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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 6 of 6. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by DMC on December 10, 2001, at 23:14:21
I've seen some interest in these types of articles which apparently need increased exposure.
Posted by cmcdougall on December 11, 2001, at 10:01:07
In reply to I just stumbled accross another good article, posted by DMC on December 10, 2001, at 23:14:21
> I've seen some interest in these types of articles which apparently need increased exposure.
>
> http://enw.org/Research-SSRI.htmI just went through HORRIBLE withdrawal from EffexorXR. I took 300mg for about 18 months. Over 4 weeks I slowly decreased the Effexor while slowly adding Celexa. I ended up having a complete "nervous breakdown". Non-stop SEVERE headaches, jitters, crying, body aches, and on and on. This lasted about 6 weeks and it was hell. I eventually ended up in the hospital psych ward.
Definately, more information needs to be given to doctors and patients about the potential danger of SSRI withdrawal. AND, I think much more attention needs to be paid when patients are coming off these powerful drugs. I would have appreciated knowing what to expect, and maybe my poor husband wouldn't have been so freaked out.
I'm new to this board and really love it. Thank you all.
Carly
Posted by Bob on December 11, 2001, at 13:57:26
In reply to verrrry interrrresting...., posted by cmcdougall on December 11, 2001, at 10:01:07
Carly:
I experienced Effexor withdrawal in '95... when nobody realized how nasty it was. I too had been on it for about 18 months. I had previously experienced a nasty withdrawal from Anafranil, so I knew what was going on. However, I never could have guessed how protractive and severe it would be. I literally took months (3-6?) to get completely off the med, and at the end I was practically taking little tiny wisps of the stuff. I stop trying to convince the doctors.
Recently, I went to Hopkins for a consultation about my problems, and I mentioned what I had to do to get off Effexor. They said they knew that there was withdrawal, but thought that "months" was unnecessarily long. The fact is, you can never know unless you've been through it.
The doctors still don't understand the physical toll of the meds, and I think it will be a long time coming. Think about it: if you went to med school and they "taught" you everything about how these meds make you feel (both therapeutically and side-effects), would you understand? I've taken them, and sometimes I'm at a loss for words. How will they ever understand?
On the other hand, we have to work with the tools available to us.
Posted by IsoM on December 11, 2001, at 14:52:36
In reply to Re: verrrry interrrresting...., posted by Bob on December 11, 2001, at 13:57:26
Interesting that you took months to finally get off the med. I did too (it was Paxil) but no doctor thought it would be necessary to prolong it that much but by taking smaller & smaller doses, it made the withdrawal slightly more tolerable. I spent most of the summer in bed afraid to move for fear my head was going to disconnect from my body. I found that only by remaining absolutely still, the nausea & vertigo was bearable. When I had enough emotional energy to care about anything, I lamented my beautiful garden I'd built up previously, dying & drying up.
The idea of driving to a doctor was out of the question, just walking about slowly made me want to die. One friend just couldn't take it anymore & found a local doctor & took me to him, not that he understood the withdrawal but he was/is a good doctor otherwise.
I honestly think that it changed the way my brain operates forever. Even though I'm on different meds now that work very well - emotionally, I'm doing great! BUT my head has never returned to feeling normal for me. I still get feeligs of vertigo now whenever I turn my head fairly quickly or when I bend over a bit. I still get the weird small brain zaps, though the electric current feels turned way down but I still hate these feelings. It's been about two years now with this, but who knows? - maybe eventually I'll go back to "normal". At least my mood is good so I'll simply live with it & do my best to ignore it.
> I experienced Effexor withdrawal in '95... when nobody realized how nasty it was. I too had been on it for about 18 months. I had previously experienced a nasty withdrawal from Anafranil, so I knew what was going on. However, I never could have guessed how protractive and severe it would be. I literally took months (3-6?) to get completely off the med, and at the end I was practically taking little tiny wisps of the stuff. I stop trying to convince the doctors.
>
> Recently, I went to Hopkins for a consultation about my problems, and I mentioned what I had to do to get off Effexor. They said they knew that there was withdrawal, but thought that "months" was unnecessarily long. The fact is, you can never know unless you've been through it.
