do you guys have any suggestions? I will take my xanax if I have too but I am so afraid of running out of that and my doc not refilling when i really need it. I would rather suffer thru the plane rides!
Please give me some advice!
THANKS!
Captain
GAD, 28 year old female
Posted by h on August 26, 2004, at 15:29:29
In reply to I have to get on a PLANE!, posted by captain on August 26, 2004, at 13:33:45
I completely understand. I hate flying for the same reason.
1) Is it at all possible to get there anyway other than plane? (probably not, if there were you would have thought of it.)
2) What's with your doc and the xanax? I know sometimes I ask my oncologist for stuff when I can't get my reg. doc to give me what I know perfectly well I need/won't abuse. After 9/11 almost any reasonable doc in the country should understand how you feel and give you something for flying.
3) I know this sounds stupid but have you tried bringing a gameboy with you on the plane? I used to work with a woman who was terrified of flying and one of the other people we worked with stuck a gameboy in her hands just before takeoff. She played happily all the way to wherever. Worked like a charm.
best of luck to you.
I've noticed your posts before by the way. Like you I'm an exercise nut (spin class, rowing and weights before work each day) and on Lexapro. I understand not wanting to stay on it if you gained weight. How are you doing?
best
h
Posted by captain on August 26, 2004, at 15:40:31
In reply to Re: I have to get on a PLANE!, posted by h on August 26, 2004, at 15:29:29
Hi h! (sometimes i feel so funny with these name!) :)
Thank you for your response. I really appreciate it. I would LOVE to take another form of travel but it isn't possible. Especially because I am traveling with co-workers and we have to be there by certain times and prepare- and asking my boss to take a train and saying "see you in two days!" just wouldn't cut it! :)
My family doctor doesn't know a TON about my true anxiety history. I just started going to her in the last year and a half. All the years after college I would just go to an urgent care place if I was sick and then realized I should grow up and see a regular doc. But she seems very reluctant to give me the xanax. I called for a refill once and she made me come back in! I have a name and number for a pdoc, i just haven't set the appt yet. I need to do that as I think that whole situation would be much better.
I actually have taken my laptop before and watched movies on it during the plane ride. It definitely helped. I will need to remember to do that this time.
As far as the gaining weight goes - I don't think that my anxiety is enough for me to need the lexapro enough to deal with the weight gain. Maybe I will feel differently once I am off it completely, but I have decided to give BEING off of it the same amount of time I was on it. I figure it can take your body the same amount of time to adjust.
Did you not experience any weight gain at all? How long have you been on?
I have noticed that my body is particularly sensitive to any drugs that may induce weight gain. I don't take birth control pills for that very reason. Even on those low dose pills I pack on the weight!
Thanks again for your post!
Captain
Posted by krisdance83 on August 26, 2004, at 22:49:23
In reply to Re: I have to get on a PLANE!, posted by captain on August 26, 2004, at 15:40:31
Good luck girl!! The only thing in the world that seems to help me on a plane is Ativan. So I have no suggestions for you. Just popped in to wish you luck and tell you everything will be OK!!
Kristen :)
Posted by waki on August 27, 2004, at 3:32:32
In reply to Re: I have to get on a PLANE!, posted by krisdance83 on August 26, 2004, at 22:49:23
There were people in my anxiety recovery clinic with your problem.
I think you should try 30% Cognitive behavior change, 30% mental reprograming and 30% meds.
Your going to have to do research to learn more about what i mean but i will give you a couple tips.
1_ Think of best, worse and average case scenero on the plane. Your afraid of the worst. Really spend some time on thinking about the worse so that you don't ponder on it. Okay the plabe gets hijacked, you and the passengers will try and jump the terrorist and be heros. There will be no more 911. Wear some good kicking shoes, bring some fighting gloves, wear a pair of jeans.
2_ Look at all the flights each day, everyday that are successful. The odds are 99.9% in your favor an accident is more likely in a car then a plane.
3_ Do things to prepare for the flight. Perhaps go to the airport a few times a week. Walk on a high bridge and look down. Stay on top the news for terrorist threats. Tell you boss your not flying if we have a strong threat coded color.
4_ Learn breathing techniques
5_ Choose a breakfast of champion med.
6_ Go on the plane tired and nap.
7_ talk to people on the plane, observe the calmness of everyone.
8_Stay busy if your awake, listen to a CD. Burn a CD with MP3 that has 100 of your favorite songs. Or burn a self help advise on a CD and listen to it.
9_ The less you do it the more nervous you'll get. Remember Tom Cruise in Days of Thunder and Top Gun? Both movies he was afraid, and had to re-engage after an accident. You have to re-engage by engaging more. We are creatures of habit.
10_ Good luck :)
Posted by captain on August 27, 2004, at 9:35:27
In reply to Re: I have to get on a PLANE!, posted by waki on August 27, 2004, at 3:32:37
Thanks for all of the advice you guys!
It is weird that I am so afraid now after 4 years of non stop flying. Even though i KNOW a car is 10 times LESS safe - I still like the fact that I am controlling the car!
Waki - do you have any suggestions as to which meds to try and get? I am also setting up an appt with a pdoc. I have never been so hopefully it goes well!
Thanks again!
Captain
Posted by JenStar on August 27, 2004, at 11:20:04
In reply to I have to get on a PLANE!, posted by captain on August 26, 2004, at 13:33:45
hi Captain,
I'm sorry your doc is so stingy with flight meds!Here's what I did: I had a frank talk with my primary care and explained to her my flight issues. I told her that I usually end up drinking heavily and that once I took old Percocets from a sprained ankle (although this made me throw up.) I told her that I didn't want to abuse alcohol just to fly b/c it made me feel sick and gross and horrible and then the rest of the day was shot.
She seemed to understand, and gave me a prescription that included enough pills for the EXACT # of flites on my itinerary. I didn't have to show her the papers, I just told her "I'm flying to X with a stopover in Y, so I'll need 4 pills total to get there/back."
The first time I had to go into her office to do it, but since there she's been really cool. I just lv a message on the answering service saying something like "I have to fly 3 times this month, from X to Y and Z to A with a stopover in B, etc. I'll need 10 pills to get thru the trips."
And she now approves a prescription to the local Walgreens.
Lately I don't need this anymore but for a while it was imperative. I had a history of actually not getting onto a plane b/c I was so scared! (Oh yeah, I told her that too.)
I felt that in the beginning she probably had suspicions and wanted to be sure I wasn't going to get addicted. But I only ask for them when I'm flying and I think she trusts that I'm OK with them. I HAVE been going to her for years, though.
The idea of the clinic is good. Also, could you call your doc and just say, point blank, "I have serious issues that I haven't talked with you about before b/c I was nervous & embarrassed, but I'm ready to get drunk or do XXX" just to get thru this flite, and I don't plan on getting addicted, I just need a small amt of help." Maybe ask her for a small, specific # of pills like I do, for the exact # of flites?
Anyway, I hope that you get them. For me, HAVING them in hand is often enough and I don't need them -- just need to know they're waiting in my purse "just in case."
good luck! keep us updated.
JS
Posted by JenStar on August 27, 2004, at 11:30:41
In reply to Re: I have to get on a PLANE!, posted by waki on August 27, 2004, at 3:32:32
These are all GREAT suggestions. For me, it def. helped to focus and keep reminding myself that flying IS safe, it IS safe, it IS safe. I practiced breathing techniques and brought magazines/books/CD player along. I did crosswords.
I was also probably TOO hypervigilant (Is that person a terrorist? Hey, he's dressed weird. Why are those two whispering? Did that guy go to the bathroom already, like, five times? Is that suspicious?) and I had to make myself calm down.
I read some books on how to overcome flying fears (from the libe) and it was actually pretty helpful! Of course, my fears were of turbulence being linked to a crash; this was before 9/11 hit. So I don't know if the books would help that much.