>
> The doctors still don't understand the physical toll of the meds, and I think it will be a long time coming. Think about it: if you went to med school and they "taught" you everything about how these meds make you feel (both therapeutically and side-effects), would you understand? I've taken them, and sometimes I'm at a loss for words. How will they ever understand?
>
> On the other hand, we have to work with the tools available to us.
Posted by Bob on December 11, 2001, at 15:33:14
In reply to Re: verrrry interrrresting.... » Bob, posted by IsoM on December 11, 2001, at 14:52:36
IsoM:
I think scenarios such as the ones you and I describe are being played out all over the country everyday. I don't think people want to believe it when you tell them. I too spent a LOT of time in bed when I came off Effexor. I was worse physically than I'd ever been in my life.
It's not surprising to me that you think it has permanently changed you. I have often had this feeling with every major drug I've tried: Anafranil, Effexor, Depakote/Welbutrin, and Topomax. Especially Topomax. I'm still waiting for the day they find out these things effect extremely long term (almost permanent) changes in certain portions of the population. I won't be suprised if studies start showing up like that one day. My theory is that these drugs are especially effective for reasonably healthy people who experience exogenously generated depression and get it treated quickly. Endogenous cases are much more complicated since the underlying biology was not right to begin with. For a person like this, the destabilization of withdrawing from these drugs is quite destructive. Even if it doesn't last forever... how many people can get through it without additional pharmacological help? It's worse than many cases of depression themselves.
Once again, though, many cannot survive without the meds, so it seems like we're pretty much stuck.
Posted by IsoM on December 11, 2001, at 16:03:49
In reply to Re: verrrry interrrresting...., posted by Bob on December 11, 2001, at 15:33:14
It does seem like we're stuck, doesn't it?
I've been on different antidepressants for 15 years now. Started with good ol' Impramine & kept progressing(?). I honestly think my head's been screwy with all my life & as I got older & faced various testing stresses, things just became more obvious. Just a few years ago in talking with my Mom, I found out that my father dusted our vegetable garden every summer from before I was born till after it was illegal to buy DDT. The build-up of DDT in the soil & in the plants must have had some effects on me. I know my two brothers are fruity as fruit cakes but totally ignore their symptoms.
I've read about the effects DDT & other endocrine disruptors have on a person & wonder if many of my problems aren't related to that & my genetic disposition. Doctors have always been so surprised att how my reflexes work. When they tap my knee, I practically kick them in the "balls". One doctor said I had the most hyper reflex reactions he's ever seen.
And like a good Mom, I nursed my three sons for a long time & of course, passed the DDT in my body to theirs through the fat in my milk. My three sons all have problems too they're struggling to deal with..
Well, at least my thinking mind works well. I just look at my strengths & gain the insight to overlook other's weaknesses & look for their strengths too. In reading a post on the Social Pyscho-Babble & listening to fellow co-workers, it's so sad how little people will talk about other's strengths. They seem too focused on weaknesses. I try to do my small bit of good by bringing out the good points of others. I'll acknowledge they have weaknesses but try to encourage others by highlighting good points. It's so stupid that even if people think someone has good points, they don't talk about that but will gossip about their weaknesses instead.
I better stop before Dr. Bob switches this over to the other forum.
> I think scenarios such as the ones you and I describe are being played out all over the country everyday. I don't think people want to believe it when you tell them. I too spent a LOT of time in bed when I came off Effexor. I was worse physically than I'd ever been in my life.
>
> It's not surprising to me that you think it has permanently changed you. I have often had this feeling with every major drug I've tried: Anafranil, Effexor, Depakote/Welbutrin, and Topomax. Especially Topomax. I'm still waiting for the day they find out these things effect extremely long term (almost permanent) changes in certain portions of the population. I won't be suprised if studies start showing up like that one day. My theory is that these drugs are especially effective for reasonably healthy people who experience exogenously generated depression and get it treated quickly. Endogenous cases are much more complicated since the underlying biology was not right to begin with. For a person like this, the destabilization of withdrawing from these drugs is quite destructive. Even if it doesn't last forever... how many people can get through it without additional pharmacological help? It's worse than many cases of depression themselves.
>
> Once again, though, many cannot survive without the meds, so it seems like we're pretty much stuck.
This is the end of the thread.
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