It's weird b/c I can't explain exactly HOW I stopped being so scared. Captain, I was seriously to the point of getting off planes and taking trains/buses instead. But somehow I switched something over in my mind; it's like I said to myself: "You're making yourself ill, stop it." And I did. It sounds simple but it's like a miracle to me and I have no clue exactly how/why it was able to happen. If I knew, I could probably write about it and make a fortune teaching others! (I wish!)
I hope that happens for you, too.
Take care!
JenStar
> There were people in my anxiety recovery clinic with your problem.
>
> I think you should try 30% Cognitive behavior change, 30% mental reprograming and 30% meds.
>
> Your going to have to do research to learn more about what i mean but i will give you a couple tips.
>
> 1_ Think of best, worse and average case scenero on the plane. Your afraid of the worst. Really spend some time on thinking about the worse so that you don't ponder on it. Okay the plabe gets hijacked, you and the passengers will try and jump the terrorist and be heros. There will be no more 911. Wear some good kicking shoes, bring some fighting gloves, wear a pair of jeans.
>
> 2_ Look at all the flights each day, everyday that are successful. The odds are 99.9% in your favor an accident is more likely in a car then a plane.
>
> 3_ Do things to prepare for the flight. Perhaps go to the airport a few times a week. Walk on a high bridge and look down. Stay on top the news for terrorist threats. Tell you boss your not flying if we have a strong threat coded color.
>
> 4_ Learn breathing techniques
>
> 5_ Choose a breakfast of champion med.
>
> 6_ Go on the plane tired and nap.
>
> 7_ talk to people on the plane, observe the calmness of everyone.
>
> 8_Stay busy if your awake, listen to a CD. Burn a CD with MP3 that has 100 of your favorite songs. Or burn a self help advise on a CD and listen to it.
>
> 9_ The less you do it the more nervous you'll get. Remember Tom Cruise in Days of Thunder and Top Gun? Both movies he was afraid, and had to re-engage after an accident. You have to re-engage by engaging more. We are creatures of habit.
>
> 10_ Good luck :)
Posted by sobstory on August 27, 2004, at 11:45:03
In reply to Re: Thanks!, posted by captain on August 27, 2004, at 9:35:27
I get super nervous on planes too. I take Gravol and it takes away nausea from nervousness and motion sickness, plus it puts you to sleep. You get wierd dreams, but it relaxes you. I take two gravol about an hour before the flight and they kick in just before take off. Don't drink alcohol while on meds, not a good idea! I always find I'm sooo nervous at take off, and for about an hour or two afterwards. Then I've had a chance to sleep and doze, and watch a little of the movie, and then I'm pretty calm. I'm calm during the landing, and am not scared at all! I actually love landing, but I think it's because I know we are going to be on the ground soon and that I made it! I'm always so proud of myself after each flight that I was just fine, nothing happened, I wasn't ill, and telling myself, "See? Everything was just fine! WHY do you get so worked up?" I also think my body is so programmed to be scared of flying that even if I'm not scared, my body goes into panic/nervous mode. I've flown so many times, I've lost count. I've been to Europe and all over Canada, Mexico, but each time I board that plane, my heart is pounding! Phobias are such a wierd thing, and it amazes me how much they can control me, even though I completely know and understand that there is nothing to be afraid of. Well, if you think about it, it's not natural for people to be able to fly, to be in a tube at 30,000 feet in the sky, travelling 500 miles per hour, so the fear is purely biological. But the reality is, it's perfectly safe and you don't feel like you're going that fast. Plus if you let it, it can be relaxing. Sitting in a chair, watching a movie, dim lights, being served by flight attendants who are always friendly, the view down below. If only I could see it that way all the time!
> Thanks for all of the advice you guys!
>
> It is weird that I am so afraid now after 4 years of non stop flying. Even though i KNOW a car is 10 times LESS safe - I still like the fact that I am controlling the car!
>
> Waki - do you have any suggestions as to which meds to try and get? I am also setting up an appt with a pdoc. I have never been so hopefully it goes well!
>
> Thanks again!
> Captain
Posted by Starlight on August 27, 2004, at 12:05:03
In reply to Re: I have to get on a PLANE!, posted by captain on August 26, 2004, at 15:40:31
Can you take klonopin instead?
Posted by h on August 27, 2004, at 13:07:58
In reply to Re: I have to get on a PLANE!, posted by captain on August 26, 2004, at 15:40:31
Captain
hi there!
Haven't gained weight yet. I don't usually but just to be sure I've upped my workouts to five hours of cardio a week. (from about 3.5-4)
I have been taking lexapro since beginning of May. I confess I've been paying particular attention to your posts because we sound like we have a similar body type/workout schedule.
Hoping all goes well with you, and flying. As I said, if I were you I'd look into getting a new dr. Doesn't have to be a pdoc, just somebody who is less suspicious of your perfectly reasonable fear of flying.
best
h
Posted by waki on August 27, 2004, at 13:37:48
In reply to great advice from Waki :) » waki, posted by JenStar on August 27, 2004, at 11:30:41
Turbulence is an excellent reason to become anxious, but allow me to share a secret with you.
When I flew my first flight I was nervous as heck with the turbulence.
A few years later I landed a job at Boeing Aerospeace company testing jets.
We had this wind tunnel, I kid you not I saw wings on a jet deflect at least 10 feet up and down. Whats my point? Well first of all turblence is not going to break the plane. The wing is part of the plane in which the part you sit in does not connect the wing but more or less allws the wing through it. So you see the wing wont break.
The next part of turbulence that makes people nervous is the plane flying out of control. Another quick story. There was this flyboy who tested jets at boeing. This guy was an ex fighter jockey. Well he was testing the E6A which is a Navy Boeing 707. Four monster GE cfm56 engines. This guy Barrel rolled the 707. Thats right! He completely rotated it 360 degrees. The president of Boing was going to fire this pilot. The navy ordered several of them after they say the test. The pilot was then given high honors and asked not to do it again.
Whats my point? It is darn near pyhsically impossible to drop a plane out of the sky from turbulence.
Are you afraid of an engine blowing out? Have no fear these monsters of the airways are designed to fly on 1 engine.
Afraid of some new pilot fresh out of school? Don't worry about this, you see anybody can fly a jet, its landing and taking off thats the tricky part. If your going to worry, worry about only taking off and landing (which is really no big deal).
I'm telling you all this because you need to have confidence in the equipment, people and airlines you are flying.
I have a personal preference to fly Boeing planes over the European Airbus. I'll pass on the "fly by wire plane" and take a "good ole hydraulic component" anyday; but thats me.
My point on this is if you want to feel safer, ask about the plane. Tell your agent you demand a Boeing. Choose an airline with a good maintainence record. Even though the FAA oversees all preventitive maintainence schedules it may make you feel safer to fly a United over a Economy Hooters jet.
Terrorist safety? You know the answer to that. Those knuckle heads will try something different. I think all airlines learned their lesson.
I did not mean to give a dissertation on air planes, but the last thing any of you people need to worry about is the planes safety in the air.
Worry about how your going to get healthy. Worry about which meds should you take next. Worry about world peace or world hungar. Please don't worry about the plane or the flight.
ok?
cheers M8's
Posted by waki on August 27, 2004, at 13:51:30
In reply to I have to get on a PLANE!, posted by captain on August 26, 2004, at 13:33:45
Here is a fabulous list. Take it to your p-doc and start trialing these gorgous gems!
BENZODIAZEPINES
alprazolam (Xanax) panic, generalized anxiety, phobias, social phobias
clonazepam (Klonopin) panic, phobias, social phobia
diazepam (Valium) generalized anxiety, panic, phobiaslorazepam (Ativan) generalized anxiety, panic, phobias
oxazepam (Serax) generalized anxiety, phobias
chlordiazepoxide (Librium) generalized anxiety, phobias
BETA BLOCKERS
propranolol (Inderal) social phobia
atenolol (Tenormin) social phobiaTRICYCLIC ANTIDEPRESSANTS
imipramine (Tofranil) panic, depression, generalized anxietydesipramine (Norpramin, Pertofrane and others) panic, depression
nortriptyline (Aventyl or Pamelor) panic, depression
amitriptyline (Elavil) panic, depression
doxepin (Sinequan or Adapin) panic, depression
clomipramine (Anafranil) panic, OCD, depression
trazodone (Desyrel) depression, generalized anxiety
venlafaxine (Effexor) OCD, depression, social anxiety, generalized anxiety
MONOAMINE OXIDASE INHIBITORS (MAOIs)
phenelzine (Nardil) panic, social phobia, depressiontranylcypromine (Parnate) panic, depression
SELECTIVE SEROTONIN REUPTAKE INHIBITORS (SSRIs)
fluoxetine (Prozac) OCD, depression, panic, social phobiafluvoxamine (Luvox) OCD, depression, panic, social phobia
sertraline (Zoloft) OCD, depression, panic, social phobia
paroxetine (Paxil) OCD, depression, panic, social phobia
escitalopram oxalate (Lexapro) depression, generalized anxiety, social anxiety
citalopram (Celexa) depression, OCD, panic
MILD TRANQUILIZER
buspirone (BuSpar) generalized anxiety, OCDANTICONVULSANT
Valproate (Depakote) panic
Lamictal (mood stabilizer)
Hmmmm I'm hungry.....
Maybe Dexadrene for dessert??????????????????? :P
Posted by captain on August 27, 2004, at 15:14:39
In reply to Re: Anxiety medications (Take your pick!), posted by waki on August 27, 2004, at 13:51:30
Ok you guys totally rock! I love you all!
I was thinking more about it, and you know what? I actually worry more the entire time leading up to my flight than I actually do on the plane. I HATE take off, I love landing because I can see the ground and know I am almost there. Once we are in flight going smoothly, I am SO much better. I just stress KNOWING I have to get on one soon.
I just found out today that another one has been added to my roster, so now I have six flights total in SEPTEMBER! I am sure after the first two I will be so busy that I won't have time to think about it!
Thanks so much you guys! I already feel a ton better - especially after Waki's post on the actual planes!
Captain
Posted by captain on August 27, 2004, at 15:17:06
In reply to Re: I have to get on a PLANE! » captain, posted by JenStar on August 27, 2004, at 11:20:04
Jen - you crack me up! My brain works the same way! I check out everyone on the plane and every little move I picture us falling out of the sky!
My other odd neurosis is that I look around at people coming back from vacations, or with babies, and I think what a tragedy it would be if this plane went down and then I go down some horrible road mentally from there!
How are you doing? I know you are tapering off...so write back soon!
Captain
Posted by waki on August 27, 2004, at 16:35:17
In reply to Re: I have to get on a PLANE! ?? Jen Star, posted by captain on August 27, 2004, at 15:17:06
Captain,
dumb me just now thought about your name "captain",
Did you make up this name particularly for this question?
There's no way your a pilot.
fill me in :)
PS: Now that we sold you on flying and flying more often. You have to share all those freqient flier miles you receive with us won't you?
Posted by karen m. on August 28, 2004, at 22:15:39
In reply to I have to get on a PLANE!, posted by captain on August 26, 2004, at 13:33:45
i see your questions have been very well addressed by all the replies. i need to add that i was like you (xx5) last week and had to fly to washington for the weekend. i would simply like to repeat/reinforce the suggestions you have received regarding making sure you have the appropriated xanax dosage on hand. I think you got some super ideas and recommendations. I know that i'd be making plans to ship my furniture out here because i couldn't get back on the plane Monday to get home if i didn't have my xanax.
the suggestions i received on my similar post gave me some great input on how to position my mind (and my xanax) while onboard. fortunately i had an aisle seat and took the meds 1/2 hour before boarding. great combination.
good luck to you !!!
Posted by captain on August 29, 2004, at 11:00:49
In reply to Re: Captain, posted by waki on August 27, 2004, at 16:35:17
Hey Waki!
Funny question! I never even thought about my name being captain and the whole flying conversation. :) I am certainly not a pilot of any sort! My name is Tennille so I get the captain joke a lot! :)I am flying out on thursday - so it is almost here!
I have so many frequent flier miles from the last few years, it is nice to finally be using them!
Thanks again for all of the advice!
Captain
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